WWJ XIII: 'Til Death Do We LARP

[Durelin]

Ugh... I at least thought we had a better shot at a wolf with Ang than with CoD, and I still feel that I was justified to think that...but I do feel rather...blah.

Maybe, just maybe Rikae was killed because of her suspicions...though she did not voice too many, too much about them, and didn't until late in the Day. At any rate, perhaps the wolves foresaw some sort of difficulty? Was she barking up the wrong tree? (Other possibility: I'm overthinking this a whole lot.)

Let's look at who Rikae mentioned suspicion of:

1. CoD, who she voted for. But we've been over him again and again, and unless his behavior changes a lot, I am ready to look at a lot of others before him for wolfishness. If anyone has noticed anything about him that we didn't discuss yesterDay, please bring it up.

2.

Originally Posted by Rikae

Well, Boro seems slightly odd, actually, but I can't put my finger on it yet.

So, there are quite a few options:

1. CoD is a wolf.
2. The wolves were trying to frame CoD.
3. Boro is a wolf.
4. The wolves were trying to frame Boro.
5. Both are wolves.
6. The wolves were trying to frame both of them (or either we paid attention to).
7. I'm overthinking this (and using too much listing...that I know for sure).

Next we should have a look at the voting... I'll have to be back to do that a little later myself, though.

[CaptainofDespair]

I feel quite saddened at the lynching of Ang, who was both a wizard-character, and an educated (and thus needed) member of our little community. The loss of Rikae is also distressing, and there appears to be little to no connections between her death and the wolves.

Having reflected on the events of the previous day, I will say that I am no closer to figuring out the puzzle. As Thinlomien has apparently dropped her suspicions of my venerable person, I see no reasons to continue suspecting her (though, if she were to act out in some way, then the case will be otherwise). I am still a bit suspicious of Farael, but I do not have much to go on with him besides his relative silence. Durelin, I am suspicious of, for her contradictory statements and for I am not that suspicious of Naria anymore, since she has not posted much. Though, I would not recommend leaving her to lurk in the shadows, either.

Now, I will put forth one idea on the death of Rikae. While I am certainly more interested in self-preservation, the duty of any patriotic nobleman is to defend his people from threats of outsiders (else he may meet the blades of those people he was to protect). And this theory may not turn out well for me. One connection (which is similar to what Durelin noted) I have seen is that Rikae accused me of being the wicked cobbler. Now, perhaps the wolves were convinced of this, or were just being cautious, and decided to kill our former mortician. They could also be using that as a way to get me lynched. Either way, striking Rikae down seemed very beneficial to them in a few ways.

My one current suspect in this is that of Durelin in this matter. As I noted above, her somewhat (unless I am misunderstanding her statements) contradictory ideas are interesting me. She accused me of wolf-dom, but says there are others she would rather look at before me (only including Boromir as her other option). That is a bit peculiar, but I will certainly not use that as a request to lynch her.

However, she seems to not gain anything from Rikae's death (at least that I see).

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by CaptainofDespair

I am still a bit suspicious of Farael, but I do not have much to go on with him besides his relative silence.
........
I am not that suspicious of Naria anymore, since she has not posted much

This I think is our main problem now. Too many of us are flying under the radar. When most of the villagers hide to save their own necks the wolves have great hide-outs among them as there are too many candidates...

Of whom I seem to have no read-out whatsoever:
Farael
Gurthang
Volo
Rune
Naria

Not saying that all the others have been too straightforward...

If the wolves wish to hide, please all you commoners among the list above or not in it, stand up and speak out so we can lynch the wolves trying to stay in the shadows alone. And if by this the wolves come out in the open too, we may get them from their slips or bad arguments.

Staying nonsense or silent doesn't help us now. It may help one individual for a short period but in the end it will spell disaster for all of us.

So speak up!

Remember, if we just say "dang-dang fun-fun" or hide away from discussion, we villagers are faced with the painful situation of needing to guess in darkness as there is nothing to go on. But if we all speak openly the hard task is thrown over to the wolves as they will have to immerse themselves into the deepening staircase of lies that will present them with insurmountable contradictions as the game goes on.

This is no accusation of anything that was not done yesterDay, but a wake-up call.

You know, in the army we wake up early and hate enemies who hide in the shadows.

[Boromir88]

Thinlomien, I think at times you look too deeply into stuff, this would be another instance. I acknowledged I wasn't my usual self yesterday, because in truth I wasn't. I'm hoping that will change, but I'm a very busy man recently, and must be going soon again...so only have time for a few remarks. Though later on today looks better for me to do what I do.

However, she seems to not gain anything from Rikae's death (at least that I see).~CoD

I think the wolves would have something to gain by killing Rikae...meaning that I agree with Nogrod in that they wanted to kill someone that didn't contribute a lot yesterday to confuse us.

Durelin the one that's raising the biggest eyebrows for me. I'm not used to see this talkative Durelin that is seemingly coming out here in the wee hours of the morning to try to sway the village in the direction the wolves want it to go in. Something just doesn't seem right, here. I was wary of the interaction with Durelin and Farael yesterday, and Durelin has only heigtened my suspicion of that. It seems like Durelin is trying to get his little paws here to sway the emphasis on Rikae's posts...and therefor lynch those she suspected. When I think they killed Rikae to confuse us.

The more I think about it the more this makes sense. I find no particular reason to suspect CoD, and I really didn't get what the big fuss over Anguirel was about. This would make the Rikae kill work in their benefit to give us no direction on where to look...yet the wolves may have come out here trying to make it look like Rikae was on to something...and send us all in the wrong direction.

[Durelin]

My goodness! CoD and Boro both on me. I suggest you two read my post again...I was simply laying out all the options. Swaying? Accusations? We'll get to the accusations, but not just yet. It's still early in the Day.

Both of you are coming across as a bit too defensive in my opinion. No one has really accused you two of anything yet, so save the defense until someone does.

Edit: Oh, I almost forgot...Boro: Durelin = she, even if you think she is a wolf.

[Farael]

Well, I sort of wanted to check in... I've read all that has been said so far and I've come to a conclussion.

This time around there will be no Banshee-style Farael attacks. I can't get a feeling for any of you, much less build up a weak case that will turn out to be true.

Some random thoughts.

Why is Boromir so adamant about him not being himself yesterday? it feels like he was given an excuse and now he's clinging to it for dear life.

Is Durelin trying to confuse us?

Rikae's death makes CoD look like an unlikely wolf, but then, wasn't he suspected as a cobbler anyway?

But here's my main bone

Originally Posted by Durelin

So, there are quite a few options:

1. CoD is a wolf.
2. The wolves were trying to frame CoD.
3. Boro is a wolf.
4. The wolves were trying to frame Boro.
5. Both are wolves.
6. The wolves were trying to frame both of them (or either we paid attention to).
7. I'm overthinking this (and using too much listing...that I know for sure).

That's a lot of words to say well.... nothing. She has basically outlined all possible options, plus a disclaimer (number seven).

Now, I am known for being too careless, but Durelin is being too careful.

And yet...

Originally Posted by Durelin

Both of you are coming across as a bit too defensive in my opinion. No one has really accused you two of anything yet, so save the defense until someone does.

She does have a point.

EDIT: Improper grammar

[Durelin]

It was (and still is fairly) early in the Day, only one other person (Lommy)had posted...should I already have been set on someone as being a likely wolf? I wanted to get some sort of discussion going...and I see I have succeeded, though not exactly in the way that I intended.

That listing was as much to organize my thoughts as most anything else...and I actually wanted to maybe help others get some ideas.

Your reactions, Farael, as well as the others, are interesting.

I also realized how odd it is that Boro points out my "banter" with you as suspicious, and yet he had a bit of banter going there himself, with his "red shirts" and "keeping an eye on me." It was harmless character stuff, obviously, and my response to his "banter" was meant to be that, too. I don't know, it just seems a little contradictory (but then apparently I've been contradictory, too - would you like to point out how I have been, CoD).

It's perhaps even more interesting that you are so ready to try and distance yourself from me after Boro brought up, yet again, the "banter" that supposedly occurred between us. Then again, obviously there is plenty of reason to be suspicious of me.

But I think your reasoning behind your suspicions of me, CoD, Farael, and Boro, is really good, even though I am surprised that you went after my post like that.

Argh, I hate getting caught up in these things, and I hate defending myself. It makes me focus on myself and the louder ones, while I think the quieter ones need some more notice right now. I agree with Nogrod that those of you who are silent innocents need to speak up... I feel at such a loss right now.

A quick look at yesterday's voting:

Lommy --> CoD (CoD1)
Gurthang --> Anguirel (CoD1, Ang1)
Rune --> Volo (CoD1, Ang1, Volo1)
Volo --> CoD (CoD2, Ang1, Volo1)
Anguirel --> Diamond (CoD2, Ang1, Volo1, Di1)
Boromir --> Farael (CoD2, Ang1, Volo1, Di1, Farael1)
CoD --> Lommy (CoD2, Ang1, Volo1, Di1, Farael1, Lommy1)
Rikae --> CoD (CoD3, Ang1, Volo1, Di1, Farael1, Lommy1)
Diamond --> Anguirel (CoD3, Ang2, Volo1, Di1, Farael1, Lommy1)
Durelin --> Anguirel (CoD3, Ang3, Volo1, Di1, Farael1, Lommy1)
Nogrod --> Anguirel (CoD3, Ang4, Volo1, Di1, Farael1, Lommy1)
Valier --> Diamond (CoD3, Ang4, Volo1, Di2, Farael1, Lommy1)

Whoa...Naria didn't vote yesterday. And to think we were just waiting for Farael!

I really need to take a look at her posts...

If we go with Boro's suggestion banter or "playfulness" occurs between wolves, or maybe they employ it to lighten people's views of them, which I find an interesting suggestion...well, I'd say Naria fits that rather well, if you look at her playfulness with...who but Farael (again). Rune continues this a little bit. And Naria's next post contributes nothing, as she only remarks that she thinks "there would have been a bit more chit chat since my last post."

In her next post she does contribute, to start everyone off on the CoD campaign. She had some interesting points, and perhaps she was just testing the waters...but it certainly got us all focused on the arrogant nobleman (which he seemed to almost enjoy).

Then we heard no more from her...I don't like how that feels, though she might have a perfectly innocent reason for not being here.

Ugh, I have a feeling this post is way too long...I'm going to stop there with the brainstorming. I hope we hear from some of the quieter ones (like the ones that I just can't even find much to talk about: Gurthang, Rune, Volo, Valier...agh, four of them! Not good.), and right now, I especially want to hear from Naria again.

[Diamond18]

Well, Ang being innocent is rather disheartening. I was so sure. I thought he was behaving much like his penguin alter ego had. *sigh* Back to the drawing board.

Originally Posted by Valier, yesterday

...a retribution vote it seems, and she even made up a reason for it...

"Made up"? The fact that I had a reason for my vote makes me more suspicious than if I had zero reasoning? And how exactly do you come to the conclusion that I fabricated my reasoning and did not genuinely find him suspicious? Explain, please.


It's interesting to me that Rikae died.... Strange it hasn't been mentioned but this seems to paint Nogrod in a suspicious light. Noggie has, if I'm not mistaken, often expressed a desire not to kill off the more active players no matter which side he's on. Rikae showed up very late yesterDay and annoyed Nogrod with the apparent lack of reasoning behind her vote. If he were a wolf, I would not expect a vocal, active player to go down at Night -- at least, not on the first night, unless there was some reason to really suspect them of being a seer. Rikae, however, falls right under the kind of player Nogrod would like to kill.

Now, I'm saying this partly also because Nogrod's posting today worries me. He makes a great to-do about wake up calls and ceasing nonsense posting. Well, hello! It's Day 2. How many people continue to post in character on Day 2? Plus, it's early in the Day toDay. Why panic that a certain number of people are yet to post toDay? There are 24 hours in the Day, I see no reason why we should make a big deal out of the fact that not every shows up in the first couple of hours. So why is the wake up call even necessary? What does it apply to? In essence, what does it accomplish? Nogrod is doing exactly what he's calling on others not to do... saying much while saying little that actually applies.

Now, to look at the other side of the coin, this has been Nogrod's pet issue for as long as I've been playing Werewolf with him, so I suppose it's par for the course. But I don't think I recall him making such a fuss about it so early on in a Day 2 situation, before. It's a little strange to me when someone ratchets up their usual behavior a notch, in effect saying, "Look how much like my usual self I am being!"

[Gurthang]

Hmm... not good. I feel personally responsible for Ang's death. I wanted to return and switch that vote, which I actually meant as a joke, but I... never made it back. And it turned into a bandwagon. I'm not sure what you all were thinking... all I can say is I really wasn't.

"Yes, save your neck... blame others!"

No, I mean... I do feel like it was mostly my fault. The funeral will be at 4:00.

"The Good Book says, 'Let the dead bury their own dead.' Flee while you can!"

Anyway, for something constructive. I'd be looking at that third vote for Ang for a wolf. Fairly early, yet allows the bandwagon to pick up steam. That would be... Durelin. Also, it is extremely important to remember that, although it's an obvious move, if CaptainofDespair turns out to be a wolf, then Durelin or Nogrod could very well be wolves.

Well, since I have a retract, and don't know what the day will hold, I'm gonna go ahead and vote.

"And then go hide!"

Durelin caught my eye twice, so I'll put her name there for now.

++Durelin

See you later.

"Or not!"

[Gurthang]

That's strange: all's quiet. Not that I've been overly talkitive, but there's only one post in the past few hours.

Anywho, I did just notice this.

Originally Posted by CaptainofDespair

I feel quite saddened at the lynching of Ang, who was both a wizard-character, and an educated (and thus needed) member of our little community. The loss of Rikae is also distressing, and there appears to be little to no connections between her death and the wolves.

I'll first point out that that's wrong. There is some connection between her death and the wolves. They have some reason to kill her: maybe it leaves no trail, maybe it leaves a trail to an innocent, maybe she was right and it's a bluff. The point is you can't say there is no reason/connection. It makes it sound like you want to focus away from her death, which I might point out is the only thing that we currently know for sure that the wolves have done.

"Sounds like my kind of wolf. No direct assault; just mildly steer them somewhere else. Subtlety is the way to go."

If I ever get a chance, I'll look into CaptainofDespair. Maybe my theory about CoD and either Durelin or Nogrod isn't so far off. But it's a bit early to tell that yet.

[Thinlómien]

I seem to be the only one who doesn't find Durelin particularly suspicious. (Not that she seems innocentish either.) But I don't see anything wrong with her list of possible Rikae-killing scenarios. She just lists all the possibilities. What I would anyway have liked to find in her post is her own personal opinion of which option she thinks is correct. The lack of that is the only reason for me to be a little wary of her based on that post.

Originally Posted by Cod

As Thinlomien has apparently dropped her suspicions of my venerable person, I see no reasons to continue suspecting her (though, if she were to act out in some way, then the case will be otherwise).

Now what is the logic here?! Sorry, but I don't get your point. If I suspect you, I'm suspicious, if not I'm not so suspicious? Retaliatory (sp?) is a lame word for that logic. Care to elaborate?

Originally Posted by CoD

I am not that suspicious of Naria anymore, since she has not posted much.

Hmm...? How does one's silence make her (or him) less suspicious?

Yesterday, I did not understand CoD's sense of humour. Today, I don't understand his logic...

Originally Posted by Boro

Thinlomien, I think at times you look too deeply into stuff . . .

I might.

I can't help feeling that Gurth's bandwagoning (yes, I know that was the first vote of the day). I know that it's no wonder that many people are suspicious of the same person, but this just raises eyebrows a bit. Maybe it's just a feeling.

Diamond, I think your logic about Noggie killing Rikae is a bit flawed. If he wanted to kill a silent one, why Rikae, the one he had remarked about the day before? Why not Farael, Gurthang, Volo, Rune or Naria who he lists today as "no read-out" (I got the feeling he'd want these people to contribute/speak more) and has no visible connection with?

Originally Posted by Nogrod

PS. Lommy goes a bit too far: she willl be here 24/3½...

Note to self: always think before you write...

[Thinlómien]

About Gurthang: I got my "bad feeling" pinned: it's that he always votes early when the vote is safe and then says "I might be back" or as today, comes back. I don't like this kind of behaviour at all. It gives him a "reason" to slip away from the discussion whenever he wants since he's already voted.

And Gurth... For further referrings to Ang: he's a he.

[Nogrod]

Here's how Anguirel got lynched:

Originally Posted by Gurthang/votepost

Well, for lack of a better reason:

Since he seems more worried about the wolves poetic abilities than finding out who they are. (And for old times sake.

Originally Posted by Durelin

Ang comes across to me as someone who has 'gotten his hands dirty' enough by being definitely present and pointing out different things, but never really getting down into meaty accusations. This could be said of more than just Ang (probably can be said of myself), but I have more of a bad feeling toward Ang.
if I had to vote now, it would more likely be for Ang...he has just the right amount of debonair, but a good dose of cautiousness as well, I think.

Originally Posted by Di

At the moment the only person who leaps out at me it Anguirel. He seems to be flinging half-hearted suspicion everywhere. First, being quick to agree with Lommy that CoD seems "funny," then declaring Durelin the most suspicious, then saying Lommy's early vote seems wolfishly safe, then saying he finds Durelin and Gurthang the most suspicious but is going to vote Diamond because... um... why? I'm not clear on that. I hate it when someone voices suspicions and then does a 180 and votes for a person they've hardly mentioned, and who is not in danger of being lynched. Nice way to spread dirt and raise suspicions without it showing in the vote count.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

I think both Durelin and Di have a point here: Ang should be looked at more closely. His performance toDay could be interpreted as a very wolvish one. Funny though: Durelin and Di are the exact first persons he suspected...

Originally Posted by Di

I began to suspect him when he made his response to Lommy's suspicion of CoD, and no post he has made since has done anything to soothe my concerns. He could have voted for anyone in the same way he voted for me (not suspecting as much as others but voting for some vaguely stated reason) and it would have set off the same alarams.
Right now no one else is giving me the same bad vibes.

Originally Posted by Di/votepost

I don't like the CoD bandwagon, personally. I see little in his behavior that I find wolfish or cobbleresque. I suppose I should carefully reread his posts to see what others are seeing, but really, I already smell something fishy and what I'm catching is a whiif of:

Originally Posted by Durelin/votepost

for reasons as stated before, and because lynching CoD makes no sense to me...even though he doesn't seem like he would be much of a loss at this point.

Originally Posted by Nogrod/votepost

He threw suspicions around and made at least one 180. Not committing himself openly but still speaking a lot. Just what an intelligent wolf would like to do.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

If not the wolf, we might get the cobbler toDay...

To add to these.

Gurthang voted very early kind of promising to come back and making his vote a humorous one.

Diamond cast her vote 45 minutes before the deadline, in a situation where CoD had 3 votes and a couple of others 1 each (including Anguirel).

Durelin voted half an hour before the deadline tying CoD and Ang on three votes (others were still on one or zero votes).

Nogrod voted five minutes before the deadline effectually making the kill in a situation he could only be sure of one other voter being online (Valier) and believing more in the innocence of CoD than Ang..

So Ang basically gathered his votes in the last hour and they were consecutive votes with no other voting going on between them...

Lommy noted about Gurth's voting behaviour. I would also like to note that there were many people online and posting during the last hour (Rikae, Di, Durelin) but most of them casted their votes early and then just hanged around. Also at least CoD and Boro were around an hour before the deadline. It surely is possible they had to go away (RL) and were not able to follow the last moments...

What I mean is that also these actions / omissions should probably be counted too. A villager wishes to do her/his best to help with the good choises and to avoid bad ones. A wolf may just sit back and relax if the voting is going nicely (they know whether it is going good or bad to them unlike we).

[Gurthang]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

And Gurth... For further referrings to Ang: he's a he.

Well, uhm... I know that actually. Did I really...? Sorry if I made the mistake, but I think the her I was referring to was Rikae. Who is a she, correct?

I feel like I should have something to say here, but I'm drawing a blank. I'll be back later to see if anything significant has occured.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Sorry I am first apearing now. . . I thought I would be home earlier.

Ang is dead, I did not see that comming, well he is a wizard, he will probably return more powerful than ever. . .
Actually I am kind of suprise about the choise made by this lynch, Ang just does not seem like day1 lynch material.

I hope I will have time to make a thorough read of all events later, but I am rather busy and so far I have only skimmed this Day.

I don't like when people are very quiet and sometimes I vote for them for that reason alone. But I need to say that I am only going to speak up if I have something to say, if I don't I will stick to small post.

I am going to speak up, but not on command. If I have no foundation for suspicion what good would a theory of mine be then?

anyways I will be chekking in once in a while for the next few hours and hopefully I will have time to look everything through,

[Valier]

I've finally able to tear myself away from my hair butchering(RL) It is now a long weekend and I shall have more time to spend here. Not much has been said today, but I will put together my thoughts as best I can.

I'll start with Gurthang, who makes sense in his theory about CoD, but I agree with Lommy

About Gurthang: I got my "bad feeling" pinned: it's that he always votes early when the vote is safe and then says "I might be back" or as today, comes back. I don't like this kind of behaviour at all. It gives him a "reason" to slip away from the discussion whenever he wants since he's already voted.

This does seem odd and could give a Gurthangwolf time to sit around and watch us squirm, I find him to be higher on my suspect list.

CoD...well I just don't trust this guy, he seems almost...cocky maybe. His reasons for trusting people seem lame. He trusts Lommy now, as long as she doesn't suspect him and he trusts Naria because she is quiet. He is more interested in self-preservation which screams Cobbler to me. An innocent villager should be willing to die for the village if need be. I can't quite put my finger on it yet, but he makes me wary.

Diamond

"Made up"? The fact that I had a reason for my vote makes me more suspicious than if I had zero reasoning? And how exactly do you come to the conclusion that I fabricated my reasoning and did not genuinely find him suspicious? Explain, please.

Ok well I got home about a half hour before the deadline and I had little time to go over everything from that day. Your vote for Ang just seemed to be a retribution vote, he votes for you, you vote for him, safe.

but really, I already smell something fishy and what I'm catching is a whiif of:

I think this is what caught my eye and well it just seemed a little harsh. I did not want to vote for either of the two lynchees because I just didn't have the time to find either one overly suspisious yesterday. My vote was mostly random, I just voted for who I found stood out to me the most, just as I am not sure that is just what you did with Ang.

Nogrod seems to be "acting" like his usual self, telling others to talk more like he usually does, but this raises an eyebrow, because this could work good for him if he is a wolf. I agree with Diamond about Nogrod. And I found it odd that he was willing to kill people on the first day, because they were quiet. He just seems a little less patient then normal, which worries me.

Thinlomien, I find hard to judge. I usually tend to agree with alot she says, not that that makes her innocent,I know but I tend to think her innocent for the moment.

Durelin at the moment does not stand out to me as terribly suspisious, so I will try to keep my eyes open when I am reading her posts. I am just unsure about her yet.

Volo....well Volo is gone for the weekend. Is this any reason not to suspect him though? This could be just really good timing for a baddie.

Boromir has been a talkative player but I think that is normal from him. I have noticed one thing in the past...Boro likes to compliment people on certain things when he is a wolf...nothing yet that catchs my eye...so far anyways.

Farael, Rune and Naria....I just have no clue...I would like to hear more from them today, if possible...and it's strange that Naria or Farael didn't vote yesterday. Rune has just been too quiet for me to make a judgement yet.

So my lists go
CoD
Gurthang
Volo
Nogrodas possible baddies
with Farael, Naria and Rune bringing up the rear of my suspisions.

Lommy
Boro
Diamond
I am not overly suspisious of yet

and Durelin, I am on the fence about.