WWJ VIII ~ Things That Go "Quack" In The Night

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by mormegil

SpM you speak fair sense and it helps allay any doubt that you were converted on night 2. Well my good SpM what do you propose? I still think Kath highly suspect and want her lynched. I really would like to hear a bit more from Valier, as she is the only one I trust 100%

When you said I spoke sense, I presume that you were referring to my comment about the dangers of focussing too much on you and Kath. Yet you continue to display a single-minded determination to see Kath lynched without considering other possibilities. If you are innocent, you muct surely recognise the possibility that Kath is too. And you must surely see the danger then inherent in your approach. We lynch one of you today and (when that person is proven innocent) automatically lynch the other tomorrow. And lose.

Your single-mindedness in this regard points more to your guilt than your innocence, in my view.

Originally Posted by Valier

I am leaning towards Kath and more so Cailin at the moment, I still find it odd that she is no where to be seen yet today.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

I agree with Spm, that (non-)Cailin is really dangerously quiet.

The possibility that Calin is a Duck concerns me greatly. If she is, then she almost deserves to win. But, as I said earlier, it is often easier for the werecreature, with the knowledge he or she has, to appear innocent than it is for the true innocents to appear as such. I speak from experience (on both "sides of the fence") on this.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Now someone said, I might be the goose here. I admit I have tried to add complexity to our choices, but not with the idea of misguiding us, but for us to see the real possibilities.

I think that you may be referring to my earlier comment. I said that your speculation that Mith may have been the Goose may have been calculated to cause confusion. By this, I meant not that you might be the Goose, but that you might well be our remaining Duck. I believe our Goose to be dead, courtesy of Ang. You describe the likelihood of you being the Duck as being small. But it is not. You were declared innocent as the result of a Night 1 dream. It remains quite possible that the Ducks tried to kill you on Night 2. In fact, you were a quite likely target for them.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Good that you took that up Kath. I was wondering, should I check, were there others with over-rounded opinions in Jenny's post. Somehow Morm didn't manage to point all the cases out, just those suiting his purposes - as happened on his first post on dAY2...

I made the point myself earlier, although perhaps not quite so forcefully:

Originally Posted by me

I am not sure that we should read too much into Jenny's post that you refer to, as she mentioned a number of people, innocents and Ducks alike, in a fairly neutral way.

Morm seems to be a serial offender when it comes to selecting excerpts from quotes to suit his arguments ...

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

If Glirdan was a goose, he totally disregarded Spm's warnings about "bad goose tactics" and did exactly what Spm thought really bad...?

An interesting point you make. Yet, I wasn't saying that the "Goose tactic" I outlined would necessarily be bad. It would depend on the circumstances. I said that, if anyone claimed to be the Owl, then they should be believed as, if they were a Goose, they would swiftly be found out. But it might be worth the Goose doing this, for example in an attempt to expose the real Owl. That is not the situation which occured. But I still believe that Glirdan (the Goose) thought spawn to be innocent and that her death, together with the confusion caused, was worth his own.

If I am wrong, it means that Mith must have been the Goose. In which case, we can no longer rely on Valier's innocence. The possibility that Valier may be the last Duck is almost too dreadful to contemplate.

Originally Posted by mormegil

However their behavior pattern was consistent in the way they treated the other ducks.

No. Their behaviour pattern was consistent in the way they treated Ducks and innocents alike. I really don't see how this point counts against Kath, morm, and your persistence with it strengthens my concerns over you.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by The Saucepan Man

You describe the likelihood of you being the Duck as being small. But it is not. You were declared innocent as the result of a Night 1 dream. It remains quite possible that the Ducks tried to kill you on Night 2. In fact, you were a quite likely target for them.

This is interesting.

First: I was not "declared" innocent in day1, only on day2, so I would not be more higher in their agenda as anyone else after the firtst day talk (the ducks had to base their decision on day1 "results" only).

Secondly: I have never come to think - newbie as I still seem to be - the meaning of this idea, that the shapeshifting should be a result of night2 kill-decision. They could have been told beforehand, that you can pick someone? I don't know, whether there is a precedent here, and how it would be - or would Diamond go with it / know it in the first place... That would be a piece of important information now. As if it is their first actual gamenight's (night2) kill, we should really look for the one they would have liked to kill!

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

... so I would not be more higher in their agenda as anyone else after the firtst day talk (the ducks had to base their decision on day1 "results" only).

You are too modest.

You may not be the best at winning friends in the village (as your signature, courtesy of Sleepy, has it) but you have a certain reputation. At least one of our proven Ducks was familiar with it. And you did not attract much serious suspicion on Day 1. I can certainly see you being seriously considered by the Ducks on Night 2.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

They could have been told beforehand, that you can pick someone?

It's possible I suppose. But I had assumed from the Diamoddeses reference to this being a secret aspect of the game that the Ducks were as much in the dark as the rest of us at the outset.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

As if it is their first actual gamenight's (night2) kill, we should really look for the one they would have liked to kill!

That's one of the reasons I'm looking at you Nogrod. But it's also possible that the remaining Duck was one of the originals (which would discount you, if Mith is to be believed). Unfortunately, I don't think that we have any way of knowing.