COMPASS & LOTR comparison

[Lalaith]

Golden Compass was a very unintellectual film adaptation of a very intellectual book. There was very little in the way of extended dialogue, for example, just look at rushed exposition compared to the leisurely and quite challenging intro to FotR. If anyone got any Blake, Milton or biblical stuff out of the Golden Compass I´d be very surprised...and I agree, btw that it did send me rushing back to all three to remind myself of references when I first read the trilogy.
I also agree, I think the film-makers bottled out. Not just about the religion business but about all the intellectual concepts....the nature of a daemon, the bear culture, all that stuff.
I felt Jackson bottled out too, to a certain extent (mostly in the Two Towers) but he did show understanding of the nature of heroic epic, for which I am sure Tolkien would have been grateful.

[Bêthberry]

Originally Posted by Lal1 --Lalwende

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
I've already heard of HDM being removed from some school libraries - can we expect a boycott of the next book?
.

Not in the UK. In fact the head of the church recommends that all schoolchildren read it!

I assume you are referring to the head of the Anglican Communion. It is the official state church/religion, but I do believe you have a few other sects over there which he cannot in all fairness speak for.

Sadly, Pullman has just recently been pulled from high school libraries in one local catholic school board here--despite the recommendation from the library committee that it not be banned!

Originally Posted by Lal2--Lalaith

There was very little in the way of extended dialogue, for example, just look at rushed exposition compared to the leisurely and quite challenging intro to FotR.

You know, I was wondering about the balance of Pullman's three books and how there's so much explanation of the entire concept in the first book and whether that could profitably be extended to the latter two movies.

Perhaps, just perhaps, this is a case where it would have been preferrable for the film makers not to observe the independence of the three books, but to be more leisurely at explaining it all and integrate the three. After all, PJ moved Boromir's death and that hasn't drawn nearly the outcries that some of his other 'creative rewritings' have. The GC writers could have introduced Will and his universe a bit, even Mary and hers in explication of dust and alternate universes, spent some time depicting just what this heresy of Asrael's was all about--make us feel just how revolutionary and upsetting this idea would be for Lyra's world. And why the native northern cultures were so dead set against these intruders but accepted the Intercessionists. Does it need some other narrator's eyes than Lyra's?

I did like the way dust was represented both when a character was killed and when Lyra used the Compass. Of course, visually the movie is finely done, very finely done. To one who has seen Oxford even briefly, the alternate version of its towers and buildings was most intriguing.

I wished there was more to Lyra's childhood with the Gyptians as there is quite enough proof there about the existence of 'Others' even within Lyra's world, although I suppose that single early scene with the children battling establishes her character. And I so much enjoyed the book's descriptions of the Gyptian ship as she sailed down the Thames and hid out. There's a love of a grand river there that was completely eclipsed by the movie. And Mrs. Coulter's party is such a grand way to express the nasty business of this world and that was missed too.

Of course, right now I have no idea just where the first movie should have ended, if all this was to be incorporated. Still, it is possible that the complexity of the ideas could have been given more justice if they had been spread out more between three movies and not crammed into one. However, I must add that those here who've seen the movie but not read the book thoroughly enjoyed the movie and its pacing.

But it doesn't begin with a sweet and beguiling Shire so there isn't that to draw the audience in.

[Thenamir]

Originally Posted by Sauron The White

Rule of thumb says a film needs to take in at least twice what its budget was to break even because of what the theaters take as their cut of the action.

Actually. I learned something a few years ago that somewhat surprised me. Theatres, at least here in the USA, do not get to keep any of the ticket sales price -- the total box office goes to the makers of the film, which explains why the box office numbers are so important. The theatre makes its money almost entirely on concessions sales -- which explains why a bucket of popcorn and a soda (which costs the theatre about 25 cents) is sold to the moviegoer for $10.

[William Cloud Hicklin]

However, the over and above the production budget, you also have the marketing and distribution budget- which can, sometimes, be as great or greater, especially if they run TV spots in heavy rotation.

[Mister Underhill]

Originally Posted by Thenamir

Actually. I learned something a few years ago that somewhat surprised me. Theatres, at least here in the USA, do not get to keep any of the ticket sales price -- the total box office goes to the makers of the film, which explains why the box office numbers are so important.

Sorry, Thena, but this isn't exactly accurate. Most releases have a distributor/exhibitor split that shifts over the life of the release. The studios take the lion's share of the profits for the first few weeks, then their percentage steadily drops off over the next several weeks until theaters are actually making more. So it's only the films that run successfully for many weeks where theaters see big money, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find a film where the theater is getting 0% even for the first week, let alone the life of the release.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Bethberry

I assume you are referring to the head of the Anglican Communion. It is the official state church/religion, but I do believe you have a few other sects over there which he cannot in all fairness speak for.

Sadly, Pullman has just recently been pulled from high school libraries in one local catholic school board here--despite the recommendation from the library committee that it not be banned!

All schools which receive public funding over here, including 'religious' schools (we have quite a lot of Anglican, Catholic plus one or two Muslim and Jewish schools) would not be permitted to 'ban' books. Things like that are controlled by the DCSF. School Governors could object in theory but in practice, the Department would kick them into touch pronto.

I wish I could add more to your comments on the how the book was translated to film, but I still haven't been able to snatch the time to see it, so it will have to wait I'm quite desperate to see how Oxford comes across after actually being there to see it filmed - it was intriguing seeing all the lights and cameras up on the college rooftops - though I know what Jordan College gardens will look like as they left the door to a private Fellows' garden open at Exeter and I took my chance to sneak in

The most important bit to get right for me was Lyra as she's such a wonderful character (her and Hermione Granger are two of the best female characters created lately). I saw the first five minutes of the film in a sneaky internet 'leak' and I was very impressed just with that bit...

[davem]

Another perspective:
http://www.kansascity.com/entertainm...ry/418711.html

No doubt the film’s unspectacular performance was satisfying to the critics who claimed that Pullman’s books for teen readers were pushing an atheist agenda.

But don’t break out the Communion wine just yet.

“The Golden Compass” opened poorly in large part because Pullman’s books aren’t that widely read in this country. Unlike a comic book movie based on universally recognized characters, the Materials series was an unknown quantity for most American moviegoers.

But how a film fares in the U.S. is only part of the picture. “The Golden Compass” has done quite well in other countries where the novels are popular.

In fact, at theaters abroad the film did three times the business it did in America, racking up $90 million in two weeks.

“The action-fantasy should remain a respectable, rather than blockbuster, player among families through the holiday season,” according to Variety’s prediction.

By the time “The Golden Compass” ends its run in theaters and starts cleaning up on DVD (which is where most movies really make a profit nowadays), the folks at New Line may very well have the financial incentive to plow ahead with the second film.

I mention all this because it hammers home a fact: Hollywood isn’t interested in movies that are of interest only to Americans.

Before green-lighting any production, studio execs analyze the likely success of a film in foreign markets. The bigger the proposed budget, the more important it is that the finished movie appeal to audiences in Asia, Europe, South America … everywhere people watch movies.

This has a profound impact on the sort of films that get made.

So, maybe the DVD sales - the worldwide DVD sales - could swing it & there could be a (maybe less lavish) sequel....

It all leads to the big question - why did TGC flop in the US & fly in the rest of the world?

And, of course, the ROW is a lot bigger than the US, & its entirely possible for a movie to do zero business in America & still make massive profits. Or in other words, what we might see is a Subrtle Knife movie that gets a massive world-wide release, but only a limited release in the US....

Of course its only very very slightly possible we'll see a SK movie, but not likely. New Line haven't announced the sequel yet, but surely they'd want it in cinemas in 2009 - avoiding the 2010/2011 releases of TH & its sequel - so they hardly have time unless they start virtually straight away (they were filming in Oxford last year when we were there for Oxonmoot in September, so principal photography would have to be done this year). Still, maybe its not all doom & gloom for NL on the TGC front....

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by davem

Of course its only very very slightly possible we'll see a SK movie, but not likely. New Line haven't announced the sequel yet, but surely they'd want it in cinemas in 2009 - avoiding the 2010/2011 releases of TH & its sequel - so they hardly have time unless they start virtually straight away (they were filming in Oxford last year when we were there for Oxonmoot in September, so principal photography would have to be done this year). Still, maybe its not all doom & gloom for NL on the TGC front....

I doubt the Hobbit will be out for the dates they state, so it can probably fit in there. I think the scripts have been done already and The Hobbit is still just a twinkle in Jackson's eye. If he can do The Hobbit in under three years when he's also doing The Lucky Bones and Tintin I'll eat me hat.

The figures are now also saying that The Golden Compass has outperformed Narnia in the UK, even on the opening figures.