Game Thread: WW LXXXVI - The Halls of Mandos

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Anguirel

Well, it's a bloody disaster, isn't it. I think Rikae said their roles were to be revealed? The substance is clearly virulent poison, and it looks to me like we've lost two further innocents at an utterly crippling point.

An innocent and a cobbler, as it turns out. But I meant this part:

Originally Posted by The narration

They decided to allow the winner of the Day's election the honor of sampling this to determine what it might be.

A further twist in the game? It seems to imply toDay's double-voter will die.

Originally Posted by Anguirel

If there are two wolves, does one failed lynch and one kill finish us? let me see. 2 from 8 = 6. Now if there are three - yeah. If there are three we're seriously close to the wall now, especially as there's probably still a cobbler around, even if I'm pretty sure his name is phantom

I don't think there can be more than three villains (of all kinds) still living. But that's still pretty bad.

EDIT:X'd with Boro.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Boro

My jump on phantom boils down to I think that was an orchestrated double-lynch be phantom and Lottie. Lottie we know, follows around phantom like a puppy, and having played wolves with her before, she will take a bullet for a packmate. Phantom could have easily set that play up at night, by cherry-picking Lommy (which I admit I fell for because I thought her behavior was being completely ridiculous) while Lottie (or another packmate) go after Nessa.

And now that I'm on this subject, don't you find that business between Nog and phantom a bit too clean? Nog sets the noose around his own neck, and phantom starts proclaiming he knew what Nog was going to do, after the previous day defending Nog.

First part makes sense, but you're surely not implying Nog and tp are packmates, are you? Nog tried to get himself checked in Mandos, remember, which more-or-less rules him out as a wolf.

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Rikae

No twists. The person "elected" to be lynched toDay will die, (as usual).

All right, thank you for clearing that up.

Originally Posted by Anguirel

It is very unlikely that both are guilty. At the moment I would also say that neither are wolves, and that phantom is, after all, a Cobbler.

Which means we cannot dismiss that aboriginal question. Was Nogrod telling the truth?

Well, I hope not! Phantom's being a cobbler wouldn't prove it, anyway– I mean, it seems to me half this game has consisted of people yelling "Cobbler!" at each other; no doubt sometimes both have been right. (Unfortunately I guess there's still quite a good chance we've managed to lose the Seer one way or another anyhow.)

I expect either Boro or phantom is a baddie of some description anyway. Based on recent events and posting I'm leaning more towards phantom, but it's late at night here and I have a splitting headache. I need to see how things look in the morning.

[the phantom]

Originally Posted by Ang

I don't like his immediate if typical attempt to claim the Day's direction and steer it towards Elron, a vulnerable, easy-to-lynch candidate whom he knows many people (me for instance) vaguely suspect.

So I'm steering, eh? What, because I said what everyone is thinking regarding yesterday, and requested that Daughter speak on her behalf to explain that nonsense at the end?

Please, please, forgive me Ang. Next time I'm the only person around at the beginning of a Day I will keep my mouth shut, because goodness knows that being present early in the day is a clear attempt at manipulating the day's conversation rather than a result of the deadline time set by the moderator.

Originally Posted by Ang

Another thing we should consider is that Mith was almost certainly the object of last night's protection. Let's just hope she wasn't also the protector

She wasn't Glorfy.

Originally Posted by Ang

But I must admit I lean towards advising Glorfindel to come out, really.

No, no, don't say that! Anyone who says that must be evil! Or at least that's what Boro thought yesterday.

Originally Posted by Boro

And now that I'm on this subject, don't you find that business between Nog and phantom a bit too clean? Nog sets the noose around his own neck, and phantom starts proclaiming he knew what Nog was going to do, after the previous day defending Nog.

I DID know he was setting up for a false reveal. I mean, come on- if you read his posts Day 2 as they progress it's quite obvious he was building to something, and his clear-cut comment about changing his mind regarding me... I never did think he was a Wolf, but then as it began to look obvious he was setting up for a reveal, I looked at what he had been hinting (me = Cobbler) and realized that he was surely a Cobbler, but to give him the benefit of the doubt as a non-Wolf I wasn't going to jump the gun on him just in case he was attempting any sort of bluff or ploy and refrained from a reveal after all.

But yes, I even hinted openly that I knew where he was headed. In one post I said something along the lines of, "I wonder if Nog will make my decision easier by doing some sort of false reveal" and then directly before his reveal (after reading the post before it) I said something like "That set-up sounds mighty suspicious. *waits for Nog* "

Originally Posted by Boro

now is as good of a time as any for Glorfy to step out.

Ha ha ha! Yesterday saying such a thing was evil, but today it's okay.

By the way, I'm going to take this opportunity to stick my tongue out at you and point out that you are now following in my footsteps.
Step 1: Claim Phantom is bad for doing what he does.
Step 2: Do what Phantom does.

Originally Posted by Boro

but I've basically come to the conclusion that I think the double-lynch of Lommy and Nessa had wolf paws all over it

Yeah, we planned the whole thing, because of course I am so incredibly brilliant that before that day started I knew precisely who our two candidates would be, and also knew which of us would have the double-vote, and knew which people wouldn't show up at the deadline to vote (e.g. Shasta).

You know, really, I'm not even going to fight that accusation, as for anyone to believe it they would have to believe that I'm just flippin out of sight genius. Which I am, of course, but it gives me pleasure to see other people buy into it. So yeah... Grrr... Lottie and I hatched that plot. And then the next night we hatched a plot in which I would analyze her and make her look really bad and try and fan the flames of a Lottie-lynching mob, with the understanding she would run in late and act like a Cobbler causing everyone to change their votes last minute. But of course if that was the plan, it kind of failed. So... um.... maybe I won't take credit for being a Phantom-Lottie pack.

Anyway, congrats to Boro and Ang for turning things on me so that some completely ridiculous under-radar team like Daughter-Sally can waltz to a Wolf victory.

I've got to go to class now. In a fine mood.

[A Little Green]

I know our numbers have dwindled and all, and that of all people I'm not the one who has any business complaining about it being quiet, but still the silence unnerves me. I'm going to need to do some serious rethinking now, probably looking at the votes from the past Days and see what actually happened. It's all a blur in my head at the moment.

[Glirdan]

Hi all, sorry for the lack of posting (read Admin thread for reasons why).

Originally Posted by Angu

As in WW I itself, our "two luminaries", phantom and Boro, the great statistical plotters, are at war. It is very unlikely that both are guilty. At the moment I would also say that neither are wolves, and that phantom is, after all, a Cobbler.

I'm definitely inclined to agree with this sentiment. Both are going after each other too strongly for it to be a Wolf on Wolf. However, I'm not sure if I agree with phantom being a Cobbler. I'm not saying he's looking innocent but I'm also not saying that Boro is looking guilty. I think they're both looking mighty guilty.

However, with Legate being revealed as a known Cobbler and Nog being another (well, that's the original assumption at least), it's doubtful that both our guilty (aka. Wolf vs. Cobbler). I'm not sure which I see as more guilty though. Both have had made their very valid points and have helped the village. And yet, both have been trying to steer the village in a specific direction to suit their needs. I wish I could look over both of them more thoroughly, yet due to RL reasons (aka. personal issues and work), my time on the internet toDay is rather limited. I may end up having to do what I did yesterDay and base my vote off of who looks guilty from toDay.

Originally Posted by Angu

Which means we cannot dismiss that aboriginal question. Was Nogrod telling the truth?

This is a very valid question, one I think we should look into in case it hasn't been done. Yet, because of Agan's trap and his lack of response to it, I'm still more inclined to believe that he was a Cobbler.

So here's my question to all of you. Instead of having Lottie checked toNight, should we have the Dead check Noggins?

Originally Posted by Angu

Can I just reassure the Moddess, though, who seems to worry that this game isn't working in the admin thread, that in its traumatic, stressful, fiendish way it is very exciting indeed, and I at least am glad I participated.

I am in utter agreement my dear Moddess, even with the stress of RL right now, I find this to be one of the most exciting games I've played in and I am quite glad I joined.

I feel I rather agree with Boro on this statement in regards to phantom

but not seem particularly bothered by the double-lynch that he and Lottie did?

I did think it was strange, especially seeing as he apparently "detests" double lynches. Yet he did nothing to stop it either and the next day had no...shall we say remorse?...about it. If I recall correctly, he even said that he was quite happy with that outcome. And a double lynch in a game like this is the perfect place for a Wolf to get rid of players that they feel are threatening to them, and he had it out for Lommy from the get go.

However, we can't base much off of that double lynch seeing as those were the only two candidates up for lynching, other then Agan's and Wilwa's votes for Boro, both of whom are known innocents.

Originally Posted by phantom

She wasn't Glorfy.

How can you be so sure?

Hmmm...I don't know what to make of this whole mess right now....Either way, Boro and phantom are confusing me beyond belief. The only credit I can really give to Boro at this point is following through with his vote on phantom

As for this Sally and Elra debate that phantom has stirred up....I'm not sure what to make of either of them. Both of them have been breezing along by quite unscathed with a few short posts here and there. It is quite possible that one of them, if Nessa is not, is a Wolf in hiding. Personally, I don't see a Sallywolf pulling this kind of tactic. She's been around far too long to pull that kind of newbie tactic. Which is why, of the two, I'm more inclined to believe that Elra would be a Wolf and Sally innocent.

I'm now feeling a little more comfortable with Angu. Out of the main speakers (aka. him, Boro and phantom) he's the only one who's not trying to steer the village in any way whatsoever. It is quite possible that he is the remaining Cobbler (if there are any left that is) or just a very confused innocent. All of his posts toDay have been clear, concise and made sense, none of which have come across as Wolvish. However, I am still uneasy about him due to his posts yesterDay (see my vote post for further reasons as to why). I'm really not sure what to make of him at all.

Okay, that is all for now. I'll be back in a little while to check up.

EDIT: Xed with Angu

[Anguirel]

sally's was the fourth vote for Nessa; risky though not utterly inconceivable for a very bold fellow-wolf, especially if an ally (phantom?) was expected to sort things out in favour of Thinlomien's death

Originally Posted by Glirdan

I'm definitely inclined to agree with this sentiment. Both are going after each other too strongly for it to be a Wolf on Wolf. However, I'm not sure if I agree with phantom being a Cobbler. I'm not saying he's looking innocent but I'm also not saying that Boro is looking guilty. I think they're both looking mighty guilty....

So here's my question to all of you. Instead of having Lottie checked toNight, should we have the Dead check Noggins?

I'm now feeling a little more comfortable with Angu. Out of the main speakers (aka. him, Boro and phantom) he's the only one who's not trying to steer the village in any way whatsoever. It is quite possible that he is the remaining Cobbler (if there are any left that is) or just a very confused innocent. All of his posts toDay have been clear, concise and made sense, none of which have come across as Wolvish. However, I am still uneasy about him due to his posts yesterDay (see my vote post for further reasons as to why). I'm really not sure what to make of him at all.

argh Glirdan that first paragraph is really confusing. Which I suppose is fair enough, given the confusion surrounding that particular duel, but still. It's like a particularly mad poem

no no no, check Loslote not Nogrod, Dead (though at this rate we might not last long enough to get the results of your inquisition...). Whatever Nogrod is he's very unlikely to be a wolf because of the planted Seer hint (though I thought he was a wolf, optimistically, when I voted him down). If he's a Cobbler, we won't learn anything. Loslote might well be a wolf and we really need to find out.

finally, Glirdan, thankyou, that's very nice of you. I imagine phantom will scornfully answer that on the contrary I am trying to steer the camp towards hanging him, but you're right to see I don't feel that simply about things.

[Anguirel]

Originally Posted by the phantom

Please, please, forgive me Ang. Next time I'm the only person around at the beginning of a Day I will keep my mouth shut, because goodness knows that being present early in the day is a clear attempt at manipulating the day's conversation rather than a result of the deadline time set by the moderator...

She wasn't Glorfy...


Anyway, congrats to Boro and Ang for turning things on me so that some completely ridiculous under-radar team like Daughter-Sally can waltz to a Wolf victory.

phantom, your first statement doesn't address my substance - that an accusation of Elrond's Daughter at this stage looks like a very easy course.

Your second is rather provocative. You're saying, according to your personal angle on things and sense of Mith's style, she's unlikely to have been Glorfindel? That, also, is my impression. But there's no need to give the impression that your supposition is a certainty

Your third point is unworthy of you; you won't win my trust by throwing around blame in that childish tone. We ought to work together. If we are actually both innocent then this is intensely frustrating. But that's not the way to convince me

It's also odd in that you imply you don't think Boro or I are wolves. You've been consistently, up till now, friendly and on my side (one reason I think you need more scrutiny), but hitherto you certainly suspected Boro. Even more oddly, you haven't hitherto suspected Sally in any emphatic way...

[Anguirel]

Not that aren't actually things that make me uneasy about Boro's tone. It's permeated with resignation we could do without at this relatively critical stage...

"If the person's a cobbler, and we lose, so be it."

"This part is probably far-fetched, but I've basically come to the conclusion that I think the double-lynch of Lommy and Nessa had wolf paws all over it."

(as in, he doesn't really believe in the validity of his own accusation that the double-lynch was orchestrated by wolves. And neither do I)

"If you really our innocent, my apologies bud, as it means I've allowed myself to be completely manipulated by the wolves this game. Although, I find it hard to believe that an innocent phantom would be at the center of all this confusion."

a patina of fallacy, though it could well be unintentional. More resignation and despair that is unlike him; then a sentence that makes little sense; phantom is always a controversial and suspicious player whether innocent or guilty.

Nerwen and I have both said we think one or the other is guilty...what if neither is. I've seen bigger farces. Certainly I think we can rule out both of them being wolves!

We probably still have a hunter, too. If s/he and Glorfindel reveal there will be a flurry of reaction and maybe some rival claimants, but I think in shifting the terms of debate this would actually be helpful. After all, a revealed hunter can look after themselves to an extent; wolves late in the game are very cautious about attacking them. I've known hunters be very useful out in the open...

so, all in all, I think sally, while personally suspicious to me for reasons of self defence, is only likely to be a wolf if all three are still on their paws.

Or if her Nessa vote was late in the day and served the purpose of camouflage. I'll just check on that and then continue where I left off...

[Boromir88]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Nog tried to get himself checked in Mandos, remember, which more-or-less rules him out as a wolf.

Sorry didn't make that part of it clear. My thought was Nog's a cobbler, got stuck in a situation where all he could do was beg to be lynched. wolf-Phantom who from what I remember "cobblers are canon-fodder" philosophy, thus pushed for his lynch. Believing Nog was not only a cobbler, but would be a trouble-maker in the dead thread. I mean would anyone expect Nog to let death shut him up?

This part is probably far-fetched, but I've basically come to the conclusion that I think the double-lynch of Lommy and Nessa had wolf paws all over it. And what's just completely incomprehensible to me is how does phantom get off jumping Mith for vascillating on her vote plans Day 1, putting him in a tough spot, but not seem particularly bothered by the double-lynch that he and Lottie did?

[Boromir88]

Gotta be heading out, will be gone until late late Saturday.

++the phantom

If you really our innocent, my apologies bud, as it means I've allowed myself to be completely manipulated by the wolves this game. Although, I find it hard to believe that an innocent phantom would be at the center of all this confusion.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

A further twist in the game? It seems to imply toDay's double-voter will die.

No twists. The person "elected" to be lynched toDay will die, (as usual).