How does Earendil speak Beorian?

[Huinesoron]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Maybe that's the new question: did Elwing know Beorian, and if so, then how.

If I remember correctly, both Earendil and Elwing were kids when their respective kingdoms fell and they were sped away to the Havens. Elwing lived in the same Havens aa Earendil, with the same presumed Mannish refugees. Why would she not also learn at least a bit about her mortal side of the family while living there? Earendil might have learned Beorian independently or after meeting Elwing, but Elwing did not learn because of Earendil - she should have been flocked by the remaining Beorians. Of course they might have been speaking Sindarin when addressing her, but she would have been at the very least aware of the existence of their language.

What am I missing? Why would she discover the language from Earendil, when she could easily (re)discover it directly?

Elwing was about three, Earendil about ten (always "about", because Tolkien's timelines were in flux and quite old). If the NoME stuff about half-elven aging is accurate, we'd expect them both to be small for their age, but advanced - maybe Elwing is cognitively a five year old, Earendil perhaps fifteen.

So Earendil has good memories of Gondolin. His mother-tongue is Quenya, and Tuor would definitely have taught him North Sindarin (they expected to have to evacuate the city, after all). Did Tuor know Hadorian? Maybe, if his foster-father taught him. He would definitely know Easterling (he was a slave for four years), but it's anyone's guess whether the enslaved population of Dor-lomin were allowed to use Sindarin, Hadorian, or neither.

It's even possible that Tuor learnt 'proper' Hadorian only in Gondolin! Pengolodh the Loremaster lived there, and it's impossible to believe he wouldn't have had Hurin and Huor teach him their language. How excited he must have been to have a new speaker show up after all those years - and, frankly, how much more excited to realise he needed to teach Tuor, not the other way round.

Elwing would have a child's grasp of Doriathrin Sindarin. She would have at least a little Beorian, because we know Dior spoke it - at the least, he'd use endearments and idioms that didn't translate. With no other Beorian speakers in Doriath, would he have deliberately raised Elwing and her brothers to use it? Maybe. But it would still be a second language, and she wouldn't have much.

In the Havens... in that quote I was building off the idea that Earendil picked Beorian up deliberately from Nargothrondrim sailors over from Balar. Elwing wouldn't have much reason to talk to sailors, and they wouldn't be using it themselves - Earendil would have to seek them out.

But, the source actually says that the Atani "still used their Mannish speeches", so that's out, and Form is right - there are Men at the Mouths of Sirion. Given the plural of 'speeches', that must include both Hadorians and Beorings - quite possibly even elders who were among the evacuees of Dorthonion as children. It was only about 50 years between the Bragollach and Elwing's arrival at the Havens, a peer of Rian and Morwen could easily still be alive. The Beorian family tree in HoME XI was amended to give Beleth, Beren's first cousin, unspecified descendents - and even more intriguingly, it gives Beren himself a sister, Hiril. Her children, if she had any, could easily still be alive, though they'd probably be too young to remember Beren himself.

Long story short: yes, Elwing would have encountered Beorian around the Havens, and probably had fairly close relatives among the mortals living there. Earendil will have to find some other way to win her heart.

hS