The Nightmare World of Tolkien

[The Mouth of Sauron]

The more I read threads like this the more I realise that JRRT in his undergraduate days must have spent many Saturday nights in Glasgow .

[ninja91]

I agree, Lal. (hopefully you dont mind me calling you that, too... )
I can think of a hundred spooks from Lord of the Rings. (including you, mouth of sauron (no offense meant ) )
Also, Halloween is coming up, and last year I was a Ringwraith. (Who said 16-year-olds cant go out and get some honest candy??? )

[Boromir88]

Don't forget gruesome killings:

Then Nar came up, and found that it was indeed the body of Thror, but the head was severed and lay face downwards. As he knelt there, he heard orc-laughter in the shadows, and the voice said...
[...]
'God and tell them so! But if his family wish to know who is now king here, the name is written on his face. I wrote it! I killed him! I am the Master!'
Then Nar turned the head and saw branded on his brow in Dwarfrunes so that he could read it the name AZOG. That name was branded in his heart and in the hearts of all the dwarves afterwards...~Appendix A: Durin's Folk

And really creepy demon horses:

At its head there road a tall and evil shape, mounted upon a black horse, if horse it was; for it was huge and hideous, and its face was a frightful mask, more like a skull than a living head, and in the sockets of its eyes and in its nostrils burned a flame.~The Black Gate Opens

Great thread Lalwende.

[Durelin]

Maybe where the influence came from...I know just how Gothic and visceral the religion is.

To think I've been called "Too Christian to be Goth!"

Quite true, though. The concept of "suffering" is still an essential part of the Catholic Church these days, even after a very large makeover in Vatican II.

I like Hookbill's point about the contrasts. Like foils. Having the black, the white, and the grey all in one novel is essential to the scope of The Lord of the Rings.

The idea of contrasts makes me think of one of the philosophical attempts to explain the existence of pain and suffering and the like in the world while leaving room for some kind of ultimate good divine presence...of course I can't quite recall the name of it, but... It tried to prove that we would not have concepts of 'light' and 'dark,' 'old' and 'young,' 'hot' and 'cold,' if either sensation or concept stood on their own. We would not truly understand that someone was 'old' if there was no concept of 'young' to compare it to.

The attempt is to say that 'good' could not really exist as we understand it and could not be fully appreciated if it stood on its own, without 'evil' to compare to it.

I like that argument, even though all that bloody nasty science behind the colours supposedly makes it illogical. *hmph*

eating human flesh

Wow. I didn't know people really looked at it that way. Ah, how ignorant am I.

Ringwraiths, faceless, cloaked, and who will relentlessly hunt you down.

I am certainly quite prepared to admit that reading LotR one night left me rather frightened when reading about Ringwraiths at some point. I thought it was perhaps the first time Frodo sees a Ringwraith, but the way I remembered the passage is completely different from the actual passage… Ah well.

I think the real scary thing is the Ring itself – it’s scary because you just don’t understand how a piece of metal can cause such destruction even within a single person. I think that might be the scariest aspect because it is the most human sort of fear, a fear of corruption, which we face pretty much every day in one form or another.

[mark12_30]

We know Tolkien wrote about at least one of his own dreams: Faramir's great wave. Maybe he also wrote about his nightmares.

[Rumil]

I did hear that Shelob et al were inspired by a nasty bite that Tolkien received from a spider during his childhood in South Africa which quite put him off the creatures, understandably.

[Durelin]

I did hear that Shelob et al were inspired by a nasty bite that Tolkien received from a spider during his childhood in South Africa which quite put him off the creatures, understandably.

Then there must a reason behind Tolkien's great dislike of cats...unless he's just one of those illogical people who 'just don't like cats...'

Now that might be a very entertaining story, if there is one.

[Laitoste]

I vividly remember a dream/nightmare I had when I first read The Lord of the Rings. I was being chased by Gollum, who was riding one of the Ringwraiths horses and wanted to strangle me. But other than that one instance, I cannot say I have ever been frightened of The Lord of the Rings. Instead, I'm intrigued by what is supposed to be scary. The Witchking's line, that Lal quoted earlier, is probably one of my favorites in the book. It's meant to be read with such malice, such hate...and though I am no dramatist, I can't help but read it out loud... But why else do I like it? I can't say, exactly. Perhaps it's because I like to imagine what I would do in the face of such power--or with that power. Perhaps not. It is fun to think about the fear you could inspire in people, if you really wanted to.