Old Tom bombadil is a...?!?!

[Essex]

Of course he had the Ring in his possesion, but then gave it back to Frodo!

Doh!!!!!!!



(although I am, in this reply, disregarding your penultimate paragraph)

but sorry, I remember reading a similar thread before on another forum a few years back, it doesn't ring true to me, although it's funny someone else has thought of it............

I am intrigued as to whether old Bombadil could work as two persons, whilst of course not revealing this secret. Obviously there are some others who will shed more light on the true nature of Bombadil to counter this possibility.

[alatar]

Mansun, as seemingly as airtight as your argument appears, I would have to respectfully disagree. I have information that I was not to divulge, but in order to clear the Witch-King's good name, I am forced to come clean.

Tom Bombadil is none other than Starship Captain James Tiberius Kirk.

That should be obvious to everyone, but for those that require additional proof:

• You never see Bombadil and Kirk together, even at various science fiction/fantasy conventions.

• "...I was waiting for you. We heard news of you, and learned that you were wandering... But Tom had an errand there, that he dared not hinder"- Kirk's tricorder probably picked up the approaching Hobbits as 'life forms,' and Kirk was disappointed that he could not blast them with his phaser. And Kirk would pick lilies from a stream if it would get him closer to a woman.

• "there was a glint in his eyes when he heard of the Riders." Kirk was notorious for getting into fights, and these so-called Riders might fight the bill. Plus, Kirk liked horses, and sometimes horses and/or bad guys on horses meant 'damsel in distress,' a pheromone that Kirk could not resist.

• Kirk was not affected by the Ring as his ego is of galactic proportions; some critics have suggested that the Captain has "delusions of godhood." Battling supernatural and godlike beings in a contest of wills (not wits, mind you) was a daily experience for Kirk. To think that the Ring could do anything to him...ha. And Kirk was such an egomaniac prima donna that nothing, absolutely nothing could make him leave center stage, let alone make him become invisible.

• And Kirk's power over the Barrow wights is easily explained. Anyone familiar with the Captain knows that he is prone to monologuing - making grandiose speechs that left his enemies in tears and his fellow crewpersons ready to sacrifice themselves just so that they wouldn't have to hear anymore. The death scream of the wight is proof of Kirk's speaking abilities. And note that he lifted a necklace from the pile on the hill to, yet again, get in good with Goldberry.

• And the yellow boots are a dead giveaway - the Captain's uniform is gold/yellow.

And just who do you think that the Blue Wizards, Pallando and I , were sent to retrieve?

This is Spock...I mean uhh...alatar... out.

[Meneltarmacil]

As these are not very serious suggestions, Middle-Earth Mirth is probably the best place to be discussing them, and they'd probably belong on this thread.

Though I did like the Star Trek idea...

Originally Posted by alatar

Mansun, as seemingly as airtight as your argument appears, I would have to respectfully disagree.

Alatar, these Bombadil/WK comparisons were made by somebody else (not me!) from another Forum, yet they are still interesting if what somewhat bizarre. Nobody can dent that Bombadil is the strangest of all the ME characters, so much that one might question whether Tolkein was right to include him in the LOTR at all, since he plays little or no part in the vast majority of the story, unless that he DOES play another person at the same time.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

I've read the original article presenting this thesis; if I remember correctly, it was on the Tolkien Sarcasm Site. (i. e. flyingmoose) Since it is definitely not a serious book discussion, I'm moving this thread to the Middle-Earth Mirth forum. A relatively new Tom Bombadil thread is already located there, so I will see if I can merge the two. (Old Tom Bombadil is a...?)

Kudos to alatar for a wonderful new crackpot theory - what a laugh!! I really enjoyed reading that!

[alatar]

Apologies all around, especially to Mansun, if I've skewed the discussion or intent of the thread.

Sorry, but I just couldn't restrain myself...

[Estelyn Telcontar]

No apology needed, alatar! Your contribution was definitely right in line with the intent of that orginal article!

Originally Posted by alatar

The yellow boots are a dead giveaway - the Captain's uniform is gold/yellow.

I suppose you meant these yellow wellies here! Old Bombadil must have made them himself lol.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by alatar

I have information that I was not to divulge, but in order to clear the Witch-King's good name, I am forced to come clean.

Tom Bombadil is none other than Starship Captain James Tiberius Kirk.

That should be obvious to everyone, but for those that require additional proof:

. . . .

This is Spock...I mean uhh...alatar... out.

I think the clincher lies in obvious subterfuge between Goldberry and the many roles Mrs. "Roddenberry" played. *coughs*

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Bêthberry

I think the clincher lies in obvious subterfuge between Goldberry and the many roles Mrs. "Roddenberry" played. *coughs*

To run with this idea just a bit further, if Goldberry/Mrs. Roddenberry (as astutely noted by Bêthberry) were able to control Captain Kirk to the point of having him dress and act like Tom, this would account for Kirk's/Tom's seeming immunity to the power of the Ring - he was under a much greater and more powerful influence, dwarfing the power of Sauron's paltry Ring.

Sauron desired only Middle Earth and maybe even Arda, but such things pale in comparison to exclusive franchise rights...

"Yes dear, you can be in any episode and can be any character that you want..." said Gene gingerly.

[Gurthang]

I've got it! The final answer.

Bombadil is Beren!

Let's look at the facts.

1. Beren and Luthien dissappeared after the destruction of Beleriand. | Nobody knows where Tom or Goldberry came from.

2. Tom is immune to the Ring's power. | Beren died, and then came back to life... making him immortal and unaffected by the Ring.

3. Goldberry is the River-woman's daughter. | Melian, Luthien's mother, was a lover of trees who lived in caves alongside the River Esgalduin.

4. Tom commands trees. | Melian passed her knowledge of tree-lore on to Luthien, who passed it to Beren/Tom.

5. Tom sings about meeting Goldberry by a pond while she was singing. | All of us know that Beren happened upon Luthien and was enchanted by her song.

6. Tom could see Frodo when he put the Ring on. | This goes along with Beren dying. Since he died, he was part of the spirit world. When he was brought back, he was actually in both worlds. When Frodo slipped on the Ring and entered the spirit realm, Tom was there and could see him.

I should note that Beren being one handed could mar my theory. But I must ask you... does it ever say that Tom has two hands?

Tom is Beren and Beren is Tom. The End.


P.S. Hmmm. This could make a serious topic one day. *chuckles maniacly*

Tom Bombadil should not have been included in the LOTR. He contributes absolutely nothing to the story, yet there is something strange about him, as Elrond pointed out. He isn't just a normal human, but a strange creature of which even the Ring has no power over. On that front, he may be more powerful than the WK himself!

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Mansun

Tom Bombadil shopuld not have been included in the LOTR.

Thankfully, in retrospect, he was not included in the Peter Jackson version of LOTR. One only wonders (and shudders) at what liberties Peter would have taken with poor ole Tom.

[yavanna II]

Originally Posted by Gurthang

I've got it! The final answer.

Bombadil is Beren!

1. Beren and Luthien dissappeared after the destruction of Beleriand. | Nobody knows where Tom or Goldberry came from.

2. Tom is immune to the Ring's power. | Beren died, and then came back to life... making him immortal and unaffected by the Ring.

3. Goldberry is the River-woman's daughter. | Melian, Luthien's mother, was a lover of trees who lived in caves alongside the River Esgalduin.

4. Tom commands trees. | Melian passed her knowledge of tree-lore on to Luthien, who passed it to Beren/Tom.

5. Tom sings about meeting Goldberry by a pond while she was singing. | All of us know that Beren happened upon Luthien and was enchanted by her song.

6. Tom could see Frodo when he put the Ring on. | This goes along with Beren dying. Since he died, he was part of the spirit world. When he was brought back, he was actually in both worlds. When Frodo slipped on the Ring and entered the spirit realm, Tom was there and could see him.

I love your idea.... but Beren and Luthien never came back, didn't they, cos it's part of her deal with Mandos? Somewhere in the Sil it says that alone of the Eldar Luthien never came back and passed away.... and isn't that supposed to mean that she'd never be able to do so even with another form?

Goldberry is Goldberry because of gold hair, isn't it? Luthien was dark-haired....

So it was that alone of the Eldalie she has died indeed, and left the world long ago.

Hehe... just found my Sil...

[the guy who be short]

Yavanna, ye reckon without the Philosopher's* Stone! If Luthien had it, she could easily dye her hair and remain as Goldberry... Though she didn't.

*Sorceror's Stone in the U.S. (Presumably the idea of Philosophy is entirely an Old World concept.)