Game Thread: WW LXXXVI - The Halls of Mandos

[Mithalwen]

Right Nogrod and Fea. I did not try to get a double lynch. If you look at posts 170 and 174 I am torn between voting as I wished and risking a triple tie. I only vote when Manwe is ahead already and I don't have any more time to think with TP on my case to vote Lommy. You can pin a lot on me but that is totally spurious. As have been all the charges against me save that I am strung out which I will freely admit to.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by Mithalwen

Right Nogrod and Fea. I did not try to get a double lynch.

I could have been remembering wrong. I'll look later to see why I thought that.

[the phantom]

Boro- I think the main reason he identified me as a Cobbler rather than a Wolf was to keep anyone from knowing if he's telling the truth.

On the Dead-Thread we can check for Wolf or non-Wolf, but we can't check a Cobbler. When I die, there will be no Dead-Thread checking me for Cobblery. It can't be done. So there's no evidence to refute him.

Basically, if we lynch him today as we should, upon reaching Mandos he can cry about being wrongly lynched and possibly at some point in the future gain some sway somehow (perhaps out of pity). If he had identified me as a Wolf though- the game would be up as soon as I died, for I would upon arrival in the Dead-Thread immediately ask to have my role viewed.

[the phantom]

Way to go, Nessa. Another reason for me to love our low-posters.

[the phantom]

Lottie- I never assumed his power in Dead-Thread, but rather the possibility of power. No one can guarantee anything in this game, but one must try and leave open the possibility.

[Mithalwen]

Anyone have a vote tally?

[Rikae]

Lommy - Wilwa (Wilwa 1)
Greenie - Nog (Wilwa 1, Nog 1)
Agan - Nog (Nog 2, Wilwa 1)
Boro - Nog (Nog 3, Wilwa 1)
Glirdan - Nog (Nog 4, Wilwa 1)
Sally - Boro (Nog 4, Boro 1, Wilwa 1)
Nessa - Phantom (Nog 4, Boro 1, Wilwa 1, Phantom 1)
Legate - Nessa (Nog 4, Boro 1, Wilwa 1, Phantom 1, Nessa 1)

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

++Nog

I'm just going to push it through. He can yell at me post-game if he really is the seer, but I think his behavior up to and after his reveal screams sinister instead of seer. While I find it logical that a Seer-Nog would dream of Agan and the phantom, it doesn't mesh well with his earlier behavior and it's too easy to see those choices as, "I can say these and nobody has any power to deny it except for the true seer (hahaha!) or the phantom (who nobody believes anyway)!"

So yeah. Farewell, Noggles.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Boro

Ah right, I didn't think about the whole cobbler's are going to be revealed as innocents. That certainly changes things and something Nog would definitely think about if having to make a fake reveal.

Precisely!

I believe this is the first time I've ever been in this sort of position before, where I'm the only person who can know the truth behind the reveal, and I can tell you it's probably the most maddening thing I've ever experienced. I mean- me telling you "I'm not a Cobbler!" just doesn't cut it despite the fact that it's the most important piece of info we have.

And so I am left with my secondary argument-

Originally Posted by me

The most obvious point speaking against your Seership is your lack of survival instinct. You know good and well that under this format there is no need for you to drop dream hints!! Even were I not a dream-victim there would be no way you could convince me that you would play in such a fashion. Under these rules the Seer is welcome to be very well hidden, as he cannot be legitimately "killed", as he is still able to reveal his dreams through Glorfy and Lovers even after death, and use his dreams to positively influence the outcomes in the Mandos thread.

Is that not an extremely obvious point, people?

Bleh.... If he gets away with this...

[Anguirel]

I've been away on a fairly riotous evening, but I'm back, I've read the thread, and I think I understand it. Good old Werewolf. Bad old sleep.

I developed a hearty suspicion of Thinlomien after her Wilwa vote; it seemed to fit a pattern, of sniper action against the taciturn. That was of course before the next round of revelations.

Nogrod vs phantom eh. I do have a very decided view on this. But for some reason my internal workings are ordering me to keep it to myself till I vote at whatever I deem the most utilitarian time. That's pretty odd for me - I don't usually keep secrets or my own counsel - and the feeling is so strong I feel impelled to stick it a little longer.

My impression is that Nogrod is still a long way ahead votewise; is that true? (Yes it is. Just seen below)

I trust Mith and would like to extend some non game affection if that's allowed, or frankly even if it's not, but I agree the Blind Guardian thing seems like a sideshow

I think I was understood (perhaps wilfully?) over the Lovers issue. I believe Aganzir in case there was any doubt of that

[Anguirel]

And I was late for loads more important stuff there...

...I feel a bit silly. I trusted Nogrod, not phantom, though I wasn't willing to spit that thirty seconds ago. For him to be telling the truth now would involve a conspiracy of at least two wolves, wouldn't it? (Or could a clever cobbler get on board? Wait.)

The order of events -

Aganzir revelation
Nogrod bandwagon
Nogrod revelation
Aganzir's trap...

no, there's no way Nogrod's telling the truth, is there. Logical bind. His sincerity relies on Aganzir being Beren. Aganzir would only lie about being Luthien were she a wolf or cobbler.

Brilliant. Artistic. Best stroke of play involving a lover I've ever seen, and I was a damn good one

(By the way, Fea, wolves can kill wolves. As a Lover-Wolf I was faced with a lone wolf-Wolf, Gurthang; we voted to kill each other and both died, village won)

so, I would conclude this by voting Nogrod. But weird things keep happening. I withhold my vote in case of later events, for now...

[the phantom]

The Voting:

Lommy ++ Wilwa
Green ++ Nog
Agan ++ Nog (2)
Boro ++ Nog (3)
Glird ++ Nog (4)
Sally ++ Boro
Nessa ++ Phantom
Legate ++ Nessa
Fea ++ Nog (5)

Question- aimed primarily at those I am inclined to trust at the moment (Agan, Ang, & Fea). Is there any reason I shouldn't go ahead and vote Nog at this point?

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by the phantom

On the Dead-Thread we can check for Wolf or non-Wolf, but we can't check a Cobbler. When I die, there will be no Dead-Thread checking me for Cobblery. It can't be done. So there's no evidence to refute him.

Ah right, I didn't think about the whole cobbler's are going to be revealed as innocents. That certainly changes things and something Nog would definitely think about if having to make a fake reveal.