Your Take On Eöl & Maeglin

[Inziladun]

Eöl to me is a pretty unsympathetic character just because of his surliness. Based on the story as told in The Silmarillion, Aredhel was by no means forced into marriage with him though, even though he did manipulate her path in the woods to draw her to him.

Ultimately, I think the "judgement" on him was not unfavorable, at least from the point of view of the Valar. I base that on the fact that his uttered curse of Maeglin "Here may you yet die the same death as I", seems to have been fulfilled, as Maeglin was slain by falling himself. Maybe that says Maeglin was judged to have committed the greater evils of the two.

[Andsigil]

I've always thought of Eol as a hermit who's more misanthropic than evil (his attempted crime of passion at Gondolin, notwithstanding).

Maeglin's rap was deserved. He was jealous and lusted after his first cousin (!). He also wilted under pressure when facing Morgoth, where others like Hurin didn't (probably because his heart was already so tainted).

[Morthoron]

Eol has always been one of my favorite Tolkien characters. Quite different than the insufferable Noldor, and a character that Tolkien actually imbued with a distinct persona, unlike most of the tediously perfect Elves in his works.

Tolkien may not have liked his creation morally (and nearly every character Tolkien dislikes morally finds a nasty end), but like Milton's Lucifer being far more real and living than the Archangel Michael in Paradise Lost (the great William Blake slyly noted that Milton was "of the Devil's party without knowing it."), Tolkien obviously found creating Eol more interesting than most of the generic elves he portrayed, even editing out the rape of Aredhel to more of a seductiion so that Eol would not appear utterly evil.

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Originally Posted by Morthoron

Tolkien may not have liked his creation morally (and nearly every character Tolkien dislikes morally finds a nasty end), but like Milton's Lucifer being far more real and living than the Archangel Michael in Paradise Lost (the great William Blake slyly noted that Milton was "of the Devil's party without knowing it."), Tolkien obviously found creating Eol more interesting than most of the generic elves he portrayed, even editing out the rape of Aredhel to more of a seductiion so that Eol would not appear utterly evil.

Good one, I like the Milton's Lucifer reference! And I think you are quite right. The other day I thought of Gollum, and how he is a fantastic character. Utterly corrupted, but still with a core of humanity left deep inside, and his fascinating persona comes out vividly in the books. The members of the fellowship (with the exception of Sam) are actually quite dull as characters I think. But Gollum, he's an amazing fictional character, Tolkien must have loved writing those parts.

And yeah I like Eöl too, as a character he also comes out vividly. Feels like I understand how he thinks, and it makes sense from his point of view, though he really isn't a pleasant fellow, is he? Maeglin is a cool character too. Morally he really is detestable. Ungrateful son, ungrateful foster-son, traitor to all. But still, you can feel for him, he had some rough times.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by skip spence

Maeglin is a cool character too. Morally he really is detestable. Ungrateful son, ungrateful foster-son, traitor to all. But still, you can feel for him, he had some rough times.

I think Maeglin is more cold than cool. He's calculating and self-centered. If he'd been raised by his father in isolated Nan Elmoth that might be explicable, but he's instead welcomed into the top tier of Gondolin society and treated like a prince, which he basically is. He then, out of all the women in the city, decides on his first cousin as a love interest. That alone doesn't speak well for him, as such unions were obviously considered to be of evil in Arda. The later Ar-Pharazön took that even further, of course, forcibly taking his cousin to wife. Maeglin was promised "possession" of Idril by Morgoth as a reward for his treachery, and that also speaks of less a true love than a desire for power and control.

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I'm with you bro. Maeglin is horrible. I can certainly see why the Elves single him out as the worst traitor of their kind. No excuse for that sort of stuff. The sins of, say, Feanor isn't even close. He's a nice fictional character though. That Aredhel/Eöl/Maeglin sub-story is one of my favorites in the Silmarillion, and I love how it weaves into the Tuor story-line and the Fall of Gondolin and well, just about every story.

[Nikkolas]

Originally Posted by skip spence

I'm with you bro. Maeglin is horrible. I can certainly see why the Elves single him out as the worst traitor of their kind. No excuse for that sort of stuff. The sins of, say, Feanor isn't even close. He's a nice fictional character though. That Aredhel/Eöl/Maeglin sub-story is one of my favorites in the Silmarillion, and I love how it weaves into the Tuor story-line and the Fall of Gondolin and well, just about every story.

...Feanor is responsible for countless deaths. All the Noldor who died are on his head. That includes the ones Maeglin sold out to Morgoth. Also Feanor was never tortured - he just decided one day to slaughter all his kin and steal their boats. All while leading his followers to their deaths. (he certainly didn't care if Fingolfin's team lived or died) And don't even start with "but his mommy and daddy died!!!" Maeglin's father tried to murder him and as a result murdered his mother all right in front of his young eyes. I would think this would have a kind of negative impact on a person's psychological development. And trauma isn't cured just because you are royalty.

Feanor was an awful, awful person and has no excuse for anything he did. He did more harm to the world than anyone save the Dark Lords.