LotR1-FotR-Seq02

[Lalwendë]

Never mind the prologue, this was the important bit for me. If they had got The Shire and the Hobbits wrong, I'd have been out of that cinema. I've always very much pictured The Shire as Tolkien's own art portrays it, and this portrayal was a little different. I often think how messy the gardens look, and as a keen gardener like a Gamgee, I know that they would probably be a lot tidier. But strangely, I was very taken with this view of The Shire indeed. In fact I watch it with no small measure of nostalgia.

Those messy gardens are like the gardens I knew when I was a child, haphazard and slightly wild, their owners being too busy farming to be fussy about the flowers. The characters all seem to make me think of some mad character I knew when growing up, including the chap with the ear wax problem. Mr Proudfoot makes me smile because he's like my father but with more hair, secretly enjoying the fireworks but feeling he has to appear disapproving. I like the group of Hobbits sat round doing some hardcore smoking, and I love the Hobbit who cracks up with laughter when he draws himself a pint off from the barrels - he's having fun!

Ian Holm is splendid as Bilbo. Interestingly, he's an actor who can 'do evil' very well, as anyone who has seen From Hell will know. He also interacts very well with Ian McKellen; I'm sure they will have worked together before in the theatre. I have to say here, imagine if they had chosen Sean Connery as Gandalf? Noooo! But to see both of them together as soon as possible after the start of the film was important to me, not just as it matched the book, but because it just seems right that Hobbits and Wizards are seen together, they go together like cheese and apple pie.

Interesting point on the design - I was watching a travel documentary about New Zealand on one of Sky's 500 channels of tripe and they showed the farm where The Shire was filmed. That big tree is still there, in fact it was a major selling point in choosing that location. The son of the farmer said in typically breezy antipodean style that they had actually been thinking of chopping it down before they chose the location!

The detail again is one of the things which grabs me. I liked how the hillsides had lychets marked into them, the remains of old terraced fields; you see these all over the place in Yorkshire, so it gave it an authentic touch. I also like Bag End, and I laugh when I se the books all over the place. That's like my house.

[radagastly]

He also interacts very well with Ian McKellen; I'm sure they will have worked together before in the theatre.

Actually, I believe one of them said in the commentaries that they were aware of each other's work, but had never had the opportunity to work together before "Lord of the Rings."

[Boromir88]

The only big gripe that I have with this beginning scene is Frodo's age, and it's not really that "big." But, I just find it odd that Bilbo is 111, and his cousin (I know Frodo calls Bilbo "uncle" but I don't think he's Frodo's Uncle right? I think they're cousins) and Frodo looks like he's 20. (Which Elijah was). Which kind of gets me (don't know about anyone else) to scratch my head.

Other than that, the acting in this scene is great, as has been mentioned several times.

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

The only big gripe that I have with this beginning scene is Frodo's age, and it's not really that "big." But, I just find it odd that Bilbo is 111, and his cousin (I know Frodo calls Bilbo "uncle" but I don't think he's Frodo's Uncle right? I think they're cousins) and Frodo looks like he's 20. (Which Elijah was). Which kind of gets me (don't know about anyone else) to scratch my head.

Wasn't Frodo 33? And also thought that he was a more 'elvish' kind of hobbit, meaning that he was a bit more fair etc. And in the movie I can't remember Frodo ever puffing away, and at least initially he seems to be a lad at ease - you may have to look hard to find some calluses on those hands - and so he may appear young for his age.

[Boromir88]

Wasn't Frodo 33? And also thought that he was a more 'elvish' kind of hobbit, meaning that he was a bit more fair etc. And in the movie I can't remember Frodo ever puffing away, and at least initially he seems to be a lad at ease - you may have to look hard to find some calluses on those hands - and so he may appear young for his age.

Oh yeah, during Bilbo's party he was 33, I was thinking he was 50, but this isn't til he leaves of course.

[Lathriel]

I love this sequence since it is really the calm before the storm.
I don't mind the earwax thing. I know it is silly but after this sequence it gets so serious that a little bt of silliness really doesn't do any harm.
I really like the quote, "there has always been a Baggins at Bag end..." The part that says that there always will be doesn't bother me because how could Bilbo know that his ring would cause so much trouble.
At first I didn't like the way Merry and Pippin were introduced, didn't Gandalf light all the fireworks? But after seeing the movie several times I got used to it. One of the things I immediatly noticed as well was that Merry's intelligence was brought down a bit in these scenes. Luckily he does slowly get up to his book counterpart later in the movie.
Well its late so I'll write more later.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by radagastly

Actually, I believe one of them said in the commentaries that they were aware of each other's work, but had never had the opportunity to work together before "Lord of the Rings."

Yes! I caught that late last night - decided to watch the cast commentary track before getting into bed. It's actually quite unusual for two British actors of that calibre not to have worked together for that long so I was surprised.

Another reason that Ian Holm was excellent as Bilbo is that he captured that nervousness which I see as part of Bilbo's personality. At the beginning of The Hobbit, he is one of those 'terribly polite Englishmen', not exactly a stereotype, but a familiar kind of figure. He does not wish to offend the dwarves by refusing them his cakes but he gives his treats away all the same, not wishing to appear rude. Bilbo still has this quality, with a bit more confidence, at the begining of LotR and I found Ian Holm captured this really well.

Did anyone else think there may be something significant in the fact that while Bilbo blew a smoke ring, Gandalf blew a smoke ship and sailed it through the ring?

[Mithalwen]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

The only big gripe that I have with this beginning scene is Frodo's age, and it's not really that "big." But, I just find it odd that Bilbo is 111, and his cousin (I know Frodo calls Bilbo "uncle" but I don't think he's Frodo's Uncle right? I think they're cousins) and Frodo looks like he's 20. (Which Elijah was). Which kind of gets me (don't know about anyone else) to scratch my head.

Well they aren't first cousins - save at two removes and second cousins once removed the other way.

In my family (and I am sure this isn't unique) we were taught to address various elderly cousins ( such as the first cousins of my grandparents) as Auntie and Uncle out of deference. Although Merry and Pippin use it sometimes in the books, I don't think cousin is widely used as a term of address. I am fairly sure that Frodo refers to Bilbo as uncle in the books.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by alatar

What will become apparent as the trilogy progresses is that these gems become more rare. Is that because PJ felt that he had to get this movie right, for both fans and non-fans, in order to acquire more capital that would buy him a freer hand in the following movies?

I am not sure that I fully agree, given that the detail is pretty consistent all the way through. But I see what you are getting at. I wonder if it's because, when adapting a novel to film, the beginning and ending pretty much have to follow the original plot (because both stories, although different, are coming from and going to the same place), whereas the adapter has more of a free hand with the detail of what occurs in between.

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

... does anyone else just think "Tellytubby land" during the beginning of this sequence? Maybe they wer trying too hard or maybe they wanted it to seem "story book" English countryside. Yes the Shire is a pleasant land but it seemed excessively idyllic ...

Yes. That's one of the points that I was trying to get at in my earlier post. Did Jackson perhaps feel the need to "over-idealise" the Shire in order to make it a desirable place for modern audiences? Tolkien presents us with something of an idealised place, but one which is nevertheless practical and feels "real". I agree that Jackson's Shire feels rather less real, and more like a fairytale setting. In some ways, Jackson's Hobbits travel from a fairytale world into a more real world (where the Men are less idealised and more "human"), whereas Tolkien's Hobbits travel from a real world, via Faerie (the Old Forest and the Barrow Downs), into an epic, heroic world.

[Rimbaud]

I agree, and also would have preferred a lower key approach. However, New Line were well aware that audiences outside Tolkienites would be for the most part watching for pure escapism; in this light, over stylised settings are almost a must. Funnily enough I didn't mind Rivendell though, despite it being perhaps the most OTT on display. Perhaps this is because Tolkien drew it in such a misty-eyed fashion?

[Mithalwen]

I know one non-Tolkinite who slept until Weathertop......

I too didn't mind RIvendell - which is meant to be "perfect" - and found Lorien a little disappointing... never really saw a mallorn . Maybe it is because Lorien and Rivendell in my mind, but live in th English countryside?