The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Books
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts


 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Prev Previous Post   Next Post Next
Old 01-01-2018, 03:37 PM   #7
Formendacil
Dead Serious
 
Formendacil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Perched on Thangorodrim's towers.
Posts: 3,328
Formendacil is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Formendacil is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Formendacil is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Formendacil is lost in the dark paths of Moria.
Send a message via AIM to Formendacil Send a message via MSN to Formendacil
Pipe

I am going to disagree with the letter of Master Kuruharan's reply--but perhaps in doing so, I shall be agreeing with him in spirit.

I'll start by acknowledging that there's a wide range amongst the servants of Morgoth listed--a Balrog is an incarnate Maiar whereas we know almost nothing about a vampire, but it seems reasonable to say they are not comparable in might. To compare all these disparate beings to the servants of Sauron is like comparing apples and the entire produce department.

That said, it is a worthwhile point, I think, to note that the Nazgűl really are the only creations of Sauron, whereas Morgoth produced many sorts of servants. This points to the ultimate disparity between them, and it is this disparity of potency that I think underlies Kuruharan's firm assertion that there is no context here.

My personal thought, however, is that the Nazgűl might actually have been as terrifying as the creatures of Morgoth, because unlike the creatures of Morgoth, terror is their primary power. This got touched on in a recent argument here (the resurrection of the Female Nazgűl? question), where Huinesoron argues that martial prowess is not the chief purpose of the Nazgűl, making the point we do not generally see them take the field in battle.

This argument (not necessarily the conclusion that there ARE female Nazgűl) makes sense to me, and I think it applies here: FEAR is the main overt power of the Nazgűl. Think of Sauron's use of them during the Siege of Minas Tirith: to overwhelm the city's morale by their presence.

In other words, I think that the terror of the Nazgűl might well match that of something like a Balrog, because where for the Balrog terror is a side-effect of its dread form and demonic might, terror is the primary effect of a Nazgűl. This shows the lesser stature of their creator. Morgoth doesn't focus on creating something that will wreak havoc on emotions: he creates something that will wreak havoc on matter--the terror comes from knowing and sensing that might. Sauron, being substantially weaker, DOES focus on terrorizing emotions.



(Of course, this entire post is avoiding the subject of whether Morgoth--or Sauron--can actually create anything. Suffice it to say that where I use the word "create" or imply something like it, I am using it most imprecisely.)

EDIT: Crossposted with Inziladun.
__________________
I prefer history, true or feigned.

Last edited by Formendacil; 01-01-2018 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Indicate cross-posting.
Formendacil is offline   Reply With Quote
 


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:12 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.