WW LXXIII: Arkham Asylum: Holding Cells(Game Thread)

[Nogrod]

Interesting. On D1 Nerwen and Izzy made a joint cross-examination of Lottie and that led to her lynch. Now they are again together pressing on Sally... That looks so like team-effort - or the other trying to please the other sharing the points and creating a good feeling & an illusion of "mutual understanding".

Now Sally may be a baddie. And Izzy & Nerwen can be both innocents. But what bothers me is their clear lack of interest to take a wider picture or trying to look outside the box they have chosen to stay in both of them.

Concentrating one's effort on someone who is a good lynch candidate and being careful not to offend or suspect anyone else is just soo wolfy...

Izzy and Nerwen have done that twice now.

Like I said, I'm not as yet convinced they both are wolves, but the way they "hunt together" one target at the time sure raises eyebrows...

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Interesting. On D1 Nerwen and Izzy made a joint cross-examination of Lottie and that led to her lynch. Now they are again together pressing on Sally... That looks so like team-effort - or the other trying to please the other sharing the points and creating a good feeling & an illusion of "mutual understanding".

Now Sally may be a baddie. And Izzy & Nerwen can be both innocents. But what bothers me is their clear lack of interest to take a wider picture or trying to look outside the box they have chosen to stay in both of them.

Concentrating one's effort on someone who is a good lynch candidate and being careful not to offend or suspect anyone else is just soo wolfy...

Izzy and Nerwen have done that twice now.

Like I said, I'm not as yet convinced they both are wolves, but the way they "hunt together" one target at the time sure raises eyebrows...

I'd rather noticed that too. Of course it could be unintentional on one of their parts but you never know. It seems too easy, but I'd love for it to be so.


Also, go Kit on the epic post. Now get some rest. *gives tea and cookies*


As I mentioned before (although I just posted it so whoops on my part heh) I found them both a threat, but decided that taking a marginal risk to lynch Kit was better for the village than me wasting a vote on Nerwen when I wasn't sure anyone else would vote her. I voted for the lesser of two evils (if you will) with hopes of catching any evil at all. Does that make more sense?


EDIT: x'd since my last

[Isabellkya]

A quick note.

Nerwen and I are not hunting together Nog.
I have no more idea to her alignment as I do anyone else's.

Your insistence that I have only focused on a single person each day is wrong. Which leads me to believe that you are picking and choosing specific details regarding people, to set-up your vote to make it look better. Who would need to set-up their vote? Wolves only.

[satansaloser2005]

Sorry to be a pain, but I've a headache coming on and I'll be needed more later tonight than I will be right now. I'm going to pop off for a bit, but I'll be back.

[Durelin]

Originally Posted by Kitanna

commenting enough to get by and sticking pretty well to those she suspects

Oh my, really? And according to Wilwa I'm in trouble for changing my mind about Sally.

You're reading me the wrong way, Kit. You read perhaps the most into my posts of anyone's (and mine are the shortest and the fewest! maybe that's why?) You're grasping but you're not grasping as much as some. Like Wilwa and...

Sally acting like a wolf under some pressure?

Nogrod still bugs me. He seems more agreeable than usual (in a trying to be nice and pleasant sort of sense), but I haven't really agreed with him much. And he just discussed how the wolves would try to be as pleasant as possible and stick to suspecting the fewest people possible. Hm.

I am getting similar feelings from Isabel and Nerwen (similar between them, not similar to Nog), but don't particularly suspect them right now, actually. And that's bugging me, too.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Durelin

Sally acting like a wolf under some pressure?

I'm under some pressure where? And I'm acting like a wolf where?


Thought not. Thanks for sharing though. Here, have a cookie.


You do have a point about Nog, strangely enough. I'm rather frightened by how much we're agreeing. *hides in her hidey hole*

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Isabellkya

Your insistence that I have only focused on a single person each day is wrong.

Nope. I haven't said that.

I said you and Nerwen made a co-cross examination on Lottie on D1 and it looked like you were doing the same toDay. In any case after your interrogation was over Lottie was more or less done with - and same looks true toDay for Sally.

Also you can't quite honestly say you have been suspecting people left and right. "Timid" would be the word to suit the spread of your suspicions. You have been careful not to suspect too many people at the same time (which is different thing to say that you have only suspected one person per Day - which I didn't say).

Add to that, that I said I'm not thinking it is somewhat plain simple you two guys are the wolves. I would actually be surprised if you were even though I don't think it impossible. But I could bet quite a lot one of you is a wolf.

Sally's spicy defence and attack does make me wonder though...


Heh, Dury: are you claiming that I have not suspected people? Well you said you haven't read the thread so maybe you should then not comment on that kind of issues? Read the thread first and come back then with your opinion whether I have played it safe or not, or trying to please everyone or not.

With all love, that is. But really. You just couldn't make that kind of claim if you had read the thread. Sorry.

[satansaloser2005]

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Sally's spicy defence and attack does make me wonder though...

I'm spicy am I? Oooo, lovely.


(No really, though, what do you mean? 'Cause you're too young for me, mate. I'm saving myself for a nice older gentleman, not some overgrown Finnish kid. Aaaand now I'm gonna run away before someone shoots me.)



I need dinner. Oh, and Wilwa? I'm making muffins tonight. Just thought that might entertain you.

[Nogrod]

Somethging that caught my eye from Sally's post on Nerwen...

Originally Posted by Sally

Actually, I’ve been drawing the same conclusions from multiple joke posts. It’s not the jokes that’s a problem, it’s the tone and placement of them. And again, she seems to be trying to make Lottie look bad and thus keep people from listening to her. Seems pretty nasty to me. (Of course with the internet thing, fine, as I completely feel your pain.)

Seems pretty flimsy defense to me. Sorry dear, I’m not buying it. Try putting it on eBay.

The underlined parts are the ones that bother me here big time.

First: "Yeah, and I might have just been having fun". Well yeah. But if you were just having fun and you are innocent would you have phrased it like that? Maybe we go here into language issues and I'm no native speaker but to my eyes that looks more like avoiding things or trying to take a cloak of an innocent than plain being one.

Secondly: "I was seeing how she'd react". Okay. It's an old and sometimes working idea to test someone you suspect by making an attack or open suspicion and waiting to see how the one you suspect reacts to that. But you said the reason for that "trial" was the fact that you didn't like how wilwa repeated her optimism. Now how come I get the feeling this is an explanation invented afterwards?

Also I'm a bit confused with that case for "you went on me after I said I had internet problems". Some of us have internet problems, some of us live in different timezones (you Nerwen should know that!), some of us have more time while some of us have busier days, some of us have time to use for this in the afternoon, others in the evening and some at night etc. So I don't think you can say there's immunity from suspicion for anyone who fits one or another restriction? If there was such a restriction you could fex. never lynch me in these American-run games as I always have to sign off hours before the DL.

And there really is a difference between evilly timed suspicions made at the crucial moment or giving the final blow to someone who has just about cleared her/himself from the edge at the last minute (I know that from experience... *coughRoacoug*) and making points when one has time for it. (I'm not claiminng anything on behalf of Sally here, I'm just stating my feeling of you over-reacting to Sally's suspicions).



Sally: I mean that you dropped off that joking mask and started really working to both show your innocence and even more to show Nerwen's guilt. And that was a huge effort, everyone can see that. So that made me wonder whether you have reason to invest more in this game you usually do... and being a Batman I think is no option with you in this case. You make just too much noise to work in the best interests of the asylum as the one who would need to stay alive both Days and Nights. So a wolf then? Or just one who suddenly decided to give her best effort?

[satansaloser2005]

Oooo, good thoughts, Noggins....

Sally: I mean that you dropped off that joking mask and started really working to both show your innocence and even more to show Nerwen's guilt. And that was a huge effort, everyone can see that. So that made me wonder whether you have reason to invest more in this game you usually do... and being a Batman I think is no option with you in this case. You make just too much noise to work in the best interests of the asylum as the one who would need to stay alive both Days and Nights. So a wolf then? Or just one who suddenly decided to give her best effort?

Well to be honest I was just going to go through and have a think. But I was quite comfy in bed and figured I may as well prove to Nerwen that I suspected her for a reason, discredit her attempts to discredit me. And as you know I can be very loud and participatory even as an ordo, and have on a few occasions. I plan to make a whole lot more noise in this game, actually, because I've got the time and I'm in a state where I can just sit and chatter, then load up epic posts if I care to. I won't be every Day, of course, but toDay I'm feeling under the weather so I thought I'd be of help to the village while I can. Pitch did the same thing, after all. And you know me, I like to make noise.

(And not that I'm saying I am, but why can't I be Batman? Did I miss someone reveal? 'Cause I think until then we should keep quiet about all things flying rodent related. I'm far too old to have nightmares about vampires. Except, of course, if I ever lame out and watch Twilight, then they'll never cease. I get your point but one who always acts the same as a role is one who doesn't keep their role very long. I'm different every game, at least to some extent, so I could be anything. (Well, anything good, that is, 'cause I'm certainly not a crap sack of fur.) Just sayin'.)

Definitely the latter then. No ulterior motives here, or at least none the innocents need to worry about. The wolves, on the other hand, should fear and respect. I may send them cookies, after all, and I really don't cook very well. *shifty eyes* After all, Nerwen did win my game, and I do owe her a batch, so, ya know....



Yeah, I know. I've gone mad. But it's okay. We're all mad here.

[satansaloser2005]

K, kiddos, I'm out for a while. Going to be on Durie-alysis while I'm away so hopefully I'll be back with hot muffins and a really good grip on Durelin's role.


And here we go. *poofs*

[Nogrod]

My bedtime is closing in... so a few thoughts before a vote.

As Wilwa said on D1, we have/had four Days to get it right. Now we have failed twice. If we fail toDay the wolves need only to succeed toMorrow to win the game. And on that situation (toMorrow that is) they only need one innocent vote to another innocent to win openly with plain numbers.

So we should really get it right toDay.

I don't basically trust anyone of you right now. Maybe Dury a bit for her blatant admission she doesn't read the thread.

I thought yesterDay Sally was more innocent than not, being her over playful self doing all that nonsense, but her effort toDay - and kind of forced-looking playfulness - has made me suspect her.

I still think Nerwen is high on my suspicion list for things I've said already - and some of Sally's points were actually legitimate.

Also I think Izzy is too careful. Mainly suspecting just the "easy targets" and defending herself. Not constructive play for a villager.

Wilwa's posting has been careful as well. And she has been flying under my radar thus far. A thing I sadly can't help at this point on the Day but will try to correct if I'm alive toMorrow. If she is a wolf I will curse myself for I have suspected her in most of the games after her comeback and she has mainly been just a well-meaning ordo who has tried to open the conversation. BUt maybe she's a bit more careful this time? I can't say.

Kit is the enigma this time. I do appreaciate her analysis and her effort - and her reasonableness. And that's just the thing that bothers me still. In a way I think if she is a wolf she really has earned her possible victory. That would be an outstanding performance.

My nightmare scenario: the wolves are Wilwa and Kit... If it is that we will probably lose.


But toDay, it will be Sally, Nerwen or Izzy as my vote.
*Goes to have a cigarette and to see if anyone gives an input meanwhile*


EDIT: X'd with Sally X 2

[satansaloser2005]

Well, Nog, you know how I feel. I'd much prefer Nerwen, as of your top three I know I'm innocent and I'm not entirely sold on Izzy being guilty. Also, I think killing Nerwen will tell us a lot more than we could learn from anyone else.


Besides. You don't want to kill me. I'm the other guard, and without me you're all in deep trouble. AND TAKE THAT CIGARETTE OUTSIDE!

[Nogrod]

The cigarette didn't solve the problem and it did solve it...

I really can't say who's the most suspicious but a lynch - or the process of how the lynch developes - might serve other ends as well. And with some luck we can get it right anyway, it's 2/5 anyway.

++ Nerwen

This way there will be something to read toMorrow, no matter who gets finally lynched.


EDIT: X'd with Sally again.

[Nerwen]

Okay... I'll answer Nogrod and Sally together, then.

Originally Posted by Sally

Also, for some reason the fact that she said ‘wolves and cobblers’ rather than ‘wolves’ strikes me; it’s as if she knows Boro isn’t a wolf, so she needs to put up both possibilities.

Um... why would I have "needed" to, in that case? And Lottie thought (correctly) that he was a cobbler, so it seemed relevant.

And... much of the rest of Sally's post is: "Ooo, she defended herself against Lottie! She joked about Jonathan apples on Day One! Eeevilll!"

And finally, her defence of her voting yesterDay... I don't buy it.

Originally Posted by Sally, toDay

Erm, if you’ll notice, in my post #172 I said I’d looked at her and my suspicions had increased. I voted for her because in my opinion supporting a possible wolf lynch is better than throwing away a vote on you when I didn’t think it was likely you’d be the lynch of the Day.

You said:

Originally Posted by Sally, yesterDay

I'm thinking Kit; not only do I suspect her*, it appears others do too. Reassures me that I'm not completely crazy (or that others are too, but then again....) so I'm willing to take the risk as she's one of my top suspects.

And yet, before that you had simply been ambiguous about her.

Originally Posted by Sally

Oh, so me making a case based on creeps is guilty, but you doing it is all right? I see. Thanks so much for clearing that up. I was very confused. Then again, you’re the one voting an innocent.

I had already given my reasons for voting you at that point. And thanks for letting us all know you're innocent.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

First: "Yeah, and I might have just been having fun". Well yeah. But if you were just having fun and you are innocent would you have phrased it like that?

I was replying to an accusation of Lottie's (I think– this is from memory) where she said I "might" have been doing such-and-such.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Secondly: "I was seeing how she'd react". Okay. It's an old and sometimes working idea to test someone you suspect by making an attack or open suspicion and waiting to see how the one you suspect reacts to that. But you said the reason for that "trial" was the fact that you didn't like how wilwa repeated her optimism.

Yes, exactly. What's your point? I suspected her somewhat, so I was testing her– already said so.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

Also I'm a bit confused with that case for "you went on me after I said I had internet problems". Some of us have internet problems, some of us live in different timezones (you Nerwen should know that!), some of us have more time while some of us have busier days, some of us have time to use for this in the afternoon, others in the evening and some at night etc.

I'm pretty sure I only mentioned that once, and only because I was in fact struck by the timing of her rather sudden attack on me.

Originally Posted by Nogrod

I'm just stating my feeling of you over-reacting to Sally's suspicions).

Look– why am I over-reacting? I asked her if she was ever going to make a proper case. She's spent most of the game making vague accusations, based on "feelings", and her vote yesterDay certainly required an explanation.

Edit:X'd since Nogrod at #219.

[Nerwen]

I wonder if it is Nogrod and Sally? Would they play that openly? But then no-one else is seeming that suspicious to me at the moment.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Look– why am I over-reacting? I asked her if she was ever going to make a proper case. She's spent most of the game making vague accusations, based on "feelings", and her vote yesterDay certainly required an explanation.

You might be right about the overall picture, but what I meant there was your "fury" at Sally making points of you when you had internet problems. That particular annoyance to me was over-reacting.

Not to say that I have used to you being more wide-minded person. Now it seems you're happy with just bashing Sally.

Of whom I need to say the following: her way of trying to talk me over there just a few moments ago (like the last three-four posts) looks suspicious to me indeed.

But with you two votes ahead maybe we'll finally see some action that would help us toMorrow.


EDIT: X'd with Nerwen & Sally