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Old 06-14-2003, 11:54 AM   #29
Amarie of the Vanyar
Wight
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Valinor
Posts: 215
Amarie of the Vanyar has just left Hobbiton.
Sting

Quote:
"Elves are able of seeing the inner thoughts of people (remember Galadriel) much faster than we are; and probably they can distinguish this 'inner beauty' at first sight."
Given the way they fall for the blandishments of Morgoth and Sauron I kind of doubt that.
In Osanwe-Kenta it is said that elves can read other minds but also that any mind can set a barrier that prevents any other mind from accessing it. In my opinion, when Tolkien says that Morgoth and Sauron had a fair appearance, what he means is that they were able to hide their inner thoughts to Eldar, Valar and Maiar; not that they looked like Brad Pitt [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]. And vice versa, when Tolkien explains that at some moment they both lost their ability to have a fair appearance, what he means is that they lost the capacity of hidding their inner being to others.

In Osanwe-Kenta, Morgoth's tactics (which can also be applied to Sauron's behaviuor), are also explained, and they were mainly based on the use of a powerful language rather than on showing a beautiful face:

Quote:
His thought was ever the same, though varied to suit each case (so far as he understood it): he was above all benevolent; he was rich and could give any gift that they desired to his friends; he had a special love for the one that he addressed; but he must be trusted. (...) And this weapon he found in "language". (...) "Alas!" says Pengolodh, "in Valinor Melkor used the Quenya with such mastery that all the Eldar were amazed, for his use could not be bettered, scarce equalled even, by the poets and the loremasters".
Osanwe-Kenta
To sum up, I agree with Finwe in thinking that what atracted Celebrimbor to Sauron was the knowledge he thought he could obtain from him, rather than his physical appearance, because Celebrimbor (and the other elves of Eregion) believed Sauron's lies:

Quote:
But Sauron had better fortune with the Noldor of Eregion and especially with Celebrimbor, who desired in his heart to rival the skill and frame of Fëanor (...)
In Eregion Sauron posed as an emissary of the Valar , sent by them to Middle-Earth (...) or ordered by them to remain there to give aid to the Elves.
History of Galadriel and Celebrimbor, UT
And I also agree with you, Morwen, I don´t think that elves are perfect, of course, they are made of the matter of Marred Arda, like men [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

In my opinion, Tolkien uses the 'love of beauty' in a kind of 'theological' sense: it reflects the longing of the Children of Ilúvatar (Men and Elves) for the world that must have be (Arda Unmarred) and is not. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
__________________
But it is said that not until that hour had such cold thoughts ruled Finrod; for indeed she whom he had loved was Amarië of the Vanyar, and she went not with him into exile.
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