LotR2-TTT_Seq23

[alatar]

Note that I presume the text for this scene, the speech part that is, was taken from the TTT 'The Stairs of Cirith Ungol' chapter, which we won't see until RotK. To me, Sam and Frodo do not have the same mindset as in the movie; in the books, it's more like "things looked bad for Beren too," whereas here it's more "we do it for the Shire." Gollum too is not just sad, but almost repentent - he's old, tired and friendless in a cold land. If only he had someone like Sam - or better, Frodo - at his side. The movie Gollum is sad, but I'm not exactly sure why.

Originally Posted by Kath

The Nazgul being at Osgiliath does make sense though, as they are Saurons most feared servants, and it certainly makes the job of the orcs easier when their enemies are cowering in fear due to the screeches of the Wraiths.

I assume that the Eye has let them cross the river pre-battle? The Gondorians are afraid, but knowing that the Wraiths are on Wings would be a great help to them when the main force of Mordor begins the assault. One might expect Faramir to yell, "Archers!" and the Nazgul would have to fly a bit higher.

Why does the Nazgul stop going for Frodo when the Ring is removed from right in front of it? Precisely because it is removed. The Nazgul cannot see in the real world remember, but only the wraith world, that's why we see them sniffing to begin with, they can't see it but they can sense it. When Sam tackles Frodo they fall too far away for the Nazgul to get a clear sense, and Frodo has now forgotten about the Ring.

I guess that these mounts, unlike the dark horses, cannot see. Also one arrow stops them from flying down to the hobbits and taking a bite or two. As Frodo gets all dreamy when the Wraiths appear, I assume that they call to him or that the Ring calls to the Nine. Whichever, I would then assume that the Wraith could have found Frodo easily enough.

As to Faramir's comment about 'understanding each other', I'm not sure of it's meaning either. I suppose it could mean that in overhearing Sam's speech he has realised that the hobbits really are completely selfless, and that destroying the Ring really is the only option. And he finally shows his true colours, or quality, it's nice to see Book Faramir make an appearance.

"It all makes sense now," the Steward's son thinks, "and I should let the One Ring go East with a witless halfling that almost handed it to the enemy, his gardener and a schizophrenic punching bag."

[Essex]

very late posting on this, BUT re the nazgul/frodo scene

Is it just me or does this scene make no sense? Why would the Nazgûl break off the attack? Why would, in film three, would Sauron think that his One Ring, his Precious, is anywhere near Isengard or Meduseld? Wouldn’t he know that the Ring is now most likely in Minas Tirith? At least that gives him a good reason to assail the place in earnest.

This also didn't make sense to me until

1/ I listnened to the director's commentary and he says that he based this scene on the book part in minas morgul where frodo is tempted to give himself away to the lord of the nazgul. So I can kind of (just about) accept this.

plus

2/ I also heard that posted a year or two back (!!!!) on this site that only 7 nazgul were present at the black gate at the end of rotk - therefore as well as the WK being killed, in movie LOTR so was this nazgul and his steed, and therefore they didn't make it back to mordor to inform Sauron that the ring wasn't near isengard but was in osgiliath......

[alatar]

Originally Posted by Essex

1/ I listnened to the director's commentary and he says that he based this scene on the book part in minas morgul where frodo is tempted to give himself away to the lord of the nazgul. So I can kind of (just about) accept this.

"In the book, the Witch-King does not enter Minas Tirth more than a few footsteps, and then turns back and exits the Gate. Gandalf, astride Shadowfax was there. So we can say that the Witch-King was 'owned' by Gandalf, and so we decided to film a scene where the White Wizard mops the floor with the W-K. It has basis in the books..."

2/ I also heard that posted a year or two back (!!!!) on this site that only 7 nazgul were present at the black gate at the end of rotk - therefore as well as the WK being killed, in movie LOTR so was this nazgul and his steed, and therefore they didn't make it back to mordor to inform Sauron that the ring wasn't near isengard but was in osgiliath......

I would like to see the evidence. This so intrigued me that I just scanned through the end of RotK. How anyone counts the Nazgul at the Black Gate is beyond me, as I may have seen four-or five at one (they should have all had different colors). Will look again when they attack Minas Tirith.

Maybe there were only six after the Flood of Bruinen .

[sassyfriend]

I don't like Frodo in this scene at all! This is where I really start hateing his guts!