Annoying Unbelievers

[Lachwen]

The one I get all the time is "Why didn't Gandalf just blast the Ring?" And the ever-present "Why didn't Gandalf kill Sauron?" And when I try to explain to them the Valar's ban on the Istari challenging Sauron with open show of force, they just get confused and angry, like Homer Simpson when he doesn't understand.

But the greatest was the argument I got into with a random person in front of the theater once... He was talking about how hardcore Arwen was, "You know she drowned the Ringwraiths!" And when I told him that Arwen at the Fords was just a product of Peter Jackson's imagination and it was really Glorfindel who saved Frodo at the Fords...sweet angry Jeebus, I thought he was going to punch me in the face.

[Morsul the Dark]

Well one question that arose was "If the ring attracts Sauron when someone wears it why don't they detect it when Bilbo has t or Gollum?" and I relized I don't know the answer but if someone tells me I'
ll try not be an annoying unbeliever.

and secondly I'll admit before I came to this site I'd probably be considered an annoying non-believr I thought I knew everything then I came here and learned I knew very little

[Encaitare]

Someone actually posed the "Why don't the eagles drop the Ring into Mount Doom?" question to me, and I actually went "hm.... that might have worked..." but then decided the slow way is far more fun for us to read about, and the eagles probably wouldn't have done it anyway. As someone stated earlier, they are their own noble race and aren't at anyone else's beck and call.

Morsul, I know exactly how you feel. In my circle of friends I probably know the most about LotR, but here there are so many people who know so much more. Someday, I too shall be this knowledgable... I hope

[ohtatyaro]

Maybe ring affects eagels too? I mean, they are afraid to take it as Gandalf was?

For Sauron I think i know the answer - Sauron attracted the ring mroe when he was strong and the ring was near, roght? Gollum was far away under the mountains, and Sauron was very very weak then,. He only started to get strong when ring was with Frodo, and than Frodo started to go to Mordor. And when he was near Mordor, Sauron was already very strong, so it was easier for him to sense the ring.

[Morgul Queen]

Gandalf is one of the messabgers of the Valar, they have forbidden him to directly oppose Sauron. This means that he can't face Sauron one on one as that was the task of the free peoples of Middle-earth, he can, however, advise, manipulate and wheedle the others into doing the job.

Gandalf was send as an advisor, not as a warrior.

Second, the eagles are the birds of Manwe, hence they would not interfere if he asked them not to.

Third, none of Tolkien's characters are flat. To use Denethor, son of Ecthelion as an example, he was the last ruling steward of Gondor, driven mad by the knowledge of what Sauron intended for Gondor and the lies he was fed via the Palantir.

To go back to when Denethor was younger, as the heir of the reigning steward he was supposed to be Captain of Gondor, by Thorongil, Aragorn who had come to the city of Minas Tirith in disguise to serve under Ecthelion, was given this post instead.

If this wasn't enough, not only did the people of Gondor like Thorongil more than Denethor, his own father did as well. Poor, bitter Denethor was basically given the impression that he couldn't be trusted to defend his city.

When Ecthelion died and Denethor became steward, he began to use the Palantir to keep an eye on his neighbour to the East and his doings. While he was eventually driven mad by the visions he was given, he did manage to keep Minas Tirith whole and well while being the closest realm to Mordor and the most hated as well. He would have face multiple, repeated attacks upon the city and surrounding lands. To have kept his people alive for so long is no mean feat.

Denethor married the daughter of the Prince of Dol Amroth, Finduilas, Imrahil's sister. They had two sons, Boromir and Faramir, before she died.

Not only burdened with the lossof his wife and the grief of his family, he would have had to keep a lookout for Gondor as well. That would take an enormous amount of energy, leaving him wide open to Sauron's mental attacks.

I will pause for a moment in my fangirly defense of my most beloved character to say this - even Galadriel was corrupted to some degree by mental attacks by Sauron, for him to have lasted this long with no spouse to support him and no Ring to protect his land is nothing short of amazing.

Finally succoming to madness, at the moment of the last attack was noting short of a tragedy, but it is understandable. he had just lost both of his sons, while we learn later that Faramir isn't dead, Denethor doesn't know this.

In short, Denethor is a marvellously layered character, with weaknesses, strengths and a good spoonful of humanity thrown in as well.

in Tolkien, what is not said can convey more than is said, but I'm leaving the Celeborn defense to Marnie, she's better suited to it.

Morgy, gone completely OT but doesn't care.

[Encaitare]

Ohtatyaro said:

Maybe ring affects eagels too? I mean, they are afraid to take it as Gandalf was?

Hmm, that's possible. *ponders* Well, the eagles are certainly sentient beings, so I guess there's no reason why it wouldn't affect them like it would any other race. They all just seem so noble and untouchable, though.

[Morsul the Dark]

Originally Posted by Encaitare

Ohtatyaro said:



Hmm, that's possible. *ponders* Well, the eagles are certainly sentient beings, so I guess there's no reason why it wouldn't affect them like it would any other race. They all just seem so noble and untouchable, though.

and thats one reason they wouldn't take the ring eeven such an important task is not worthy of such nobel creatures also eagles are far more noticeable than a fellowship of nine