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Old 08-07-2008, 07:55 AM   #1
alatar
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alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Listening to the unabridged version during the daily commute, I noticed how, in the beginning, when Strider is speaking with Frodo and the other hobbits in the parlor, how much Strider asks that he be rewarded for the information that he has. How soon he then rewarded the hobbits with his services! I understand that, as being accepted as a companion on the road, I assume that then Frodo would be responsible for Aragorn's traveling expenses and upkeep, but how little he charges and how much more of a benefit does he show himself to be.

Also, I too like Strider's small reference to having intimate knowledge of the Nazgul. Think that the lack of great exposition actually works better, as my (and I assume everyone else's) imagination filled in the gaps, wondering if Aragorn fought these mostly obscure creatures, what powers they have, etc.

Too soon do we learn about the Nazgul, they take wing and become less frightening.
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Old 08-07-2008, 11:43 AM   #2
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Hi Alatar,

yes I agree with you on the Nazgul, definitely a case of less is more, just like Alien versus Aliens . Though they do remain quite scary throughout, what with threats of being borne away to the House of Nameless Lamentations!
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Old 10-06-2016, 08:00 AM   #3
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These last 4 chapters of Book I are fantastic. In this chapter we resolve Frodo's worries at the end of the last chapter:

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'Certainly!' said Frodo; but his heart sank. He wondered how many private talks he would have before he got to bed, and what they would reveal. Were these people all in league against him? He began to suspect even old Butterbur's fat face of concealing dark designs.~At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Perhaps we can relate to Frodo...after doing something so embarrassing, and in public, you just want to hide, go to sleep, and blame in on the ale. But he's now promised 2 private words with strangers. He's even thinking that Butterbur is against him.

I love how Tolkien gives us a chapter focused on Aragorn and learning who he is. More will continue to be revealed about him, but he makes pretty clear he wants to be king:

Quote:
"I did not know," he answered. "But I am Aragorn, and those verses go with that name." He drew out his sword, and they saw that the blade was indeed broken a foot below the hilt. "Not much use is it, Sam?" said Strider. "But the time is near when it shall be forged anew."
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Renewed shall be the blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king.
Aragorn makes his intentions very clear. But as a character, he's not quite there yet. To the hobbits, to the readers, he's just a grungy man we met in a bar who's carrying around a useless sword. Even after this chapter, he's still just "Strider." I certainly knew as his character gets slowly revealed in his chapter that he was not in "league with the Enemy." I knew he would get the hobbits to Rivendell, but he hasn't "proven his quality," as Sam would put it. He's just got a nice sounding prophecy and a broken heirloom as proof that he is the 'Great King' returning.
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Old 10-06-2016, 01:54 PM   #4
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This was a nice calm chapter (as far as it can be under the circumstances). This chapter also introduces (properly, after vague hints in the previous one) the first important major character who is going to be with us until the end, and have a quite significant role.

Strider, to me, seems on first sight maybe not "foul" in the way Mr. Baggins probably perceived it, but rather being unnecessarily dramatic and "epic" in the wrong sense: dark. I understand he had spent most of his life traveling alone in the wilderness, but he also had basically a hundred years to meet humans (and others) and therefore one would expect a bit of empathy. "They came from Mordor, MORDOR! And they are more terrible than you can imagine!" is not what you go around telling people who are already scared enough as it is. Especially towards Butterbur, who, as Strider should understand, it a common fellow doing his own, and is not very well educated (even though certainly not stupid) and "big, epic, mystical" stuff is somehow outside his league, well, towards him Strider is just terrible. If this had been a Harry Potter book, Strider would walk around Hogwarts randomly interjecting Voldemort's real name into every sentence. I cannot completely shake off the feeling that he is doing it partly intentionally, just to be mean.

Otherwise, he is of course very helpful. And so is Butterbur, once again surprisingly so maybe for some readers who might have underestimated him on first sight. Aside from having forgotten to send the letter, he is very sharp in figuring out what's going on and what needs to be done.

And the same thing applies even in larger scale to Nob (once again, a character overlooked, I believe, unjustly). Nob seems to know a lot, and seems to act a lot of his own initiative (simulating Mr. "Underhill"'s head, for instance) - something you would not necessarily expect from an "employee" of his kind. He reminds me actually a lot of the classic figure of renaissance (and even later, especially Italian) novels, the "clever servant" who is more clever or wiser than he seems on first sight. If Butterbur is the somehow erratic "master", Nob is the servant who might be in the background, but actually does the important and practical things. Or if I move away from Italian and think Spanish, Nob could have been Sancho Panza.

We also learn a bit more about how the Riders "operate" in this chapter (aside from more scary hints from Strider that he knows their number and such), and also hints on how the Rangers (here represented only by Strider) operate, that they protect the Shire, and about Strider's cooperation with Gandalf. What I personally liked always about this chapter is the description of Merry's little adventure and the mention of the "Black Breath". Whatever it is, it sounds wonderful. By which I mean, of course, scary. But it must be something pretty cool.
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Old 10-10-2016, 07:44 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc View Post
Strider, to me, seems on first sight maybe not "foul" in the way Mr. Baggins probably perceived it, but rather being unnecessarily dramatic and "epic" in the wrong sense: dark. I understand he had spent most of his life traveling alone in the wilderness, but he also had basically a hundred years to meet humans (and others) and therefore one would expect a bit of empathy. "They came from Mordor, MORDOR! And they are more terrible than you can imagine!" is not what you go around telling people who are already scared enough as it is. Especially towards Butterbur, who, as Strider should understand, it a common fellow doing his own, and is not very well educated (even though certainly not stupid) and "big, epic, mystical" stuff is somehow outside his league, well, towards him Strider is just terrible.
I can see Strider, wanting to make a favorable impression on the hobbits, perhaps deliberately playing up both the seriousness of their plight, and his own ancestry in a dramatic fashion. Maybe he would think that by coming across in that way, he would seem less like a spy for Mordor, or someone with evil intent. Sauron's servants would be more sneaky and covert.

As for Butterbur, Aragorn could have had a similar desire to convince him how dangerous the Nazgûl were, and how important it was to help Frodo. Aragorn knew he himself was suspected by Butterbur, and the Breelanders in general, so he'd want to show that Mordor was the focus.

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Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc View Post
Otherwise, he is of course very helpful. And so is Butterbur, once again surprisingly so maybe for some readers who might have underestimated him on first sight. Aside from having forgotten to send the letter, he is very sharp in figuring out what's going on and what needs to be done.
I like Butterbur. He reminds me of people I've known in RL: hard working, plain folk with too much to do day-to-day to consider much that goes beyond their routine. Butterbur never wavers in his loyalty to Gandalf, and despite his fear, apparently never considers doing anything to imperil Frodo, even though he had no inkling of the larger picture. I have to admire that.

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Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc View Post
And the same thing applies even in larger scale to Nob (once again, a character overlooked, I believe, unjustly). Nob seems to know a lot, and seems to act a lot of his own initiative (simulating Mr. "Underhill"'s head, for instance) - something you would not necessarily expect from an "employee" of his kind. He reminds me actually a lot of the classic figure of renaissance (and even later, especially Italian) novels, the "clever servant" who is more clever or wiser than he seems on first sight. If Butterbur is the somehow erratic "master", Nob is the servant who might be in the background, but actually does the important and practical things. Or if I move away from Italian and think Spanish, Nob could have been Sancho Panza.
Nob, too, seems to have no desire to help the evil invading Bree. He and Butterbur both have an innate good, as opposed to Bill Ferny.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc View Post
We also learn a bit more about how the Riders "operate" in this chapter (aside from more scary hints from Strider that he knows their number and such), and also hints on how the Rangers (here represented only by Strider) operate, that they protect the Shire, and about Strider's cooperation with Gandalf. What I personally liked always about this chapter is the description of Merry's little adventure and the mention of the "Black Breath". Whatever it is, it sounds wonderful. By which I mean, of course, scary. But it must be something pretty cool.
The operations of the Nazgûl in the Shire and Bree, are to me more fearsome than their later overt terror-raising. The enemy you barely see is always more frightening than one in the open. Bree and the Shire knew nothing about the Ringwraiths, which would only increase the fear about them.
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Old 11-01-2016, 07:16 PM   #6
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Strider, to me, seems on first sight maybe not "foul" in the way Mr. Baggins probably perceived it, but rather being unnecessarily dramatic and "epic" in the wrong sense: dark. I understand he had spent most of his life traveling alone in the wilderness, but he also had basically a hundred years to meet humans (and others) and therefore one would expect a bit of empathy. "They came from Mordor, MORDOR! And they are more terrible than you can imagine!" is not what you go around telling people who are already scared enough as it is.
I'm inclined to think that Aragorn, quite rightly, saw that these careless Hobbits needed a serious reality check. Scared to death? In one of the movies' few decent original lines, "Not nearly frightened enough."
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Old 11-05-2016, 08:36 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by William Cloud Hicklin View Post
I'm inclined to think that Aragorn, quite rightly, saw that these careless Hobbits needed a serious reality check. Scared to death? In one of the movies' few decent original lines, "Not nearly frightened enough."
Yes, we must remember the context (in both the original and the film) is that Pippin and Frodo had been making themselves all too conspicuous. And Butterbur probably needs to be warned what he's dealing with- that said, Aragorn obviously doesn't like him and possibly takes an unworthy satisfaction in scaring him.
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