Scarburg Meadhall Discussion Thread

[Nogrod]

Groin, we're in Tolkien's Middle-Earth, not in the Christian Middle-Ages of Europe...

Even the Vikings were more civil.

And the "ordeal by combat" (I'm not sure what the actual historical term actually is as in Finnish it's called "God's verdict") was only between even persons by class... eg. two noblemen, two knights etc. and the winner was winner by God's favour - so if an "oldtimer" and a young "bodybuilder" met in a challenge (probably not initiated by the gaffer ) it was God's will the muscle-hero was more pleasing to him and had right on the issue.

But fear not, lord Athanar is not going to suggest to burn Lithor on the stake, mutilate him, or anything like that. Actually he's planning an overall deal between the nobles for all that happened- and Lithor will bear some blunt of it. But he will also have a chance to talk openly against W & W of the late evening's happenings...

[Groin Redbeard]

That is a fun idea Formy, Nogrod. Will Nain be invited to the council to watch, or is this strictly a human matter?

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Even the Vikings were more civil.

I'll bite my tongue with that remark.

But since you brought up Vikings, they used a method called Jernbyrd 'carrying of (hot) iron' (Old Norse: Járnburdr). The Christian church introduced the Vikings to ordeal by fire. The most common method was to grab a piece of iron from boiling water and walk 9 paces with it carrying it in ones hands. This way of deciding the truth outlived the Viking Age. Inga from Varteig in 1218 'carried iron' to prove her son Håkon Håkonsson (king of Norway 1217 - 1263) was the rightful heir to the throne of Norway. In a way it makes sense. Why would a dishonest man risk burning his hand in a boiling water? A man with the truth on his side will always be more willing to endure hardship than a lier. But this is somewhat irrelevant, unless this is used as a way to ensure who is right when two conflicting views come up.

Another punishment, however, which involves no physical punishment (in a way) is a temporary outlawment of the offender. Eric the Red was an outlaw (twice I think it was) for his crimes. I am just thinking out loud now. Do what you like.

Anyway, looking forward to Nogrod's post.

P.S. Thanks for you defence of the Middle-Ages, Gwathagor.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Groin Redbeard

That is a fun idea Formy, Nogrod. Will Nain be invited to the council to watch, or is this strictly a human matter?

If by "council" you mean Athanar's court of justice in the morning, I doubt Náin would be specifically invited to attend. The only people mandated to be there would be the accused, and anyone involved in the carrying out of justice. However, as a court is a public act of justice on the part of the eorl, I figure anyone in Scarburg could turn up, and given the way things are going, I think a lot might out of curiosity. Whether Náin will, I'm not sure. He might think it a good idea to have another balanced head present, in case the punishment is severe and the old Scarburgians decide to get hotheaded--on the other hand, he might avoid it for that reason.

[Nogrod]

I can tell you this...

Lord Athanar will first call for a meeting of some people of status offering them a package-deal of sorts. That will be totally confidential between him, Wynflaed, Saeryn, Degas, Thornden and Coenred. You writers may sure read about that discussion but apart from the kitchen stuff who could eavesdrop there are no others summoned there.

After that there will be the hearings of a few people and decisions. That latter event would not be advertised too heavily but it would not be prohibited either (I'm expecting quite a turn-out there ).

[Groin Redbeard]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

If by "council" you mean Athanar's court of justice in the morning,

You make it sound so modern. But if it is the nobles who will be deciding the outcome I pictured it more of a council. If we did it Norse style twelve members, at least, would have to be summoned for a jury.

[Nogrod]

Okay. I'm too tired to write a post now and will turn to bed.

But anyone willing to start a new day, feel free to write it. I'll try to make a post tomorrow for Athanar calling for a meeting of the group of people he would like to hear before going forwards with the hearings & decisions.

If someome goes forwards and writes for the next day, the first post there should have a title: 12th of November, year 15 (fourth age)

Originally Posted by Groin Redbeard

If we did it Norse style twelve members, at least, would have to be summoned for a jury.

Lord Athanar will not make a court with anyone else having a chance to decide on the issues that are for him to decide... and neither did lord Eodwine btw... The lord is there to rule and make the judgements. He may then listen to the people involved or people he chooses... or not listen to them.

[Groin Redbeard]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Lord Athanar will not make a court with anyone else having a chance to decide on the issues that are for him to decide... and neither did lord Eodwine btw... The lord is there to rule and make the judgements. He may then listen to the people involved or people he chooses... or not listen to them.

Tyrant!

P.S. I got up a post for Lithor and Erbrand. It is extremely mundane and rather cliche but fun to write. I could not wait to begin with my characters now that toMorrow is finally here!

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Hm, I think everybody wanted to take their character out in the morning

I was thinking that Hilderinc could meet Lithor on the way back, but then I realised that it actually makes sense if he meets Erbrand. Groin, hope that's fine with you. (And there is still this misunderstanding in the background where Hilderinc thought because of the bruise that it was Erbrand who was fighting yesterday...)