T-I-G LXVII: The Rangers of the North - The Fell Winter

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Of course, wolves need to watch out for the hunters in this game, but it's not so bad for them with the master hunter gone, so it does make to take Mac's opinion of people into account but maybe not too much. (This would make Sally and Nienna look more innocent and Kath, Brinn, Roa and Legate look more guilty. It is funny that Nerwen arrives to the opposite conclusion.)

You misunderstand me... or maybe I wasn't clear enough. I should have put the word "look" in italics or something. I was trying to work out what, if anything, Mac's death might have accomplished for the wolves. (i.e. I basically had the same conclusion as you.)

EDIT:X'd with Lommy's last post; added comment.
EDIT2:In fact I believe I will put it in italics.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

You misunderstand me... or maybe I wasn't clear enough. I should have put the word "look" in italics or something. I was trying to work out what, if anything, Mac's death might have accomplished for the wolves. (i.e. I basically had the same conclusion as you.)

By which did it accomplish that Sally and Nienna look more guilty?

In case it hasn't been phrased clearly enough by anyone toDay, I call for a Captaincy Vote. (Just to make an official statement, but I don't think it has to be done because people have already cast new captaincy votes.)

++Roa for Captain

Now I'm off to use my last half an hour or so for solely determining who's guilty.

[Thinlómien]

Okay, a list:

Innocentish
Fea - she's difficult to judge, but for now she has been speaking so much sense that I feel more comfortable with her than with most
Nienna - seems genuine and Mac's death points at her innocence

Positive Middle
Sally - I'm rather unsure because she seems both innocent and guilty but neither to an overt extent, possibly leaning a bit to the innocent direction because of Mac's death, but I wouldn't want to make a hasty conclusion considering someone whom I'm so confused about
Roa - I know I said I think her innocentish and voted her for Captain but to trust Roa (especially as early as on Day2) is not something I'd do without reservations, so I'm putting her here instead of the innocentish category also to remind myself not to be lulled into false sense of security because of her general charisma and ability to make sense and good points
Legate - the more I talk about him, the more confused I get, but there's nothing too bad yet
Gwath - has been under my radar quite a lot but then again he seems perfectly okay when he posts

Negative Middle
Kath - I'm still vaguely uncomfortable with her but to be honest I must say she hasn't done anything incriminating
Greenie - she makes me uneasy because she's so sticking to what she always says about people (look at her list from yesterDay), but no actual alarm bells are ringing
Nerwen - like I said, no idea, but seems slightly cobblerish
Brinn - I have to confess she's been under my radar more or less completely, and that scares me

Guiltyish
Loslote - voted Rune for a Cap and I believe at least one fellow would've probably done so, otherwise nothing too bad
Valier - what I said about Los, and also the fact that her tone toDay does seem insincere, somewhat reminding me of past valierwolves

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Someone asked what the Night people thought of each other.

I didn't trust Legate at all. I currently trust him quite a lot more, but this stems from confusion with rules which I need to double check. Yet again. *grumbles about complicated rules* Once I have time (if I have time) I'll check on this and get back to you.

I am neutral about Nienna.

Either way, it's not hard to trace my feelings about Captain: I didn't vote for Legate, and first thing this Morning I voted for a different Cap. Sorry, LeDoor, you just don't have me convinced that you have the village's best interest at heart.

++Lommy as Guard

Curiosity.

I'm not sure how much I'll be around today. Things to do, places to go. I'll try to be around before deadline.

Note to self: *must* check those rules.

[Thinlómien]

Haha, just realised my list is quite beautifully symmetrical. Nice. But it's good to notice I suspect half of the village at least a bit, because normally I have problems finding suspicious behaviour.

++Valier

is the best suspicion I have.

I might yet be back, and if I am I may change my vote if the situation or my opinions have changed. But for now it should be ok.


edit: xed with Fea - and thanks for the vote, I guess

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

By which did it accomplish that Sally and Nienna look more guilty?

Yes– not meaning that they're actually gulity, but that it might be an attempt to make them look that way, though as a frame it would only be a weak one. EDIT: Is the point you're making that a lupine Sally or Nienna would have been too afraid to attack Mac, in case he was a Hunter? Sorry, I'm being rather dense at the moment. I'm tired.

As you see we're getting into double-triple-quadruple bluff territory now. That's the trouble: my hunch is that he was probably killed for a reason, rather than being a no-trace kill, but there's too many possible reasons.

I think it probably would be a good idea to switch Captains often, but I don't know about every Day. I think we could stick with Legate for another Day... I mean, your plan, Lommy, seems to be ensuring that the Captain never uses his full powers.

EDIT:X'd with two Lommys and one Fea.
EDIT2:Clarification.

[Thinlómien]

Happened to come back and see Nerwen's post -

actually yes, I have nothing against having a Captain if it's someone whose judgement I trust (and there are all kinds of beneficial side-effects), but I don't want to have a fully powerful Captain: there's no one I'd like to give the right to potentially overrule the village's decision, not even myself.

Now I'm gone for good. Bye!

[A Little Green]

All right, I'm here.

Originally Posted by Roa

The people who voted to lynch Hakon are: Fea, Greenie, Inzil, and Mac. Mac and Inzil are known to be innocents, so that leaves Fea and Greenie

The people who voted Rune for captain are: Boro, Valier, Loslote, Rune (), and Inzil. Rune and Inzil are dead, so that leaves Boro, Valier, and Loslote.

People who tried to reason in favor of Rune, but did not vote him as captain: Legate (post 180, 191, 207, 222), Greenie (post 215), Mac (post 197, 220), Lommy (post 185, 236)

Greenie shows up on two lists. And Legate does a lot of very subtle "Rune's probably innocent" suggestions with out committing.

Originally Posted by Legate

I am not sure what you mean by people "to reason in favour of Rune", but at least from my part, and I got the same feeling from the posts of all the others you name as well, it was just saying "I don't want Rune for Captain, but I am not comfortable with lynching him either".

Yeah, Legate pretty much summed up what I was about to say about "trying to reason in favour of Rune". As for voting to lynch Hakon, my reasons were weak but the best I had. (And now, of course, I know they were wrong.) What I find interesting is that the Hakon-voters and the Rune-voters (I'm talking about lynch votes) actually had quite similar reasons for their suspicion ie. finding an open will to become Captain suspicious.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

GREENIE
Guard: No-one
Captain: Legate
Lynch: Hakon

Whoops, it seems I was really not at my best yesterDay seeing as I also forgot to vote for a Guard (and only noticed it now...) I promise to try harder toDay!

Originally Posted by Lommy

Greenie - she makes me uneasy because she's so sticking to what she always says about people (look at her list from yesterDay), but no actual alarm bells are ringing

I know! That's always the problem with me, especially early in the game. For example, I don't think I'd be that lousy at reading Brinn if I wasn't so conscious of how bad I am at reading her... As for seeing that as a sign of suspicion, well, all I can do is use the worst argument ever: that's what I always do, regardless of my role.

[A Little Green]

Oh, and about the Captain: I'm fine with keeping Legate. I voted him for Captain in the first place because he seemed innocentish and sensible, and in addition to that I'd like to see what he does as Captain. I think what most of us have overlooked is that a player's actions as Captain can really tell a lot about the said player. I agree with what seems to be the general consensus that we should keep changing Captains regularly. I have nothing to say about the full Captain powers as I'm not convinced either way.

Also, I'm not entirely comfortable with having Roa as Captain. I think I already said something about this yesterDay. This has nothing to do with suspecting her (she's in the very middle of my no idea -category, in fact) nor with disliking her playing style (as I like it a lot). It's just that she's a very influential player already now, and I fear that if she was elected Captain this village might be in danger of becoming too much led by one person alone.

[Nienna]

I agree with Greenie about captains.

Here is a quick analysis of Nerwen:

42. Answers one question from Boro’s quote, says we need to take the Captain thing seriously and is suspicious of those people who actively say they want to be captain

Wolf-Nerwen on Bold-Wolf-Rune? Doesn’t feel like it.

43. Doesn’t know what Fea and Boro are doing or why Fea shed her retractables

Popular opinions

96. Defends Fea’s use of her retractions on Boro, asks Legate why he picked me to ask about innocence and what he concluded.

Seems fine

128. Says the problem is that anyone who would make a good captain would also make a good were-captain. Votes Roa for captain as she has more leadership qualities than Rune, votes Kath for NG as it seems the wolves like to kill her off early

Both these seem reasonable

143. Says that Hakon is being weird

149. Says that Hakon has to be a wolf eventually but she thinks that if he was a wolf his pack mates would have advised him against doing what he did.

I’m not really sure what “he did” that is being discussed which worries me

160. Votes to lynch Boro because of the Fea thing, has no other real suspects except Hakon but doesn’t want to vote him because of what happened last game

She did have some suspicion of Boro so this seems fine though it almost feels like she is trying to get the village to suspect Hakon without voting for him herself.

263. Makes a very weird midNight post on the game thread.

Very weird.

298. Congratulates Hakon for a job well done, makes a good point about wolves trying to not change their playing style from normal, makes a point that the wolves may not have wanted to openly support Rune but having him as Captain would have been such an advantage that they probably pushed for it

Very good point about the wolves, though congratulating players for helping the village can feel superficial

301. Wonderful vote table, shows connections between the Rune for Captain voters. She makes Val and Lottie look bad but then reminds us that Zil would have looked guilty too

She seems like she is trying to give us as objective view as possible

304. Puts all of Mac’s posts together. Notices that killing him would make me and Sally look bad while making Kath, Brinn, Roa, and Legate look good, mentions she’s surprised the wolves didn’t leave him alive to frame him.

I agree.

310. Clarifies her previous post and agrees with Lommy that because killing Mac would make Sally and I look bad we look more innocent

In conclusion: Nerwen is looking more innocent to me than guilty. She makes some good points, says logical things about players, tries to be objective (or at least make it look like she is trying to be objective)… basically she is going on my leaning innocent list but I will continue to look at her.