Werewolf LIII: The Republic

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

It looks like Gwath and Sally will make Phantom a representative so I will vote for Kath.

++Kath for Representative

Speaking of which, where is Mister Big Mouth, erm, Big Stuff?



Blah. I should stop checking the board. I'm not getting any work done when I'm constantly refreshing, and I'm not even posting. Back in about half an hour, or when I get to four pages, whichever comes first. (Hopefully the latter)

[the phantom]

Hmm... Three people have mentioned me as a Rep candidate.

I mean, if you honestly want to do it that way, I won't order you not to. I'm just saying that if you are an Ordo you should want to be a Rep more than me, for you are able to rule out someone other than yourself (me), but I cannot rule out anyone at all, which means that you have a slight statistical advantage when it comes to WW lynching.

Unless you are just hoping to keep the WW from impacting the lynch in any way. But of course if that is the goal then the whole village can just vote for me and I'll pick someone to die.

But that hardly seems democratic.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Rune

but sooner or later there must be a werewolf who claims to misunderstand the rules in order to look innocent. . .So is it in this game?

I hope not. You know, I think that this is an issue that we can extend beyond this village. Perhaps in the future there should be some rule reading something like "You must read the rules and Day/Night closing and opening posts. If it looks like you haven't (to the extent that you don't even know what the roles are or who is dead) then you will be mod-fired." That would keep people from playing the "I don't even know the rules so I can't be a Wolf" card.

In this game we must consider who it is that appears to have done this to some extent and determine if they are the sort of person who would play such a card.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by the phantom

I hope not. You know, I think that this is an issue that we can extend beyond this village. Perhaps in the future there should be some rule reading something like "You must read the rules and Day/Night closing and opening posts. If it looks like you haven't (to the extent that you don't even know what the roles are or who is dead) then you will be mod-fired." That would keep people from playing the "I don't even know the rules so I can't be a Wolf" card.

In this game we must consider who it is that appears to have done this to some extent and determine if they are the sort of person who would play such a card.

Just a comment: off the top of my head, I can't remember a wolf playing the "I don't know the rules" card. It seems to be more of a hypothetical ploy than a real one– or is it something wolves used to do, before my time?

I can remember one who really did have no idea what was going on or what Day it was (and yes, she was considered innocent because of it).

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

I can remember one who really did have no idea what was going on or what Day it was (and yes, she was considered innocent because of it).

Yes, and that's why I think in the future it might be a good idea to modfire for doing it, for it seems to be odd that we would reward a Werewolf for being wilfully ignorant of the rules and not dedicating time to the village.

[satansaloser2005]

Actually, I'm pretty sure I have made a case against Nerwen. Not all in one post, granted, but I've said things about her here and there, before she started suspecting me, so it's not like I just suddenly put her on my suspicion list.

As for Brinn, yes, my apologies, I haven't explained myself. I will get around to it, but alas not tonight. It just can't happen. My next....*counts*....about 18 hours will be hectic, so depending on how long I'm at work I'll be around to post more specific thoughts on Brinn before the deadline.


And for now, I must be off. Out for dinner with a friend and working on my paper while we're waiting for our yummy pizza. Yay foods! *shifty eyes*

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by satansaloser2005

Actually, I'm pretty sure I have made a case against Nerwen. Not all in one post, granted, but I've said things about her here and there, before she started suspecting me, so it's not like I just suddenly put her on my suspicion list.

Sally, all I can recollect is that you echoed morm's suspicion of me. Now, a number of people– including a known innocent– agreed with his points on me at the time– but you're the only one who still heavily suspects me now that we know morm was a wolf. Logically, you can only be sincere about this if you think there's a case for it being a wolf-on-wolf ploy. Therefore you must state this case.

In the meantime, I'll vote

++Lommy for rep

EDIT: X'd since Sally at #1563.

[the phantom]

I'd like to see Green as a Rep.

++Green for Rep

[Ilya]

The Reprehensible Reps
Kath

The Notorious Nominees
Lommy
Nerwen

The Villainous Voters
Rune for Kath
Lommy for Nerwen
Kath for Lommy
Greenie for Kath

The Unseemly Undecideds
Brinn
Nerwen
Phantom
Gil
Sally
Gwath
Ilya

[the phantom]

Ah, almost forgot- we can add Gwath to the list of names that had misunderstandings concerning rules. On Day 1 he didn't say much and then announced his intention to vote himself for Rep.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by phantom

Gil- Would he no show with a role? Doubt it.
Kath- She claimed to not know the Rep rules during Day 1 (she thought only Reps could post the second half). Would a KathWolf bluff something RL like that? Though I don't like that she posted on Day 2 and claimed that she hadn't even read the thread far enough to know if she was even alive and supposed to be posting. Wouldn't an Ordo check and see if they had been Wolf-killed before they posted?
Nerwen- Her failure to cast a Day 1 vote and the fact that she claimed not to know the rules makes her look fairly clean. I mean- she thought there was a Ranger. Would a NerWolf bluff something like that?
Rune- He showed up late and acted like he didn't know we had started. Would a RuneWolf bluff something RL like that?

About those who didn't show/vote on Day 1, while I can't say anything about these specific players, I can say that there have been werewolves who didn't show/vote the first Day...so it doesn't necessarily mean innocence. After all, no shows often happen due to RL and that can't be helped whether your innocent or a werewolf. As for Nerwen, her stating that she forgot there was a ranger doesn't necessarily mean that she had to bluff to be a wolf. Even as a wolf, she could've honestly forgotten about it. The only one I could totally eliminate as a ww is Gil who hasn't shown up at all. And Kath looks more innocent because unless she didn't get the Nightly PMs, I don't see how she could miss Legate's death without bluffing (and I don't think she would).

Originally Posted by Rune

With all the stuff you have gone through it leaves me confused when some of your comments are so vague, like the one about Lommy. What comments and suspicions did she make that points to her innocens. I am assuming that it is more than just a genneral feel that you get from her posts, because if she just feels innocent then that is what you should write. . .

The quotes/comments I saw that make Lommy look more innocent were among those long quote posts...I actually did make comments about them right after posting the quote if you read them.

Originally Posted by Rune

Brinn is difficult for me to figure out. She almost always seem slightly wolf-like to me and hardly ever is and yet again I find my self wanting to see her dangle from the gallows. She makes those "qote-posts" that I am not overly fond of, at least not as long as they are not follow up by comments or are part of a longer case. I guess I find her too vague and her suspicions are often based on one thing only, she seems to be trying not to upset people.
However I did think she made some alright points in her post and it may be that she is a person that I will always suspect, because of this I would like her around for one more day.

What a meanie, you always want me dead. And you're right you always suspect me, and I often suspect you....I do think it's because we just don't agree on each other's posting styles.
As much as you don't like quote posts, I made them because it's easier for me to see all the information right there rather than search through 30-something pages. I made comments afterward...I don't know how much longer you want those comments to be. Is there some sort of standard you have? I'm not Nogrod or Legate...who both make posts long enough to write a book.

Originally Posted by Sally

By the way, I'd just like clarification. How does being happy about lynching the wolves make me suspicious? Boro and Phantom were also happy about this fact, as were hopefully the other innocents. Are you suggesting that they had other motives as well? I'm just saying.

First off, you were awful eager for a triple lynch...for someone who I think is probably innocent. We already bagged three wolves...what's the rush to lynch another player who is most likely not even a wolf? Secondly, you were so eager to lynch the two wolves you went to the effort of devising a way so that all reps would be involved rather than use the original plan to abstain, which would've worked fine. You seemed much more eager than everyone else, and if you're a wolf, using eagerness could be a way to compensate for your frustrations. Plus, if you were one of the reps actively lynching the wolves, you could've thought it could be a way to distance yourself from them. Did that answer your question?

[Ilya]

This is probably the last thing I'm going to be able to post tonight, so,

++Brinn for rep

Even though Brinn was on my initial list of suspicious people, she's doing a lot, a lot of analysis that makes sense to me, and I don't think that a lone wolf right on the heels of a double-lynch would go to that much effort.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

First off, you were awful eager for a triple lynch...for someone who I think is probably innocent. We already bagged three wolves...what's the rush to lynch another player who is most likely not even a wolf? Secondly, you were so eager to lynch the two wolves you went to the effort of devising a way so that all reps would be involved rather than use the original plan to abstain, which would've worked fine. You seemed much more eager than everyone else, and if you're a wolf, using eagerness could be a way to compensate for your frustrations. Plus, if you were one of the reps actively lynching the wolves, you could've thought it could be a way to distance yourself from them. Did that answer your question?

Yup. You're still wrong, but now I know what you mean. Thanks for clarifying, sweetie.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

What a meanie, you always want me dead. And you're right you always suspect me, and I often suspect you....I do think it's because we just don't agree on each other's posting styles.
As much as you don't like quote posts, I made them because it's easier for me to see all the information right there rather than search through 30-something pages. I made comments afterward...I don't know how much longer you want those comments to be. Is there some sort of standard you have? I'm not Nogrod or Legate...who both make posts long enough to write a book.

I know that you did comment on some of the quotes, but we are talking about 1 comment for every 3 quotes or something like that and there is little conclution connected to them.

I would be very happy indeed if you at one point only chose the quotes you needed for your post, the way you do things now just seem very mechanic. Also I belive that we need to be a bit selective about what we bring forth, as a bombardment of unnecessary information will just mean that we cannot see the forrest for the trees.

I do see how your posts can be a practical tool for some people, but to me it just seems like you are trying to win people over by doing alot of work and very little analysing.

EDIT: Cross Posted with Green

[A Little Green]

Looking at Sally...

Originally Posted by Nog on Day 1

Sally - very hard nut to crack but maybe more innocentish because of the level of her light-heartedness (she was a bit more focused the last time she was a wolf)

This seems very diplomatic, especially considering that it's his first mention of her in the game. His later mentions of her could go either way and nothing special popped out.

Originally Posted by Ka on Day 2

Though, if she was a wolf this time, she either is taking the role of a lurker, or is up to something else which I have no clue what and why. Or, she’s innocent, and just busy.

I think it's interesting how Ka here ignores the possibility of Sally being both busy and wolf.. I can't decide whether it's intentional or not. Hmmm...

Overall, looking at the wolves' quotes, I think it's interesting how little they talk about Sally in general. No, those two quotes above are not the only ones, of course, they are just two that caught my eye, but the wolves do speak of her quite little... (Of course this might be just due to reading the posts with the assumption that Sally is guilty.)

Originally Posted by Sally

Actually, I'm pretty sure I have made a case against Nerwen. Not all in one post, granted, but I've said things about her here and there, before she started suspecting me, so it's not like I just suddenly put her on my suspicion list.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Sally, all I can recollect is that you echoed morm's suspicion of me. Now, a number of people– including a known innocent– agreed with his points on me at the time– but you're the only one who still heavily suspects me now that we know morm was a wolf. Logically, you can only be sincere about this if you think there's a case for it being a wolf-on-wolf ploy. Therefore you must state this case.

This exchange I find very interesting. Sally's tone is disturbing me, I can't phrase it any clearer, but that passage is the one that worries me most. It's sort of apologetic.. no, that's not quite the word, my English sucks today it seems. Whatever. As for Nerwen's reply, it's a very good point and I think Sally should answer it - of course she might well have other reasons for suspecting Nerwen, but yeah. I'd like to hear them.

Hmmm. The material I looked at (ie. Brinn's quotes & Sally's posts toDay) didn't provide me with as much clarity as I would have wished. Sally's status remains "leaning suspicious".

Anyone around?

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I just had a look at most Gwath's posts (exept the very first) and the vast majority is simply one-liners or very very short, of course that need not be bad. The problem is that Gwath seems always to be defending him self or commenting on something, but never comes up with a suspicion. . .exept of course when he did not like Eonwe's list of suspects.

There is of course things that points to his innocents, especially the fact that he thought he could vote for him self. . . The wolves would probably have talked about voting, but who is to say if they talked about the technicalitys of voting? I think it is plausible they only discussed if they should vote for each other or not.

EDIT: Cross posted with En Lille Grøn (En Smule Grøn?)

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Rune

I know that you did comment on some of the quotes, but we are talking about 1 comment for every 3 quotes or something like that and there is little conclution connected to them.

I know within the long post I didn't give much comment, but I dedicated a separate post providing my thoughts on all the players after those posts, based on the quotes. And that's still not enough?

Originally Posted by Rune

I would be very happy indeed if you at one point only chose the quotes you needed for your post, the way you do things now just seem very mechanic. Also I belive that we need to be a bit selective about what we bring forth, as a bombardment of unnecessary information will just mean that we cannot see the forrest for the trees.

Then that would defeat the whole purpose of gathering info about who said what about one another. This is something I did more for me than anything...to prevent myself from tearing out my hair in frustration as I sift through 1500 posts each time I want to find a certain quote.