T-I-G LXVII: The Rangers of the North - The Fell Winter

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

All right, hm, I guess this Berserk episode slightly changed the balance again in contrary to yesterDay's rather succesful (despite the death of Hakon) aftermath. I mean, I would have considered yesterDay as quite a lucky turn of events, because it seemed evident that Rune would probably have remained alive and unlynched as the fact that he'd become a Captain would save him. So all in all, Hakon did a really good job. A pity, I might add now, that Mac hasn't been so succesful himself.

However! That could bring us to some clarifications here. At least as to better determine the position of the Wolves. Though quite likely, if I were one of them, I would choose the kill in the attempt to leave as little trail as possible - given that there is already one dead Wolf, which might serve us as guideline to others. But let's see.

I guess we should check Mac's posting yesterDay, if there's any reason why he would be killed OR why he would NOT BE FEARED TO be killed - and also the Rune-Captain-voters (that probably the most of all). I have been discussing this matter already a bit with my chosen bodyguards toNight and we basically agreed that it makes sense for the WWs to have tried to put Rune into the leading position, at least one of them could likely vote for him. Maybe? In any case, the probably most "guiltily" voting person, Inzil (votes for Rune-Captain and for Hakon's lynch) is dead, and it's quite easy, I believe, to see Mac's logic behind this. I would have thought in the same way, likely. But I think it's certainly good to take a look at the others.

I really don't want to stay awake here for a long time, as I need to get up at some reasonable time tomorrow and it's already quite late here, but I hope at least something will be left here for you to evaluate. And maybe my BGs could tell you, if you wish to know, of some things we have discussed over the Night (though there's nothing too big. And I can speak of my impressions about them later during the Day). And in case somebody didn't figure that out of the narration, Fea and Nienna were my BGs toNight.

Btw. One topic to ponder (after other things, but just to say it before I am gone) - as I figured out, the Captain really can adjust his lynch-stopping powers only on the second Day of his Captainship, if he is still in office, so... do you folks want to change your Captain, or are you fine with keeping me at least one more Day (it would also help me to kind of make a better picture of things, being able to pick more BGs on the next Night) and then just see? Of course it's all the matter of how much you trust me etc., but even for further "usage" of the Captains, I have been thinking that given how the rules are, it would perhaps be better to just have them for at least these two consecutive Days. So one more thing you can think of or discuss or ponder while I am not around.

I will probably check back yet in a short while, but I'm really going to sleep in some fifteen minutes now.

EDIT: ugh, x-ed with already a score of people

[Roa_Aoife]

Boromir- He goes first because I suspected him first.

Post 1- banter

Post 2- seems to think being an NG or BG saves you from lynching, more banter

Post 3- banter

(This post I found irksome, as he was clearly present but refusing to actually participate.)

Post 4- Excuses Rune’s bid for power as Rune being Rune. [i](Oh, really?) Now infamous questioning of Fea’s motives (My first reason for suspecting him), quote contest (wrong forum)

(Say what you will, to me it looked like a wolf trying to sew suspicion and then back-pedaling later when it started to go bad for him.)

Post 5- Further expounds upon what he’s “not convinced” about with Fea (I still have no idea what he was trying to get at) says he’s going to pick a captain either on who he trusts or on whoever jumps through the most hoops for him

(You would give away the role of captain on such flimsy grounds as who’s willing to please you?)

Post 6- Response to Roa’s questions, says that asking for clarification on a comment is not a crime, (That didn’t actually answer the question I asked. I asked what he thought Fea could possibly be up to by using his name to dumb her retractables. He never came up with anything.) Says he would consider Nerwen because she got his question right, along with Rune. (Now I have to wonder if he intended to vote for Rune all along. Was Nerwen ever really in the running, or was it all a ploy? Why was he considering Rune? As far as I’ve read, no one else was seriously considering Rune for captain except Rune. Boromir was the one who really started pulling for him.) Explains that his quote was about him being unconvinced, says Legate misrepresented the situation, (which I don’t think Legate did), and that he’s dropped the issue about Fea already, and now is simply responding to people asking him about it (Again, this looks very much like a wolf back-peddling after a plan went bad)

Post 7- explains absence

Post 8- Asks Roa if she’s tense, thinks Roa is blowing the Fea thing out of proportion, compares Fea’s comment to someone trying to claim that a bandwagon is not a bandwagon, thinks Fea has something up her sleeve (I still don’t see what his thought process was for this, and he has yet to come up with a plausible scheme for Fea to have been trying) thinks Roa isn’t looking at it from his perspective, assumes that he was picked for a reason (there is no basis for this claim) asks Nogrod for rule clarification

Post 9- Agrees with Legate about band-wagoning on minor issues (of course) says to vote for him if we find him suspicious, says he won’t be the worst loss for the village, says he has been answering the questions, even though the answers may not be satisfactory, says Fea has a history of wanting him dead early, and he wants to know why in this game (Firstly, Fea has made no attempts on him in this game. She didn’t even use lynch votes to dump her retractables, she used captain/guard votes. There is no reason to assume that Fea wants him dead.)

Post 10- Votes Rune for Captain and Inzil for NG (He started the vote for Rune as captain because he liked Rune’s campaign speech? Not on someone you’d trust or want to protect, but you give the most powerful role into the village to someone just because he wants it?)

Post 11- Says it doesn’t matter if a gifted is made NG, BG, or captain, because then they’re protected even if they can’t do their jobs (What is the point of having gifted if they don’t do anything? That only benefits the wolves)

Post 12- Clarification on rules

Post 13- explanation on highlighting

Post 14- Thinks Val is a wolf, quotes Valier bantering with Fea (Was that your evidence against Valier?)

Post 15- Admits that his suspicion against Valier is only a hunch based on her light attitude throughout the day (Is Valier ever otherwise?), says no one has had any decent reason for suspecting anyone except Roa (An odd statement) but thinks he does now (didn’t he just say that he didn’t?), says we need more suspicions in the village instead of letting Roa do all the work (a statement I agree with)

Post 16- Admits that he was silly to start with, but says that Valier has been excessively so (He excuses Rune-wolf’s bid for power Rune being Rune, but suspects Valier for being Valier) says Roa should relax herself and not work so hard (I appreciate the thought, but it’s not needed. For all my complaints, I love the way I play the game.) Says he’s named people he wants to keep and people he suspects, and has spoken with his votes (Again, sorry for upsetting you, I’m well aware of your opinions, and I can’t fault your activity level. It’s your reasoning I disagree with or don’t follow, and that raises red flags in my mind.)

Post 17- Agrees with Valier

Post 18- Accepts Roa’s apology (thank goodness) doesn’t like Nerwen’s vote for him, says he hasn’t made a big deal out of the Fea thing but has only been defending himself (This much is true, and it gives me some pause. I may have a look at Nerwen again)

Post 19- Thinks Rune’s bid for captain has also been blown out of proportion, doesn’t like the vague words being used, says just because you don’t think someone would be a good captain doesn’t mean they’re a wolf. (Actually, the only things in my mind that make a “bad” captain are lack of availability and being suspicious. If I think someone’s a wolf I don’t want them to be captain. If I don’t think someone is a wolf, I do want them to be captain, unless they can’t be there for it, which again, gives me pause to think over the people who didn’t find Rune suspicious, but also didn’t vote for him as captain.)

Post 20- Says that if the wolves lynch him it would cost them, but agrees that he shouldn’t be NG. (This looks like a really obvious gifted hint, which a real gifted wouldn’t make)

Post 21- clarifies that the vague words comments were directed towards Sally, Lommy, Nienna, and Kath, open defense of Rune (an innocent move or a wolf making a gamble? An innocent has no reason to trust anyone at this point, and the points against Rune are viable and legitimate, so why try to disprove them? Also, Valier made no claim about wanting to be captain, so I don’t know what he’s getting at, except to say there isn’t a conspiracy. As there are wolves in the village working together to bring the village down, I would say that of course there’s a conspiracy.) Says that using connection at this point are premature.

Post 22- Says he wasn’t making a gifted hint, but that it’s difficult for people to lynch him, and anyone who’s involved in his lynch gets in a tight spot. (That’s true for any innocent who’s lynched, easily or not)

Post 23- agrees that he doesn’t want to see Rune lynched, but wonders why Valier and Mac feel the same (Why didn’t you want to see Rune lynched?)

Post 24- Votes Lommy for lynch (Wow, that came out of the blue) because she says he’s not acting like himself and she finds him suspicious, but isn’t sure about lynching him. (He keeps suspecting people who suspect him on what he calls poor reasoning. Either he’s being paranoid and egotistical, or… no, paranoid and egotistical fits the bill quite nicely here )

Post 25- Wonders why Sally is a last minute bandwagon choice. (Sally didn’t even get a vote, so I don’t know what he’s talking about.)

Post 26- Thinks Lommy is setting herself up to vote for him when the timing is right.

Post 27- Says he hasn’t suspected Roa for suspecting him because he sees logic and reasoning in her arguments (Thankyou, so do I.) Says Lommy has said the same thing about him 3 times. (This is true, and I see his point in it. But the Lommy I know is almost always hesitant with her votes.)

End of Day 1. I must say, I appreciate the volume of his posts and his level of activity. Some of the things he’s said I really can’t argue with, and some of the things he’s said has drawn me to look at other people. Still, some of what he’s said has had very poor reasoning or no reasoning at all. And he never mentioned why he wanted Rune to be captain so badly other then Rune wanted it. The fact that Rune wanted it was suspicious, and his method of trying to get it was suspicious, but Boromir excused all of his behavior as “Typical Rune” while not extending the same courtesy to Valier (who’s always light hearted) or Lommy (who could start a restaurant with all of her waffles). I’d like to hear why he threw his support so squarely behind Rune-wolf on such poor reasoning, not just wanting him as captain but trying to keep him from being lynched. And he would have gotten away with it, too, if it hadn’t been for that pesky hunter Hakon!

[Roa_Aoife]

Also, I have a paper to finish and a quiz to prep for, but I'll be back soon. With more analysis.

(BTW- the paper I have to write is for class teaches us how to use logical argument to prove our own points as well as to debunk the points of others. Yes, I'm loving it.)

Edit: crossed

[Roa_Aoife]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Btw. One topic to ponder (after other things, but just to say it before I am gone) - as I figured out, the Captain really can adjust his lynch-stopping powers only on the second Day of his Captainship, if he is still in office, so... do you folks want to change your Captain, or are you fine with keeping me at least one more Day (it would also help me to kind of make a better picture of things, being able to pick more BGs on the next Night) and then just see? Of course it's all the matter of how much you trust me etc., but even for further "usage" of the Captains, I have been thinking that given how the rules are, it would perhaps be better to just have them for at least these two consecutive Days. So one more thing you can think of or discuss or ponder while I am not around.

Really? The rule clarification just makes me want to move captains along more. An innocent captain still stands a chance of fouling things up (and if we're going to foul the lynch up, we may as well foul it up as a village, and not leave the decision up to one person), a gifted captain wouldn't be able to use their abilities, and a wolf captain with that kind of power would be truly devastating. No, thank you. Decide a tie, but more than that is too dangerous.


Edit: crossed

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

++Roa as New Captain

Because she speaks such lovely sense.

[Nienna]

Fea, my love, I cannot figure you out.

[Nienna]

In my opinion we should either stick with Legate or go without a captain. I think switching a captain daily would be sort of a waste.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

I think we'd be better off without a Captain, but that would be kind of like a Republic game without a filibuster. If the mod says we can do it, who are we to choose not to?

And so, limit the power. Checks and balances.

If we switch Captains, we can keep any one person from gaining too much power.

[Roa_Aoife]

*sigh* Having read the Admin thread, just forget everything I said about Boromir.

(all that work wasted!)

[Roa_Aoife]

Originally Posted by Nienna

In my opinion we should either stick with Legate or go without a captain. I think switching a captain daily would be sort of a waste.

The captain still decides ties. But to have one person able to cancel the lynch or change who gets lynched, especially if that person may be a wolf, is dangerous.

[Roa_Aoife]

The people who voted to lynch Hakon are: Fea, Greenie, Inzil, and Mac. Mac and Inzil are known to be innocents, so that leaves Fea and Greenie

The people who voted Rune for captain are: Boro, Valier, Loslote, Rune (), and Inzil. Rune and Inzil are dead, so that leaves Boro, Valier, and Loslote.

People who tried to reason in favor of Rune, but did not vote him as captain: Legate (post 180, 191, 207, 222), Greenie (post 215), Mac (post 197, 220), Lommy (post 185, 236)

Greenie shows up on two lists. And Legate does a lot of very subtle "Rune's probably innocent" suggestions with out committing.

Edit: fixed smiley