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#1 | |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,036
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Quote:
The Quendi are not denied death [not that you said otherwise], but given a very different kind of life compared to 'brief' mortals. |
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#2 |
Newly Deceased
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Lorien, with Celeborn and the remaining Galadrim after the Departure of Galadriel.
Posts: 6
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Back to the reply that Arwen, Elrohir and Elladan would be mortal because of their mortal blood infused with Elvish blood, the children of Elrond were given a choice, it seems. When Elrond confronted Aragorn in the books about his interest in Arwen, after he told Aragorn that he would not be worthy enough to win Arwen unless he was the King of the North and South Kingdoms reunited, Aragorn, using a bit of foresight, warned Elrond that a day was coming soon when his children (specifically Arwen) would have to make their choice as to which kindred they would belong to, to remain in Middle-earth among Men or to go into the West with the Elves.
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#3 |
Pilgrim Soul
Join Date: May 2004
Location: watching the wonga-wonga birds circle...
Posts: 9,460
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I agree with Galin. The valar felt the Gift of men from Eru could not be withheld to those entitled. It isn't simply a matter of death since as has been pointed out that Elves are only immortal in the sense that their life is bound with the existence of Arda. It is the possibility of passing beyond the circles of the world and having more scope to decide one's own fate as well.
It seems to me that mortality was the "default setting" for half elven by blood. Mithrellas's children did not get the choice and she surely abandoned her family to avoid the pain of seeing her children age and die. Earendil and Elwing clearly developed as humans not elves since they married in their early twenties and had children at an age decades before Elves would be physically mature and of age to marry. Elronds children are of course more than half Elven and their development may have been more on an elvish timescale as the children of two immortals (the spacing between their births suggest this). The grace of choice extended to them must have been a very mixed blessing and may well explain why Elrond delayed marriage long after meeting and falling in love with Celebrian. Embarking on parenthood knowing that you may be separated eternally from your children must have been appalling and makes her suffering all the more poignant I think.
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“But Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.”
Christopher Tolkien, Requiescat in pace |
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#4 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 435
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As for the sundering thing, that could explain something else, why Arwen ISN'T at the Grey Havens. She can't go on the boat but you'd think she'd want to be there to say goodbye (it is her father after all). It seems like there may be an even deeper sundering involved in the choice, once an Halfelven chooses mortality, it's as if they are now considered already DEAD by the elves, as if it is forbidden for them to thereafter even ASSOCIATE (as far as I know, there is no record of Elrond taking trips to Numernor to visit his brother. Or Arwen getting visits by her brother. Maybe it's the same thing as Mitherellas, the immortal can't bear seeing their kin die, and the mortal can't bear seeing their kin live. |
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#5 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Henneth Annûn, Ithilien
Posts: 462
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Perhaps. Still, there are many incidents, especially during the Exile of the Dúnedain of Anor, that Elrond has taken care of the Heirs of Elendil who were his kin.
"without the goodwill of Master Elrond the Heirs of Isildur will soon come to an end." - Gilraen There was one instance with a lady of the Edain named Andreth in the First Age who had a love who was an Elf, but they never got together because of her mortality.
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"For believe me: the secret for harvesting from existence the greatest fruitfulness and the greatest enjoyment is - to live dangerously!" - G.S.; F. Nietzsche |
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#6 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 435
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#7 |
Newly Deceased
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Lorien, with Celeborn and the remaining Galadrim after the Departure of Galadriel.
Posts: 6
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Alfrin, Middle-earth does have similar relational laws as we do. Ar-Pharazon married his cousin, which was considered incestuous to the Numenoreans (noted, in some places it is not considered incestuous to marry one's cousin, but if they thought that that was immoral, then there seems to have been a certain amount of taboo connected to marrying relatives.
Sorry, had to indulge the bunny-trail. |
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#8 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 435
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