For the Love of Galadriel (Middle-earth’s Ultimate Muse?) - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

davem · 09-07-2005, 06:03 AM

Its interesting that Feanor requests a lock of Galadriel's hair but as far as we are told he does not offer anything in return. Celebrimbor, out of love, makes for her the Elessar & later Nenya. Gimli also requests a hair of her head, but only after she has offered him a gift & asked him to name it.

It seems that in the first two cases it is Galadriel who is approached by others & asked for something (probably in Feanor's case it was as much a 'demand' as a request), while in the case of Gimli he has come before her initially asking, & expecting, nothing. His love for her is entirely selfless & he gets more than he asks for (or expects).

I think its also important that when asked what he would do with her gift he tells her that it is to be a symbol of friendship between his people & hers, not a personal possession which he will keep only to himself - as Feanor did with the Silmarils.

One thing does strike me - in many ways what she herself creates (Mirror, Phial) is 'merely' a version of what Feanor created (Palatiri, Silmaril). She is less possessive of 'her' things - being more like Aule & the other Noldor in that, but the things she creates seem less 'permanent', & have as a principal element water, something which has no real 'form' & can be poured away.

Perhaps this choice of substance is reflective of the personalities of her lovers & her own. They seek to produce things which will be hard, solid, weighty & enduring, things that they can (hopefully) count on being around as long as they are (or longer in Gimli's case). She creates things which are about as transitory as possible (ok the Phial is pretty solid as an object, but that is merely the container for her actual creation - the water bearing light of Earendel). I can't help feeling that this reflects her spiritual 'state' by the end of the Third Age. She no longer seeks the permanence of things around her. She has learned to 'let go'. Her giving up of the Elessar to Aragorn seems to me just as significant as her refusing the One Ring - both are symbolic of her knowledge that the desire for permanence is a mistake.

I strongly suspect that if Gimli had told her (or if she had felt) that he wanted her hair in a possessive way - as did Feanor, or that his love for her involved any element of desire - as with Celebrimbor, she would have refused him outright.

Mithalwen · 09-07-2005, 07:01 AM

[QUOTE=davem]
It seems that in the first two cases it is Galadriel who is approached by others & asked for something (probably in Feanor's case it was as much a 'demand' as a request), QUOTE]

Beg, does not to me imply "demand".... irritating persistence maybe.

drigel · 09-07-2005, 07:22 AM

A most excellent thread! I agree with everyones assertions here. Contemplating Galadriel-as-Muse, I always think about Frodo and Sam's last stage of their journey to mount doom. In that bleak place, there are so many references to the Lady, and there are also many times her gifts were used to either help them practically, or (in some cases - more importantly) spiritually.

Quote:

. 'If only the Lady could see us or hear us, I'd say to her: "Your Ladyship, all we want is light and water: just clean water and plain daylight, better than any jewels, begging your pardon." But it's a long way to Lorien.'

wonderful

davem · 09-07-2005, 08:11 AM

[QUOTE=Mithalwen]

Quote:

Originally Posted by davem

It seems that in the first two cases it is Galadriel who is approached by others & asked for something (probably in Feanor's case it was as much a 'demand' as a request), QUOTE]

Beg, does not to me imply "demand".... irritating persistence maybe.

I was basing my assertion on the statement in UT that after Feanor's 'requests' he & Galadriel were 'unfriends forever'. This seems an OTT response to 'irritating persistence'.

Dimcollowen · 09-07-2005, 08:20 AM

Well...i never thought of Galadriel as Muse.....I don't think she is a muse.....I think she is more of a Goddess....of sorts then a muse.....I don't know how to describe what i think of her......its very difficult.....i don't think i could describe it to you.....if you want me try...give a holla!!

09-07-2005, 06:03 AM	#1
davem Illustrious Ulair Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties Posts: 4,240	Its interesting that Feanor requests a lock of Galadriel's hair but as far as we are told he does not offer anything in return. Celebrimbor, out of love, makes for her the Elessar & later Nenya. Gimli also requests a hair of her head, but only after she has offered him a gift & asked him to name it. It seems that in the first two cases it is Galadriel who is approached by others & asked for something (probably in Feanor's case it was as much a 'demand' as a request), while in the case of Gimli he has come before her initially asking, & expecting, nothing. His love for her is entirely selfless & he gets more than he asks for (or expects). I think its also important that when asked what he would do with her gift he tells her that it is to be a symbol of friendship between his people & hers, not a personal possession which he will keep only to himself - as Feanor did with the Silmarils. One thing does strike me - in many ways what she herself creates (Mirror, Phial) is 'merely' a version of what Feanor created (Palatiri, Silmaril). She is less possessive of 'her' things - being more like Aule & the other Noldor in that, but the things she creates seem less 'permanent', & have as a principal element water, something which has no real 'form' & can be poured away. Perhaps this choice of substance is reflective of the personalities of her lovers & her own. They seek to produce things which will be hard, solid, weighty & enduring, things that they can (hopefully) count on being around as long as they are (or longer in Gimli's case). She creates things which are about as transitory as possible (ok the Phial is pretty solid as an object, but that is merely the container for her actual creation - the water bearing light of Earendel). I can't help feeling that this reflects her spiritual 'state' by the end of the Third Age. She no longer seeks the permanence of things around her. She has learned to 'let go'. Her giving up of the Elessar to Aragorn seems to me just as significant as her refusing the One Ring - both are symbolic of her knowledge that the desire for permanence is a mistake. I strongly suspect that if Gimli had told her (or if she had felt) that he wanted her hair in a possessive way - as did Feanor, or that his love for her involved any element of desire - as with Celebrimbor, she would have refused him outright. __________________ “Everything was an object. If you killed a dwarf you could use it as a weapon – it was no different to other large heavy objects."

09-07-2005, 07:01 AM	#2
Mithalwen Pilgrim Soul Join Date: May 2004 Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle... Posts: 9,460	[QUOTE=davem] It seems that in the first two cases it is Galadriel who is approached by others & asked for something (probably in Feanor's case it was as much a 'demand' as a request), QUOTE] Beg, does not to me imply "demand".... irritating persistence maybe. __________________ “But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace

09-07-2005, 08:20 AM	#5
Dimcollowen Pile O'Bones Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Minas Tirith Posts: 23	Well...i never thought of Galadriel as Muse.....I don't think she is a muse.....I think she is more of a Goddess....of sorts then a muse.....I don't know how to describe what i think of her......its very difficult.....i don't think i could describe it to you.....if you want me try...give a holla!! __________________ They say Lothlorien is beautiful, and I don't disagree. Elves, they also say, are the most beautiful race, and they are beautiful, But you are the most handsome of all. Elessar, you and I were meant to be.

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