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Old 09-16-2004, 08:02 AM   #1
Son of Númenor
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The 'true purpose' of the Fellowship was to destroy the Ring. Gandalf knew that it was a hopeless task, but knew equally well that it was the best alternative - the others being to hide it somewhere and let it lie until it was found generations later and Sauron was able to regain it; to slip it on his finger and declare open war on Sauron; or to send it over the sea and hope against hope that it would be hidden there forever - or that the Valar would accept it. The only hope of the people of Middle-earth was in the destruction of the Ring - even if they had hidden it, Sauron would have been strong enough to defeat the Free Peoples of Middle-earth (they won the War of the Ring only because Sauron was destroyed), Likewise, the only hope in destroying the Ring was in taking it secretly to Mordor - an open assault on Sauron's realm with the purpose of winning a path to Mount Doom was pure folly. And, since it was already known to Gandalf that no one can destroy the Ring of his own free will, who better to take it than the one who bore it all the way from the Shire to Rivendell, and indeed for seventeen years before that? After the decision was made and the Fellowship was formed - a group of of keen thinkers, keen fighters and friends of the Ringbearer, representative of all the Free People - Gandalf had only, as The Saucepan Man said, to trust in providence.
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Old 09-16-2004, 12:56 PM   #2
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1420!

Firefoot:
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Bilbo did not use the Ring with the intention to dominate others, which also slowed his corruption.
I think another reason why Bilbo was able to resist and give it up, after 60 years of having it, was because he wasn't aware of the Ring's power. Frodo was aware of The Ring as "evil" and "never put it on," he was aware it needed to be destroyed for Sauron to be defeated, and of course his trek to Mount Doom would also eat away at him. Where as Bilbo, Bilbo used it and saw the Ring as a present, and used it to play pranks, or hide from people, he wasn't aware of The Ring's "evil" so therefor it didn't effect him as much as it did Frodo.
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Old 09-16-2004, 02:12 PM   #3
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But if you re-read it, it actually says only Gandalf had a chance of defeating Sauron 1v1 with the Ring.
No. The letter reads-
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Of the others only Gandalf might be expected to master him - being an emissary of the Powers and a creature of the same order, an immortal spirit taking a visible physical form. In the "Mirror of Galadriel", it appears that Galadriel conceived of herself as capable of wielding the Ring and supplanting the Dark Lord. IF so, so also were the other guardians of the Three, especially Elrond. But this is another matter. It was part of the essential deceit of the Ring to fill minds with imaginations of supreme power. But this the Great had well considered and had rejected, as is seen in Elrond's words at the Council. Galadriel's rejection of the temptation was founded upon previous thought and resolve. In any case Elrond or Galadriel would have proceeded in the policy now adopted by Sauron: they would have built up an empire with great and absolutely subservient generals and armies and engines of war, until they could challenge Sauron and destroy him by force.
That's the section that discusses people's military chances against Sauron (not one on one chances), and as you can see it says "only Gandalf might be expected to master Sauron", and it also suggests that Galadriel thought she could supplant Sauron because "It was part of the essential deceit of the Ring" (ie she really couldn't).

It says what policy Elrond and Galadriel would attempt to follow but Tolkien obviously doubts their chances of success. Not to mention that destroying Sauron's armies and such still wouldn't destroy Sauron. You'd still have to destroy the Ring. The only way you would pursue the policy "use the Ring and destroy Sauron by military force" is if you believed that you would be able to remain uncorrupted and destroy the Ring when it was all over.

This, I believe, is what Boromir wanted and what I probably would've tried. That way I would be trusting in my own ability to resist the Ring rather than trusting in a hobbit to do something that was logically impossible. Sure, it would've failed, but at the time it would've seemed like a better idea than what they actually did.

Anyway, the stuff about confronting Sauron one on one is after the part that I posted above-
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Confrontation of Sauron alone, unaided, self to self, was not contemplated.
Then it gives a hypothetical Gandalf vs Sauron situation, but the others (Elrond, Galadriel, etc) are not even mentioned. Their chances of success one on one are not even addressed (other than where it says it "was not contemplated", ie they didn't have enough of a chance to even try thinking about it).
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Old 09-16-2004, 11:21 PM   #4
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After the decision was made and the Fellowship was formed - a group of of keen thinkers, keen fighters and friends of the Ringbearer, representative of all the Free People - Gandalf had only, as The Saucepan Man said, to trust in providence.
Somehow, SoN, this makes me think of an alchemist pouring the required ingredients into an alembic and then allowing the little understood "force of Providence" work it into the Philosopher's Stone. Perhaps Gandalf was simply following an old Maia recipe!

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I think another reason why Bilbo was able to resist and give it up, after 60 years of having it, was because he wasn't aware of the Ring's power.
Boromir88, if we were to follow this line of reasoning to its conclusion, Smeagol should not have been corrupted either, and yet he was--almost instantly. I think Firefoot hit the hobbit on the head with this one. so to speak!

Cheers!
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Old 09-17-2004, 01:41 PM   #5
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Perhaps Gandalf was simply following an old Maia recipe!
Indeed, I believe that recipe calls for plenty of stirring. And one mustn't forget to kindle a fire.
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Old 09-17-2004, 04:36 PM   #6
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1420! An explanation

Lyta

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Boromir88, if we were to follow this line of reasoning to its conclusion, Smeagol should not have been corrupted either, and yet he was--almost instantly.
An explanation to that would be, Gollum was corrupted from the start. The Ring attacked Gollum's weakness, and made Gollum kill to get it. Where Bilbo, Bilbo was a lot kinder of heart, which is why he doesn't kill Gollum over it. Although, we do see a bit of the "nasty" Bilbo side, but still, doesn't kill in order to keep, or gain the ring.
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