Tol-in-Gaurhoth XXI: Dueling Wizards Werewolf

[mormegil]

I'm currently at post 281 and trying to read as fast as my poor little eyeballs will let me but reading the suspicion of Nogrod it seems to strike true to me and I have little doubt that he is a wolf. I forget if it was Roa or who that posted his post summary but something else I gleaned from it is that shortly after there was a suspcion raised of him because of his relative silence he began posting again with renewed vigor, yet he posted little and gave recaps of voting; which to me seems an attempt to artificially inflate his post count thus giving us the appearance of saying a lot but not really sayin much at all. Plus it was him that truly incited Loki and not the other way around. Loki died because of this and I don't think it was Loki that was being rude but simply abrasive in his defense.

I'm not certain if I will be able to get back...I will make my best attempt but to ensure that I get my vote in today.

++Nogrod

[Valier]

Originally Posted by Phantom

Oh, and one more thing. If some people continue to be super quiet (3 posts or less per day, and not saying much) I think we should just lynch them. They could be a hiding EW or Wolf. Worst case scenario, they are an unhelpful innocent who gives us nothing to base suspicions on. Those sorts should be slain

I for one completely disagree with this! I am a quiet villager, so are some of the others, but this does not make me unhelpful! I find this game in particular hard to keep up with, but according to my lorebooks my ancestors were always reserved in posting, but almost always made good choices when it came to wolf catching....in fact I find here *points to lorebook* that one of my ancestors actually won an award for being a Werewolf slayer I do however hate it when people only come on once during the Day and post and vote and that is it...coughcoughNilpcoughcough This is unhelpful, but posting three posts daily is not necissarily odd for some players...
I find it annoying when people keep posting over and over with absolutely nothing of any value being said...
I for one usual don't say much, and am not so good at figuring out how or why I suspect someone, but it ususal turns out for the better, so please do not lynch people just because they don't post enough for your liking

[Kath]

phantom please don't try to lynch those who don't post all that often. I make few posts but try to get my feelings and ideas across in those. Just because I speak less than you doesn't mean my ideas are less valid and I should be lynched. Posting once a day just to vote with no reasoning would be a sound reason for lynching though.

Now, somewhere around here there was a list, aha:
GW: Roa or Eomer
EW: Nilp or Firefoot
Wolves: Diamond, Kitanna, Celuien, or Glirdan
Seer: like I'd tell
Totally Innocent: morm, Gurthang, Spawn

I can see where you're coming from on the Nilp front. He didn't vote for himself and has been helpful, which generally means he is something other than an ordo. But why do you assume he is the EW and not the GW?

As for the others on that list I have no idea. Except that morm is of course guilty

And I wanted to ask. Why was it decided that the GW should not reveal sooner rather than later? I realise I could go back and look, but there's so much to read through it would likely be quicker if someone just told me!

[Kath]

Where'd everybody go? I'm going to have to go now, and I'm not sure what time I'll be back. It could be an hour before the deadline (which appears to be 11 not 10 GMT) but it could be after it so:

++NOGROD

I was suspicious of him earlier and things people have said have only served to strengthen those suspicions.

[Lalaith]

*prostrates self before Great Seal* thank you for your elucidation, oh one of fearsome bark and mighty flipper.

As for that last glare, oh dear, while I knew this frivolity lark might lead to trouble, I never thought it would actually get me in hot water with the Great Seal himself.
I refer to Diamond's post #13 (unlucky it seems for me) where she referred to me both as an angel and a centrefold.

[Valier]

I think the GW should stay hidden until they have made all three gifted, then if they choose to they should reveil themselves. If they reveil, the EW would then challenge him/her right away? I am still a little confused over this...(I should reread the rules) Doesn't the GW learn the EW's identity when they come forward? Do they have to challenge each other right away? I guess the GW would want to so there would be no more werewolf making, but wouldn't they(GW) want to stick around for awhile even though they are known? Because they still have the ability to change werewolves back and regift anyone that gets degifted.


So all in all....sorry if this stuff above was useless to say... I think the GW should remain hidden as long as possible.

[Caranlondien]

Just as clarification, if the GW comes forward, that does not give him knowledge as to the identity of the EW. And there is no rule, I believe, saying that the wizards must challenge each other as soon as they know one another's identities.

I'm still suspicious of Lommy, but moreso of Nogrod. As I have to leave now, I'll vote:

++Nogrod

1. Nilp --> Valier (Valier 1)
2. Celuien --> Lalaith (Valier 1, Lalaith 1)
3. Oddwen --> Lalaith (Valier 1, Lalaith 2)
4. Diamond --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1)
5. Feanor --> Roa (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1, Roa 1)
6. Sleepy --> Feanor (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
7. Lommy --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 2, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
8. Roa --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 3, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
9. mormegil --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 4, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
10. dancing spawn --> Oddwen (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 4, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
11. Kath --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 5, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
12. Caran --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 6, Roa 1, Feanor 1)

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Caranlondien

1. Nilp --> Valier (Valier 1)
2. Celuien --> Lalaith (Valier 1, Lalaith 1)
3. Oddwen --> Lalaith (Valier 1, Lalaith 2)
4. Diamond --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1)
5. Feanor --> Roa (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1, Roa 1)
6. Sleepy --> Feanor (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 1, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
7. Lommy --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 2, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
8. Roa --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 3, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
9. mormegil --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 4, Roa 1, Feanor 1)
10. dancing spawn --> Oddwen (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 4, Roa 1, Feanor 1, Oddwen 1)
11. Kath --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 5, Roa 1, Feanor 1, Oddwen 1)
12. Caran --> Nogrod (Valier 1, Lalaith 2, Nogrod 6, Roa 1, Feanor 1, Oddwen 1)

Caran! I added the one vote for Oddwen to the tally you had forgotten.

Well two hours to hunt a wolf - and happily lots of votes left. We can still do it.

[Cailín]

Difficult, difficult.

I am still reluctant to think Nogrod a wolf, because he would not have been my choice. I know he loves stirring up confusion and discussion, which would just be too risky for the EW. Then again, he might be the EW.

Aside from the fact that I would choose Lalaith and still think she'd make a good original wolf, I do not find her overly suspicious at the moment.

That's the primary lynching candidates right now. If I'd be forced to choose between them, Lalaith would be my choice. However, neither I'd be perfectly happy with.

I'd much rather repeat my vote for Oddwen, whose silence is quite disturbing. My lorebooks say nothing about her or her ancestors, but I heard some rumours that tell of a different kind of behaviour. However, I fear it would be a throwaway vote, not helpful to anyone.

My generally untrustworthy intuition is telling me to look closely at Kath and Nilpaurion Felagund.

Oh, and Fea, it's about the wolves names, not their personalities. I thought you loved alliteration? Lhuna, Lalaith and Loki would be very poetically responsible. Not to mention quite a reasonable team. Yeah. That's all.

I have to think about this.

[Naria]

If some people continue to be super quiet (3 posts or less per day, and not saying much) I think we should just lynch them. They could be a hiding EW or Wolf. Worst case scenario, they are an unhelpful innocent who gives us nothing to base suspicions on. Those sorts should be slain

Hmmmm, I don't know if I would be one to be in that list of super quiet players. I do try to get my thoughts up, when they come to me, and add to the conversation when need be. I do not have as long of breath as you dearPhantom . However, I would agree that those of us that post only once(with very little content) and then either vote or do another post with just a vote and no reason, are being very unhelpfull.


I have finally finished reading through everything and really have become even more confused *sigh*. However, I have gained some suspicions for certain people. I will go back and read over what they have said so I can have a little more concrete reasoning for my vote. Back shortly with a vote......

[Kitanna]

Celuien=
Gurthang has been relatively quiet, which makes me uneasy, but what he has said doesn't strike me as wolvish. Besides, he agrees with the phantom about the wizards, which seems to be a good thing.

Unless of course Gurthang is trying to latch on to the idea to appear innocent. But I doubt Gurthang is guilty of wizardry or wolvery. At least yesterday I was convinced of his innocence mainly because he put forth the EW and GW idea, which makes me think he was innocent yesterday and I still feel he's most likely an innocent today, but he bears some watching.

Roa=
This statement has me wondering- you admit to bandwagoning, but you give an odd reason for it. You were certainly throwing suspicion on Loki from your first post. And your reasons were terrible. I'd have to say that you were the driving force behind Loki's lynching, not after you were on the kill list, but from the very beginning.

Nogrod admitted that part of the reason he voted for Loki was because he was trying to save his own skin (he did say that earlier didn't he? or am I just making up posts?) Which makes sense, I'm sure many others in this village would have done the same in that situation. But Nogrod also went after Loki from the very beginning and the two continued their arguement until Loki was lynched.

Roa=

Nice blanket statement- certainly throws suspicion off you almost immediately.

This is the same type of statement that made me suspect Loki yesterday. So, this brings Nogrod high up on my suspect list, but since I was so horribly wrong about Loki I am now worried about making any sort of move against Nogrod today.

Oddwen=
++LALAITH

Because she never really loved me! And for a few things that Spawn pointed out, and a few little hunches of my own.

?? She misses the vote yesterday and now out of the blue and with reasons grabbed from spawn she votes for Lalaith.

Morm=
Alcarillo: was extremely defensive without much suspicion cast on him. It seems as if he almost didn't vote to kill SpM last night but was over ruled by his comrades and now is anxious to exonerate himself first thing.

An excellent observation, but I still lean more to Alcarillo being an innocent at this point. Though if his overly defense behavior continues into tomorrow I will have to change my stance on him.

Morm=
Nogrod: Different behavior, a bit less rash and more cautious.

A lot can happen in one night in a village with wizards.

Roa=
Naturally, a wolf learning the identity of a former teammate and an obvious innocent would act as quickly as possible to throw doubt on him, which is exactly what Nogrod did.

So, if Loki was speaking truth and was the one turned back to the path of light, it is reaonable to think Nogrod would want to see him dead. Even if Loki was lying Nogrod's response to him would also work. If Nogrod is the other wolf he would have believed Loki's claim (knowing his cohort was no longer a wolf) and believed he was the changed one. And he plots revenge and as soon as he has a chance Nogrod throws suspicion on Loki and plants the seeds of doubt in the village heads.

Roa=
He also seems quite eager to have us believe that the wizards wouldn't pick someone who was loud, but would rather pick under the radar type players.

I have never been a fan of this logic and it irks me so much when a players say something like "Well, I'm too loud and wreckless to be a wolf" and that is what Nogrod is doing. He names himself and a few other players who could not possibly be wolves at this point in time.

Sleepy=
And anywho, past experiences tell me never trust a Fea... Now then, unfortunately I haven't been able to read through the entire thread (Evil, evil, evil illness! and also random distractions) but anyway since I don't think I'll be able to get anything reasonable formed before the deadline (or rather my bed-time) -

++Feanor

*sigh* The votes of Oddwen and Sleepy make me suspect them quite a bit. (Oddwen more than Sleepy at this point) Both missed the vote yesterday and their random votes today just look like ways to cover themselves from their mishaps yesterday. Obviously no one wants to miss the vote two days in a row, but the lack of reason irks me.

Alright I find Nogrod and Oddwen the two top suspects. Though I am weary of casting a vote for either at the moment. But unless something amazing happens in the next hour I will be voting for one of them.