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Old 05-19-2005, 06:05 AM   #1
Tuor of Gondolin
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As for the Blue Wizards, I'm not all that sure they "failed" totally.
Doesn't Tolkien say somewhere in "Letters" that they were sent as
emessaries to the east (like missionaries), and that they may have had some positive effect in disuniting the eastern and southern peoples from
uniting against the west? I'll have to reread letters, etc.

Radagast is a generally curiously ineffective istari, for good or evil.

But since even Saruman was given more then one chance to repent,
it would seem possible that the other three wizards were welcomed back to
Valinor.- especially given the extremely difficult working conditions of the
Blue Wizards.
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Old 05-19-2005, 01:43 PM   #2
Eruanna
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Tolkien himself wasn't sure of the effect of the Blue Wizards in the east, I seem to remember that he said (in Letters) that he saw them as being the founders of secret societies and religions. Who can say if they failed, perhaps this was their purpose.

The question of 'stewardship' is interesting, when Gandalf says:

Quote:
"But all worthy things that are in peril as the world now stands, those are my care...For I am a steward. Did you not know?"
He seems to be using the title 'steward' almost in its mediaeval sense. As one who takes care of the domestic household and servants of the lord. Another word for steward in those times was 'seneschal'. This word (bearing in mind the Professor's love of words) has its roots in Latin/Ancient Germanic/Anglo Saxon, meaning 'old servant'. I wonder if this was just a coincidence, given the physical appearance of the Istari as they wandered Middle-earth.
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Old 05-23-2005, 08:22 AM   #3
Thinlómien
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Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.Thinlómien is wading through the Dead Marshes.
Gandalf is the/a steward of Middle-Earth while valar aren't there (on a way), as Denethor is the steward of Gondor while the king is away. Gandalf's job is just different. He doesn't actually rule ME. So when talking about Gandalf 'steward' means 'envoy' or 'messenger'.
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Old 05-23-2005, 04:00 PM   #4
Boromir88
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I think a bigger question is, is Gandalf in a way an "authority" when it comes to being the steward of Middle-earth? What I mean is does he hold some sort of authoratative power, where some other people of power (Theoden, Aragorn, Denethor) have to listen to him?

I can't recall anytime when Gandalf made someone listen to him, but he's very good at getting people to do what he wants. But, is this more of the fact that people are smart enough to listen to his advice?
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Old 05-23-2005, 06:36 PM   #5
Celuien
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Maybe the fact that Gandalf doesn't force anyone to listen to what he says is part of the difference between the good and evil forces in Middle Earth. The only characters I've noticed actively forcing another to do something have been on the Morgoth/Sauron side. Something along the lines of you can't be forced to do the right thing. Or also, that you can't remain in the role of good if you try to force your will on to others, even if it's "for their own good" or done in a subtle way - shades of Saurman and a lust for power?
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Old 05-24-2005, 10:22 AM   #6
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rolf,,,,gandolf likes stew !!!
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