Tol-in-Gaurhoth XXVI - Úcenite Valto

[Mithalwen]

Well Sauce, you have put a spin on my actions, but I am innocent.

Apart from anything else you must know that you wind me up more than anyone else in this game and I certainly would have killed you long ago were I the wolf.

And I am innocent so the only possible option is to hope that you are too and vote Phantom. Since if you are the wolf you have already won and you shouldn't be talking to yourself. ...

Only other option is Fea is having hysterics and we are all innocent.

Will be back in a couple of hours.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Apart from anything else you must know that you wind me up more than anyone else in this game and I certainly would have killed you long ago were I the wolf.

Aw, shucks! You're just saying that to be kind ...

Still, perhaps it provides a motive for wanting to put me in this miserable position and then finish me off when all the lynchings are done ...

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Only other option is Fea is having hysterics and we are all innocent.

The thought had occurred. In which case, if nothing else, I have at least provided our Dark Lady with some amusement toDay and may be due some reward from her.

Which reminds me. She did ask that we kill the phantom ...

I'm getting to the stage where I am starting to think about tossing a coin myself. Either one of you really could be the Wolf as far as I am concerned. Good logical arguments can be made either way. And gut feel ain't giving me much help neither.

Perhaps I should just go for the tie and leave it to blind chance. There's probably just about the same chance of killing the wolf as if I were to make the choice myself.

Or perhaps I should go with my idea of saving whichever one of you I think has, if a Wolf, played the better game.

But even that is a difficult choice ...

Oh me. Oh my.

[Mithalwen]

Sauce..... I was going to honour your list of quotes with a rebuttal but I am not sure I can summon the energy since when all is said and done I am faced with a no brainer.

Voting for you would be a certain death sentence. Either you are the wolf in which case you can simply vote for me, get me lynched and devour the phantom. Or you are innocent in which case you can still get me lynched and be devoured by the phantom.

If I vote for the phantom and you are the wolf you just pick which of us you lynch, which you devour ... a question of menu....

However there is that possibility that you are another innocent and if I vote for the phantom and you maintain your vote for the phantom and we fulfil Fea's request to lynch TP there is a chance we both survive this... however Fea did say this is going on til there is only one...

It is a chance against a certainty so :

++The Phantom

[Mithalwen]

NB Typical.. cross posted with Phantom

[Mithalwen]

OK Looks as if I should bother to make my riposte after all... in the mean time bear in mind that there are very good reasons why I play neither chess nor poker...

I know I am not utterly stupid but I am no strategist. I am a pragmatist not a theoretician.

Do you not think in many ways I would love to be the wolf here, and prove everyone wrong? That I could be a successful wolf in a game played by such players - rather than just in a junior game heavy with novices and people I had never played with before? And this crazy game would suit me better than one where logic and pesky gifted could get in the way..... but that glory (and the giftwrapped Espiem segments are not to be mine ...that gruesome notion might just turn me vegan..)

I actually strongly suspect that we may be all innocent but there is not a lot I can do about that. I know we have to lynch someone. I know if I am lynched that is an innocent dead ..... You cannot be lynched.... so...

Now I am talking to myself and not started on defending myself against your charges..

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by phantom

(for those of you watching this final day as it unfolds, you can be certain of this- if SPM leaves it to chance or votes to kill me, he is most definitely the WW, I know for a fact that an innocent SPM would not vote for me, his gut and head would not lead him astray)

Phantom, with that comment, you may just have lost yourself the game, or you may just have lost all of us the game, except Mithalwen (and possibly Eomer).

It is so Wolfish.

By the way, I am not sure why you are persisting in trying to paint me as a possible Wolf. After the events of toDay, I am so obviously not. Merely a confused innocent, trying to do his best to kill the final Wolf.

Hmm, why would you do that? Surely only if you were innocent and did not know the answer? Unless that's what you want me to think ...

Ai!

I should make a decision. No sense in dragging this out further.

Problem is, I can't.

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by Mith

Now I am talking to myself and not started on defending myself against your charges..

I will wait.

But I am afraid that now I will not be back until much later.

And if, perchance, I should fall asleep before I have the opportunity to return (which is a distinct possibility, as I was both here and painfully wathcing the cricket until the wee small hours last night/this morning), the phantom shall be lynched.

But I hope to return.

[The Saucepan Man]

A parting thought for me to ponder upon.

Originally Posted by the phantom

For an answer to this, you simply must think of what sort of person I am.

Would the phantom be content to win not playing as the phantom?

Yes. I think that you could justify it in a game as strange as this one.

I also have to think what sort of person Mithalwen is. And, from what I know of her, this is very true:

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

I know I am not utterly stupid but I am no strategist. I am a pragmatist not a theoretician.

It would represent Werewolf playing par excellence for Mithalwen, as a Wolf, to have played the way she has. And so, if she is the Wolf, I tend towards the view that she deserves to win.

But I'll be back later (hopefully) when I have made my decision.

[the phantom]

Yay. I got off work early and have an extra 10-15 minutes before I have to run off to my next obligation.

Of course, it does me little good seeing as my vote is gone and I don't have time to debate.

All I can say is this- the both of you are doing an amazing job at sounding/acting convincingly innocent. There are three things that could be happening.
1) Mith is the WW and she is doing a great job of swaying SPM to vote for me rather than her.
2) SPM is the WW and he is not content to follow my vote for Mith, but instead wants to lynch me for the thrill of it, or better yet to leave it to a random coin flip which of us dies (Mith or I) in order to win in the true spirit of this game. To be honest, if I was the WW that is precisely what I would do. I would not just tack my vote on to someone else. I'd try to get both people to vote wrong. It would be the ultimate victory.
3) We're all innocent and Fea is laughing her head off.

Originally Posted by SPM

Just pondering the phantom's comments about the way he has played this game and how he would never have acted as the Wolf has in this game, nor made the choices of Nightly victims made by this Wolf.

This seems to me to be a reasonable point well made. Yet, I can well imagine a Wolfish phantom, in this particular game (being one of Fea's obvious choices for Wolf), adopting a completely novel approach, in order to throw a village full of people he has played with before and who know his ways off his trail.

For an answer to this, you simply must think of what sort of person I am.

Would the phantom be content to win not playing as the phantom?

Just answer that question and you will know if I am innocent or WW.

I've already said what I am, of course. You just need to decide if you trust it.

Originally Posted by SPM

He has, throughout, given the impression that he is inclined to trust me, more often than not included me on his list of people for whom he would not be voting, and has generally seemed quite eager that I trust him.

When I was the Seer in WW IX who is the first person I dreamed of? You.

You may think of us as rivals, SPM, but if we are, I certainly wouldn't categorize us as "bitter rivals". Those sorts are always out for blood. I am not, and I don't think you are either. We like the prospect of trusting each other, for it means we can each trust the words of the other. The simple fact is, whether I am innocent, WW, or gifted, I like to know where you stand. And if you are innocent or at least acting very innocent, I am willing to go out on a limb and take a bit of a risk to trust you.

Particularly in this village. I figured that simple odds were that you weren't a WW, so I figured early on "What the heck- I'll try my best to trust SPM. Might as well."

So there's your explanation. But naturally if you are the WW that is completely meaningless, and you're going to continue to keep me under the gun and hope that Mith will vote for me thus sealing your triumph over your "rival".

(for those of you watching this final day as it unfolds, you can be certain of this- if SPM leaves it to chance or votes to kill me, he is most definitely the WW, I know for a fact that an innocent SPM would not vote for me, his gut and head would not lead him astray)

[the phantom]

Bye bye, now.

Fea, m'dear- if I die via lynch make my death sad and tragic. If I survive the lynch and WW SPM kills me, make sure I congratulate him before I bite the bullet.