Tol-in-Gaurhoth LIV: The Council of Evil

[Nogrod]

Where's that sneakin' lil' vermin when you need him? Hey you Gollum-creature, what's the deadline?

Only two votes in, right? So it's not DL yet says my troll-brain.

EDIT: X'd with Agan... okay someone else thinks the same, good.

[Gollum the Great]

Hmmmmm.......


I thought that the DL was in about an hour. Who made up this "in 15 minutes" thing? or perhaps someone thought we were still onto 5 PM EST.

[Nogrod]

A quick-list to get some order into my own head as well.

Aganzir - not a Day1 lynch. Should be left to the mercy of the bad baddies on the first Days.

Boromir88 - see Agan.

Brinniel - the sneakiest ever ww-player who once again looks soo genuine with her happiness about having no role. Should be lynched just to be sure.

Eonwë - tends to end up being an easy lynch in the erly Days and basically turns out innocent. Not my choice toDay.

Gwathagor - see Eonwë and multiply that bad luck times ten.

Meneltarmacil - see Eonwë.

Ilya - nothing to say thus far.

Isabellkya - not seen around...

Kath - see Izzy.

Sally - see Izzy.

Shasta - see Izzy.

Strongbow - newbies shouldn't be lynched on Day1 without good reasons.


Note1. Funny that people are kind of alphabetically organised in groups.

Note2. One third not posting on Day1 is bad. Although I wouldn't have posted either if Agan hadn't told me the game was on already. So I'm not holding it against them - nor do I hold it as an rgument for their innocence. For example I came online an hour ago or something and had no idea of my role as I logged in. So it's also perfectly possible they are in a same situation. And mathematically one of them at least is against us.

Note3. We seem to be facing even tougher choices than on normal Day1 because of the lack of posting / posters. But let's not call them random. Give reasons for your votes, please, even if they aren't heavyweight-stuff.

*goes back thinking*

[Nogrod]

Blahh! The sporty-player in me tells me I should vote for Brinn or Ilya then.

Another choice is picking someone from that Gwath-waggon as I do also agree it looks more lupine than Gwath's original statement Agan pointed out. The wolves need easy and street-credible causes to use on Day1 and that one looks nice looking at the overall silence and uneventfulness of this Day. The problem is that we seem to have there the usual suspects once again...

Or maybe we should start on concentrating on this "let's suspect those who suspected Gwath of suspecting Bowie" -gang?

[Boromir88]

To be the unsporty one...

Isabellkya - not seen around...

Kath - see Izzy.

Sally - see Izzy.

Shasta - see Izzy.~Nogrod

I would have no qualms about voting for one of these four, the problem is anyone of them can just be oh so entertaining to have around.

Or, I guess Ilya.

I would think if one really wanted to be unsporty, the choice would be Gwath. (No offense meant Eonwe, just seems like he's been getting unjustly booted recently).

[Nogrod]

Of the Gwath-suspecters this looks to me the most lupine:

Originally Posted by Ilya

Gwath - I'm suspiciousish, but honestly I think it's because other people are suspiciousish of Gwath, and he looked guilty last game too, so I'm holding off on my pitchfork for now.

Nicely conditional formulation leaving a door open to act on it later as it would fit her ("no, I was not on him actualy, I said I was holding off" or "weel, as I said I have nothing better right now and I have alredy voiced my suspcion on him").

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Aganzir - not a Day1 lynch. Should be left to the mercy of the bad baddies on the first Days.

Bah people always want to get me killed by wolves! I'm much more useful alive, I tell you! Think how silent it will be later on when a third of the village is away the whole day and I'm dead.

Anyway I agree about practically everything on your list (garr I don't want to agree with people!).

Right now I think I could vote Brinn although I'm not all that sure about her either. But at least she voted for an innocent, and after her performance in last game I'm not that happy with giving her the benefit of doubt.

edit: xed with Nog & Boro

[Aganzir]

I rather didn't vote anyone who hasn't been around today. It's better to have at least a little suspicion than cast a completely random vote.

I could go for Ilya too, though.

Is there really no one else here but us three? Five votes cast out of 13 is quite a small number.

[Boromir88]

Bah people always want to get me killed by wolves! I'm much more useful alive, I tell you!~Agan

I could vote for you today and pull together a big mock-fight tomorrow to make the evil ones at night believe it's worth keeping you alive?

The benefit would be two-fold, it would save me from making a disastrous decision at the end for the ruin of all and it would certainly be helping you out. What say you?

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

I could vote for you today and pull together a big mock-fight tomorrow to make the evil ones at night believe it's worth keeping you alive?

The benefit would be two-fold, it would save me from making a disastrous decision at the end for the ruin of all and it would certainly be helping you out. What say you?

But what if people thought you were serious and decided to lynch me?

[Boromir88]

I rather didn't vote anyone who hasn't been around today. It's better to have at least a little suspicion than cast a completely random vote.~Agan

Based on probability we'd probably have just a good of a chance of finding a furry one amongst those 4 than the 4 of the Gwath suspectors I talked about. And at least those 4 would be talking.

[Aganzir]

Based on probability... Well true but I'm not doing it anyway. It'd feel unfair.

xed with Bowie. So it's now
Brinn: ++Agan
Eönwë: ++Gwath
Bowie: ++Brinn

[Boromir88]

To avoid a mass cross voting,

++Isabellyka

Sorry dear, this was a hat pull of the non-posters. Happy holidays and best wishes, no hard feelings.

Edit: crossed with Strongbow and Agan

[Meneltarmacil]

OK, I'll vote now, despite my lack of anything really solid to go on.

After Gwathagor made the bear accusation earlier, Ilya mentions that Bowie is "up to something" and also mentions suspicion of Gwath, but lets the latter slide.

I don't think Strongbow has done much that warrants suspicion, and I agree that Gwath tends to make suspicious comments regardless of whethjer or not he actually turns out to be evil. Ilya does seem a bit suspicious, and I also don't like how Aganzir flip-flops on several different people (including Ilya). I get the sense that she is trying to cast suspicion on others, yet making it appear otherwise.

For now, I'll vote for

++Aganzir

[Ilya]

Well, I'm back.

You know, it's funny to read almost everyone voicing suspicion of me but no one's voted for me. (When is the deadline, btw? Gollum?) I'm like the electric car.

As to my cleverly worded suspicion of Gwath, if I voice a thing I don't see how it gives me any denyability later. I am suspicious of him, but because I couldn't find any textual evidence - I mean, I brushed the whole you're a werebear thing off as a Day 1 ribbing - I know myself well enough to know it's because I'm leaning on other people.

Bowie: All right then, young sir, I meant no offense. It's my job to ask questions 'bout loud players I don't know. There's talk of strange folk abroad. Can't be too careful.

So, Brinn is gone unless Menel's vote got in over the deadline. I'm going ++Brinn to just be sure there's no double-lynch...if I'm under the deadline, that is.

[Gwathagor]

Originally Posted by Meneltarmacil

After Gwathagor made the bear accusation earlier, Ilya mentions that Bowie is "up to something" and also mentions suspicion of Gwath, but lets the latter slide.

I'll say this again: I was not accusing Strongbow. That was a piece of early Day 1 banter and did not reflect any serious suspicions on my part.

Anyway, I think I missed the deadline. We were out taking Narnia pictures in the snow.

Gollum probably won't count my vote, but out of principle and hurt feelings:

++Eonwe

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Aganzir

Bah people always want to get me killed by wolves! I'm much more useful alive, I tell you!

Now either I must have faulty logic toDay or... then this is físhy indeed!

[Nogrod]

If I'm around to watch you Boro toMorrow I will certainly use a magnifying glass for it! That vote was just an outrageous throw-away!

[Boromir88]

That vote was just an outrageous throw-away!~Nogrod

Yep but be sure you want to rattle this one's cage before you step into the ring.

[Nogrod]

Anyone else for Ilya?

I could settle down with Brinn as well but would favour Ilya.

Nog you always get more paranoid when the deadline draws near.

Paranoia is my second name...

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Paranoia is my second name...

Haha it's just funny that you so often seem to post one-liners throwing suspicion around when it's just a few minutes to the deadline.

[Nogrod]

Okay then.

++ Brinn


A cage for a wizard, Boro? Or is it a wolf that lurks under your cloak and is caged for reason?

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Eönwë

Anyway, I rejected this idea- I don't think I made i that fact clear enough in my list though (I tried to do it in the last sentence, but it obviously didn't come out right).

Yeah I understood it, I was just curious.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Now either I must have faulty logic toDay or... then this is físhy indeed!

I was talking about my daily activity compared to many others. Sorry if I'm unclear, I'm tired.

Nog you always get more paranoid when the deadline draws near.

[Aganzir]

++Brinn

I prefer her over others who have been voted.

[Meneltarmacil]

To answer your question, Aganzir, you initially said this about Gwathagor:

Also, I'm suspicious of Gwath because of his maybe-you-knew-because-you're-the-bear comment

and then followed it up in other posts with things like this:

Guilty
Gwath. Because of that "Maybe you are the werebear and that's how you knew." suggestion.

and

I dare guess that if people were suspecting Bowie very much now because of that, you wouldn't be saying so.

Later on, however, you seemed to change your opinion with this statement:

My first comment regarding Gwath was more of an attempt to get some talk than a real suspicion.

(Gwath was clearly listed as "Guilty" by you earlier, though...)
Also, despite your discussion about Gwath with Boromir88 afterward which yielded the "Guilty" comment, you made this statement:

I was the first to come up with the subject but I haven't been pursuing him since.

Add that to the continuous suspicion of Brinniel the unjustly killed, and things don't look too good.

Well, that's all for now, as I grow weary and must retire to the giant treasure heap in my lair for some rest.

[Aganzir]

Those familiar with my playing know I always roughly divide people into Guilty, Innocent and Neither categories. One can always ask himself how much trust they should lay on these lists made before there has even been 20 posts.

My first comment regarding Gwath was an attempt to get some talk instead of a real suspicion. I tend not to be all convinced someone is a baddie just because of one weird comment, and later on I found it reasonable to change my initial opinion.

By saying I hadn't been pursuing Gwath after the start I meant I hadn't come up with new things pointing at his guilt.

On who else did I flip flop? How did I flip flop on Ilya? How was I casting suspicion on people while trying to appear I didn't?

And as for you, Menel, earlier you were all for suspecting Gwath but after hours of non-activity you came back, saying Gwath has a tendency to make suspicious comments regardless of his role, and attacking me because I changed my opinion on him. Why can you do it if I can't? I could accuse you now of flip flopping on Gwath, and vote for you, and my vote would be perfectly as just as yours for me.

Also, forget what I said about Nog not being a baddie because of Boro's death. As long as we don't know why there was just one kill (ie if the teams take turns in killing or if one team just refrained from killing for one reason or other) we can't be sure. It's still possible Nog's a baddie and it was the other team that's responsible for killing Boro.

Guilty
Menel worries me slightly but I acknowledge it is probably more due to his (in my opinion) irrational suspicion on me, plus I always find his playing style suspicious.
Ilya. Her comment that Bowie looks like he had a role was not a thing I would have expected an innocent to say. Just because it'd be dangerous for Bowie if he was, say, the seer. Also, her honesty is a thing that contributed to my suspicion on her in last game. Just because it'd be such a good cover for a newbie-ish baddie. Irrational I know but I can't help it.

Innocent
Eönwë
Gwathy. The amount of suspicion cast on him yesterday was more suspicious than his bear comment, and after that he's been looking quite innocent. Besides I take pride in being a rather good Gwolf-catcher , and he hasn't been giving off any baddie vibes thus far so I'm not worried about him.
Bowie is the one I feel the least confident about but I'm ready to consider him innocent as well.

Neither
Nog. Gah I just don't know. However one thing is sure: he didn't kill Boro.
**
Isabell
Kath
sally
Shasta

Also, I can tell you it's depressing to come online after sleeping like ten hours and having breakfast and doing all kinds of stuff to be met with just one post after mine...