Who would have fallen?

[Glirdan]

Originally Posted by alatar

Oh, so now there is the requirement to make sense?!? Hmmm..I may have a little trouble with that, but then again I guess that there's a first time for everything.

I know, why do things have to make sense?? Oh well. Guess I will just have to restrain myself then.

Originally Posted by alatar

But not as many as did Aragorn. Strider was alone in the woods with fours hobbits unchaperoned. When Boromir enters the story, the Ring Bearer is surrounded by some pretty big body guards, and so he might have been put off by them. And what is hinted at by the temptations of Galadriel? Did she see Ring lust in Aragorn's eyes? My point is that Boromir and Aragorn are different.

I agree with you on this alatar. Aragorn was with the four alone a lot after they left Bree. When Boromir comes, he would have to face a man who claims to be king of Gondor, a Dwarf with a bad temper, an elf with a good shot on a bow, and a very powerful wizard. Not to mention Frodo's kin and "servant". He would have had a really hard time getting it from him. Aragorn and Boromir are VERY different from each other.

[Folwren]

I haven't voted yet, but I have to say that I doubt it is Peregrin. I take the question to mean that if the Fellowship never broke and Frodo still carried the Ring, who would fall next, not 'if it fell into someone's hands, who would succumb to it?' If that were the case, well...I think if anyone had it long enough they would succumb.

Anyhow, taking the question as I percieve it (i.e. Frodo carries it, the others see it now and again and it's always near them, who falls next?), I don't think Pippin would even care. Several here have said that because of his witlessness and his proneness to curiosity he would have fallen, but I say because of his lack of knowledge and lack of contact with the thing, he would hardly be aware of its presence. He sees no application for it (like Boromir saw it as a weapon, or other people might see it as power) and he can only see the misery it brings. Like a child, he'll do his utmost to avoid that.

Until later, then, when I figure out who I think WOULD be next...

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Folwren

Several here have said that because of his witlessness and his proneness to curiosity he would have fallen, but I say because of his lack of knowledge and lack of contact with the thing, he would hardly be aware of its presence. He sees no application for it (like Boromir saw it as a weapon, or other people might see it as power) and he can only see the misery it brings. Like a child, he'll do his utmost to avoid that.

Not to be impolite, but do you have children? I have one such child that repeatedly tries to harm herself - not that she's stupid or not abled and as normal as one of my children can be - it's just that she continually attempts things that are outside of her abilities. We are on constant 'suicide watch.' Finding a screwdriver, she would immediately go to the nearest electrical outlet...

My other two somehow have more sense.

That and that she is overly curious. How many coins do you think one can fit inside the box of a computer (when it's turned on)? She means no harm, it's just that she found the coins near the computer, saw the slots, and must have figured that one belonged inside the other. I am continually amazed by (and tired from) her actions.

I see Pippin in the same light. He would not mean harm, nor would he seek power. I would agree that he might even be deaf to the call. My assertion has been that if the Ring were in reach, Pippin would try it on just to see what would happen/what it would do. I would posit the same would happen if he saw Frodo's star glass, Gandalf's staff, Boromir's horn, etc.

He just can't his hands in his pocketses.

[Boromir88]

Well to finish what I intended...

I thought about Pippin, but seeing as he was a Hobbit, I don't see him as being the next one to fall to the Ring. I think his curiosity is what would get him eventually.

Saucepan brings up good points about Aragorn, and these are similar reasons to why I considered him to falling after Boromir. Yes, Aragorn did have chances to take it already, alone with the four hobbits, but Aragorn at the end of FOTR (well beginning of TTT) is in total shambles. He questions his own leadership, he wishes Gandalf didn't die, he wishes he wasn't the leader because anything he's decided has gone wrong. Right now at the beginning of TTT he begins questioning himself, and goes through a hard time...perhaps some fuel for the Ring to work with?

Anyway, onto who I voted for and why. Aye, it was Legolas. Simply for the reasons that he could be in the same boat with Boromir. Mirkwood is a piece of junk at this time, it's dark, crappy, and infested with spiders, could the Ring use this to work on Legolas? Maybe, maybe not. But it seems like Legolas and Boromir are sort of on the same road here. Boromir wants to save Gondor, though he wants to do it himself. Legolas perhaps wants to make Mirkwood beautiful again, and clear of spiders, but Boromir was just an easier target.

Now, we don't get too many characters thoughts on the Ring. We get some on Aragorn, a bit on Gandalf, Sam much later on, and Frodo. Other than that how the others are effected by it isn't said.

We must remember, that just because some people don't show an effect of the Ring, doesn't mean they COULDN'T become corrupted. Through the journey of the Fellowship, the Ring had no need to work on anyone else besides Boromir. Boromir was easy prey for the Ring, and the Ring had no need to try to go after anyone else at this time. Once Boromir is out of the picture, Gollum comes in, more easy prey for the Ring. So, the Ring I don't think is something all powerful that effects anyone that comes near it. It tends to focus on one person, and when that person is alone.

Examples:

Smeagol killing Deagol for the Ring.
Frodo offering it to Gandalf in Bag End.
Frodo offering it to Galadriel.
Boromir and Frodo alone at Amon Hen.
Sam's temptation in Cirith Ungol, alone with Frodo.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

We must remember, that just because some people don't show an effect of the Ring, doesn't mean they COULDN'T become corrupted. Through the journey of the Fellowship, the Ring had no need to work on anyone else besides Boromir. Boromir was easy prey for the Ring, and the Ring had no need to try to go after anyone else at this time. Once Boromir is out of the picture, Gollum comes in, more easy prey for the Ring. So, the Ring I don't think is something all powerful that effects anyone that comes near it. It tends to focus on one person, and when that person is alone.

That could be true, but I have to wonder about Bilbo's reputation for eccentricity in The Shire--or perhaps it is Bag End's reputation as a slightly questionable place. Maybe the Ring, while lying in wait all those years, was secretly reaching out to the various visitors, whose behaviours might be skewed by its efforts. So poor Bilbo gets the reputation as somewhat or highly irregular and Bag End as a place best to avoid.

So perhaps it wasn't that the hobbits were so parochial or small minded, but that in fact there was sufficient cause for strange things overcoming hobbits in Bag End. And because no one knew the real source for the troubling influence, Bilbo got tagged with a bad rep.

Just a thought.

[Lyta_Underhill]

How come Pippin always seems to be regarded as having less love for Frodo than Merry? Is it his "lighter" nature?

I think this impression might come from the fact that Pippin CAN throw away a treasure at need, and he seems less attached to the things of the world, more Gandalf-like in that respect. Merry is constantly pulled back to Earth and admonishes himself ("Frodo and Sam! I am forgetting them!) and it pulls him back to his cares and his worry. He is depressed when Pippin is not there, and seems to need others around him, whereas Pippin treads lightly upon Middle Earth, one of the aspects of his personality I've tried to emulate, except where it creates conflicts with the more sensitive members of the world. It is a skill that works only when it is finely honed, and without this honing, it comes off as foolishness and mindlessness, perhaps childishness even! It is another question whether the Ring would have gotten Pippin before he could "grow up," but he does seem vulnerable to the unexplained drawing power of unseen forces, viz. the Palantir incident. So he probably would have tried it, but only if it had been in proximity to him.

I see Pippin in the same light. He would not mean harm, nor would he seek power. I would agree that he might even be deaf to the call. My assertion has been that if the Ring were in reach, Pippin would try it on just to see what would happen/what it would do. I would posit the same would happen if he saw Frodo's star glass, Gandalf's staff, Boromir's horn, etc.

Too true, except I don't think the 'call' would take an earthly form, as it did for Boromir, as it might for Aragorn, or even as it did in the end for Frodo. Pippin wishes to know the otherworldly, the names of things, all the stars in the sky, the lands of the world, etc. etc.,. I think his desire is much like Gandalf's desire to have looked into the Palantir and seen the hands of Fëanor at work long ago, a desire for knowledge. But the Ring would have merely given him grandiose notions. And then, like Sam, he would have realized he isn't big enough for grandiose notions and taken it off like a good Hobbit!

On a last note, I think I would have thrown the book against the wall and stomped on it if Pippin fell to the Ring. I'm glad this is only hypothetical!

Cheers!
Lyta

[Fordim Hedgethistle]

Stunned, yes, I am stunned that Aragorn and Pippin are garnering so many votes, when the most likely to have succumbed is clearly ++GANDALF.

My reasoning? Each and every time someone is tempted to seize the Ring it is with the express purpose of using it to confront Sauron and to raise him or herself above the Enemy: Boromir wishes to become a great captain and lead an army against Mordor; Galadriel will become the Dark Queen; Sam dreams of throwing down the Dark Tower; even Gollum dreams of being Gollum the Great and eating fish every day.

What prevents Frodo from succumbing for so long is his ability to set aside that desire to confront evil in this mano y mano model of combative, militaristic heroism (that Boromir personifies). Instead, he clings to his love of and for other people: his duty, as he understands it, is to protect the Shire. Sam, Merry and Pippin see their duty as being to protect Frodo; Aragorn’s duty is to return to Gondor and save it; and Legolas and Gimli share the duty of the Halflings (to aid Frodo) but increasingly to each other in their remarkable friendship. The point of the Quest is to destroy the Ring and to this they are all dedicated – it’s only when people move away from this goal and embrace a more combative one (attack Sauron directly) that they run into trouble.

And this is where I come to Gandalf. His sole and only purpose in being sent to M-E is to combat Sauron: not directly, to be sure, but he has been placed there as the opponent to the Enemy. Unlike the hobbits – who are there to save the Shire – or Aragorn – who is there to win Arwen (by saving Gondor) – or Legolas and Gimli – who are there to save the Greenwood and the Mountain, and to forge a new bond between both – Gandalf is in M-E to defeat Sauron.

The lure of the Ring (“Take me, and you can destroy Sauron”) would find its readiest ear in the Wizard…don’t forget, it’s already corrupted one White Wizard…

(Why do you think that when Gandalf returned he made sure that he went west toward Aragorn, or -- more precisely -- away from Frodo, when he could have just as easily gone into Mordor to help the Ringbearer? I suspect that deep down, or even not so deep down, he knew that he was the greatest threat to Frodo.)

[Glirdan]

Originally Posted by alatar

I see Pippin in the same light. He would not mean harm, nor would he seek power. I would agree that he might even be deaf to the call. My assertion has been that if the Ring were in reach, Pippin would try it on just to see what would happen/what it would do. I would posit the same would happen if he saw Frodo's star glass, Gandalf's staff, Boromir's horn, etc.

I agree with you alatar, he can't seem to keep his hands off of everything. For that reason, I believe he would be the first to succumb to the power of the Ring.

Originally Posted by Lyta_Underhill

On a last note, I think I would have thrown the book against the wall and stomped on it if Pippin fell to the Ring. I'm glad this is only hypothetical!

You're not the only one Lyta. If ANY of the others succumbed to the power of the Ring, I would have flipped because I liked them all.