Tapestry of Dreams, Part 2 Discussion

[littlemanpoet]

Put it this way: she'll be "channeling" Angela. No, that's not quite right. She'll BE both Angela and Indil at once, but not the fighting way or the 'now I'm him, and later I'll be him" way we're seeing it with Mellondu and Amroth. I picture it like how Roy is both Raefindan and the Gondorian husband of Mithrellas (I can't remember his name right now). Oh yeah, Imrazor, I think. Anyway, he knows his own "future" past and has memories which Mithrellas awakens, or he dreams, of his past as Imrazor. So Indil will have Angela's memories, complete with Angela's wisdom about those memories.... if she didn't, Indil wouldn't be able to cope.

[mark12_30]

WOw. Guess my stuff's easy compared to that.

I will do the best I can. I am in the middle of a spring like no other. BUt being done by april 10 is a good goal for me too. I think.

[mark12_30]

In case a bit of clarity is wanted, here's what I think I was thinking: Avarien "Followed the child" as in, Indil knew where Nimrodel is. The men did the tracking to find Indil &co; Avarien knew that Nimrodel was somewhere nearby but without clarity. Indil showed her where (or at least gave her a clear direction, 'thataway'.)

If anyone doesn't like it I'll edit. Just trying to make progress.

[littlemanpoet]

Fascinating. Helen, you have a mind for Elves. But I'm interested in the human side of this. I know that Roy will feel a joy just as powerful, if not more so, than that of the Elves, but for a different reason. The other humans, however, are going to find the laughter catching, but not knowing what their laughing about, and there should be some embarrassment and confusion among them as they must deal with these suddenly "beyond them" strong personalities. In addition, the humans would not be able to so easily dismiss the matter of Roy. There has been betrayal, and the humans probably don't understand much less agree with Erebemlin's pronouncement that Roy's doom is his own. THey'll want an explanation and certainly they'll want to be brought up to date as to what has happened.

Jorje, meanwhile, should be feeling the laughter and barking his canine head off with delight, maybe even howling with glee.

I can see writing that. But I'm wondering if Formy wants to take a stab at it too, and Helen, what about you maybe writing Ravion doing that wondering? And I'd sure get a kick out of how Indil would fit into this.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

I can see writing that. But I'm wondering if Formy wants to take a stab at it too, and Helen, what about you maybe writing Ravion doing that wondering? And I'd sure get a kick out of how Indil would fit into this.

Formy, unfortunately, is starting to descent into paper-hell, and is fighting a rearguard battle with a cold, so it'd be best not too wait on him. That being said, I am still keeping up, and a quick post with Bergil's reaction would be fun... so if I have time, I'll try and put one up in the next day or so, but don't wait for me if you're ready to move on.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

So I have come to the realization in the past few weeks that

1) sharks can jump out of the water
2) da Vinci was painting when Columbus sailed the Ocean Blue

but more applicably,

3) Indil has unresolved parent issues.

I need her to 'come to terms' with her parents' death. And by that, I mean not that she has to move beyond is psychologically/emotionally/etcetera, but that she simply needs to realize that her parents are dead and react to it, instead of having a mental block to it. Indil needs to know her parents aren't coming back. Anybody have any suggestions as to how I could bring this about without it feeling uncomfortably convoluted?

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Fascinating. Helen, you have a mind for Elves. But I'm interested in the human side of this. I know that Roy will feel a joy just as powerful, if not more so, than that of the Elves, but for a different reason. The other humans, however, are going to find the laughter catching, but not knowing what their laughing about, and there should be some embarrassment and confusion among them as they must deal with these suddenly "beyond them" strong personalities. In addition, the humans would not be able to so easily dismiss the matter of Roy. There has been betrayal, and the humans probably don't understand much less agree with Erebemlin's pronouncement that Roy's doom is his own.

That 'pronouncement' was partly due to Erebemlin's sensing multiple-- er-- layers in Raefindan, but also from the sense that Nimrodel was nearby, and his king's joy at hand, so, more pressing things to do.

THey'll want an explanation and certainly they'll want to be brought up to date as to what has happened.

Indeed; I think that is why I left the humans unwritten. Ravion will be quite torn about it all. WIll Roy indeed laugh? Interesting! I did not see that. THe rohirrim I don't see clearly either. Nethwador will catch Amroth's laughter (good call) but that's all I clearly see.

Jorje, meanwhile, should be feeling the laughter and barking his canine head off with delight, maybe even howling with glee.

Good dog!

I can see writing that. But I'm wondering if Formy wants to take a stab at it too, and Helen, what about you maybe writing Ravion doing that wondering? And I'd sure get a kick out of how Indil would fit into this.

I can think about Ravion for a little and then put up a post perhaps this evening.

I needed recreation, and this is just the medicine. Thanks to the three of you.

Fea: Da Vinci painted the great blue sea in 1493??? Wow. Did not know that. Umm, so... INdil's parents. Hmm. Perhaps Bergil and Avarien can combine for this. Perhaps Avarien/Mellonin takes a maternal interest in Indil (meep, I'm not sure I can write it, feel free) and then perhaps Bergil confides in Mellonin that Indil's parents likely came to a bad end. Once she gets that hint, perhaps Avarien can gently explore Indil's mind together with her, and help her remember, in order to help her grieve.

Formy or Fea, Feel free to write it if you like it. My head isn't in that space, at least not this afternoon.

[littlemanpoet]

My sense for Indil and the parents issue is that it rises to the surface when all the adventure has quieted, at least for a spell. That's when Indil's own emotions will take over and surprise her as well as everybody else. Something as simple as mildly tearful wish with words like "I wish papa and mama were here." And then the words themselves can evoke the stronger emotions of fear that they're never coming back and all the turmoil that goes with that.

I could post for Roy soon, but I'm not sure when. Busy night tonight (concert) and then busy day tomorrow (men's group & then youth group "boot camp" over night), so Sunday afternoon/evening may be my first chance to post.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Something as simple as mildly tearful wish with words like "I wish papa and mama were here." And then the words themselves can evoke the stronger emotions of fear that they're never coming back and all the turmoil that goes with that.

Perfect. I love it.

I'm busy this weekend too. Mostly painting, since I have a pile of professional quality paintings due to be judged on Wednesday.

But maybe this afternoon before everybody's out of classes, I can slip in and write something nice.

[littlemanpoet]

Well it's cool to see all this flurry of activity! Next time someone suggests splitting a party late in an rpg, I'm going to put my foot down and say "no way, you're asking for trouble!" Of course, there may not be a next time, depending on my other current commitments..... . I'll wait for Fea's save to be filled and perhaps for Formy to post by the end of Sunday.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Save filled. Short and sweet.

[littlemanpoet]

That was deft, Fea.

I will now wait for Formy to do the uncomfortable Bergil post that must be written before I post again.

[Formendacil]

Your words had more confidence in my likelihood of writing than I did, Elempi... Passion Sunday weekend and into Holy Week are not unbusy times for a seminarian.

However, it seems your faith was well-placed. Though posted after you, there is in fact a Bergil post up, awaiting Indil's reply that, in truth, her family is not around to be found... or whatever.

As always, I'm open to comments/criticisms...

[mark12_30]

Formy, I like that Bergil is eerie of the elves. Nice touch.

Fea. That was wow.

[littlemanpoet]

While Helen was posting, I was reading. Both of you, Formy and Fea, Wow! Fascinating writing! I'm stunned by the maturity in little Indil in the last post. It came sooner than I expected, but it just has the feel of rightness. Wow!

Helen, can you post Ravion's or anybody else's reactions to Raefindan's confession? I could post for Ædegard, but I fear I have a bias that Ædegard would not understand.

[mark12_30]

Um... we'll see, here goes.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by mark12_30

Fea. That was wow.

Thanks very much.

Originally Posted by elempi

I'm stunned by the maturity in little Indil in the last post. It came sooner than I expected, but it just has the feel of rightness. Wow!

Gracias. It just seemed right. So I trusted in the instinct, and based on your reactions, I'm glad I did.

[mark12_30]

lmp,

Be blunt about exactly what you'd like changed, and I will make it so... meanwhile the pillow calleth.

Sigh no more, pine, til the wind of the morn
Fall, moon; dark be the land;
hush, hush, oak, ash and thorn,
hushed be all water til dawn is at hand.

[littlemanpoet]

Change the first part of Raefindan's last sentence to this:

"Though my will, mind and body were used, it was another who sought to kill,..." and then finish it the way you have.

[mark12_30]

OK, done.

[littlemanpoet]

So I've been saying that it's not far from the pass to the vale. Are we satisfied with the springs of the Gwathlo as to where the vale is (in general)?

[mark12_30]

I was thinking, they march thru the night and arrive at dawn. Reasonable? Or too quick?

Gwathlo is in Eriador. Did you mean Gilrain?

[mark12_30]

Gilrain is too far west. What pass did we go over? I know we never made it as far aw Erech, not nearly. I'll try and figure out where we crossed the mountains.

[littlemanpoet]

Wow, Helen. Good stuff! I'm going to have to wait until Sat. for inspiration for dreaming, I fear. I'll see what I can do with Roy.

I'm wondering if there is something that can be done like this: the Elves and Raefindan - carrying Indil as needed - push ahead, Raefindan being rested compared to the rest of the men. And the Rohirrim fall behind (what are they doing for food???). That way, some Elvish stuff could happen when first they get to the Vale, and then the Rohirrim arrive and see some of the results, and then whatever denouement they need, and so on. ????

[mark12_30]

Having slept on it, I'd really prefer Celos. "Silver flow the streams from Celos to Erui." Legolas has introduced it to us. Since he introduced Amroth & Nimrodel to us as well, it seems only fitting.

[littlemanpoet]

Now what? Shall we have them arrive? If so, what do they find there, and who handles what, how?

I do have a notion to post Tharonwe's thoughts...

[mark12_30]

When they do arrive, I will be focused on big stress between Amroth and the mad Nimrodel. They will reunite, sort of-- but it will not be an easy reunion, not cheerful-looking at all, not particularly uplifting for any of the mortals involved.

And there will be serious stress in Mellondu's heart, who has also fallen for the Nimrodel that Amroth once knew. No happy ending there.

THose are my two main foci. What are everyone else's plans? Anyone has a happy ending for somebody? I do have happy ending planned for Mellonin and Ravion. And Nethwador and Bella can be happy too.

Erebemlin will go back to Marigold.

Avarien will find peace.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by mark12_30

What are everyone else's plans? Anyone has a happy ending for somebody?

Indil has been through quite enough to deserve a happy ending. I see no reason why she shouldn't get one. Ie: a loving family, however untraditional it may be.

First though, Elempi and I need to resolve how Indil and Angela are intertwined.

[littlemanpoet]

Ædegard and Leafa will get their happy ending. Jorje is already happy, and will remain so no matter what, considering present company. Raefindan is a tricky one. My plan used to be that he "Enoch'd" out of modern day life but got detoured by the Hand of Eru to this here and now, and that once his task was performed, he would continue to his Enoch adventure. However, with the advent of his Imrazor-ness and the possibility that he is actually an Elf in (what he thought was ) a Human body, radically changes everything. With Angela as Indil's "soul", when Indil arrives at the glade, there will be an immediate joining and Indil will think thoughts and speak words beyond her years.

But here's where it gets sticky. Angela has an "old soul" compared to Indil, but it's still a question of whether the memories of Angela's future will have any effect on Indil. Perhaps there is some kind of magical/spiritual "time-release" such that the initial lucidity in the glade disappears and as Indil grows up, more of Angela's mind and memory and wisdom wake up into her, matching her years.

But here's where it gets even stickier. Is Roy an Elf? That calls into question his parentage in modern times; after all, his lineage has had the span of years of humans for time untold. Is Roy a Human with a suddenly woken up Elven fëa? If so, how does that mesh with his modern experience with all its connections (such as his Christianity)? Assuming, for the sake of this story, that Roy really was Imrazor and has been (by special dispensation) reincarnated for the purposes of the Mysterious One, I can imagine Raefindan reuniting with Mithrellas and them adopting Indil as their daughter. Maybe that will work. Raefindan/Imrazor can eventually die at a ripe old age, being in a Human body (he can last with an Elven fëa because of the power he brings with him from his Faith), and so not "cross over against" his Roy Edwards persona. Can't have the poor bloke in two places at once.

What do you think, Fea? Happy enough ending? Are there any holes in it?

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. Tharonwë. I'm leaning toward no redemption. I can see him having a Saruman-like death.

One final thing. My storytelling energy is at an ebb at the moment, as I am again ill with some nasty bug that has me weak in body if not in mental planning; but story writing is different, and I'm tired. I'll write as soon as I feel up to it.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

it's still a question of whether the memories of Angela's future will have any effect on Indil. Perhaps there is some kind of magical/spiritual "time-release" such that the initial lucidity in the glade disappears and as Indil grows up, more of Angela's mind and memory and wisdom wake up into her, matching her years.

I can imagine Raefindan reuniting with Mithrellas and them adopting Indil as their daughter.

Say Raefindan reunites with Mithrellas and adopts Indil, who grows up to be incredibly Angela-esque: where does Roy Edwards's feelings for Angela fit into this? In his incarnation as Mithrellas's lover, do the romantic inclinations of Roy dissipate? I can see them raising Indil, certainly, as Indil is a human descendant of Mithrellas and Imrazor anyhow, and that makes total sense. But with the presence of Angela in her, I'm worried it complicates the situation...

[mark12_30]

Originally Posted by littlemanpoet

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. Tharonwë. I'm leaning toward no redemption. I can see him having a Saruman-like death.

Hmm, from your latest post methinks you have sniffed something out that I meant to stay hid. Perhaps 'twill be even better with Tharonwe woven in to the finale.