Racism and Tolkien.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Alfirin

And I've always interpreted Aragorn's Edict as being to keep men from SETTLING in the shire (not a wholesale "no man can ever even enter the border), lest they take it over from the somewhat less warlike hobbits. Hobbits are largely peaceful (even if they can be roused to defend themsevles) so let them live where they live in peace. It's to keep the hobbits safe, not to keep them isolated (it's not like Aragorn banned hobbits from leaving the shire, or required that they all move there.) It's sort of similar to what he did for the Woses of the Drudan forests; He's trying to make sure that no one molests them, or can come in with great masses of men and arms and take the territory from them.

Actually, the edict does indeed appear to totally bar Men from the Shire. From Appendix B The Tale of Years:

1427 ....King Elessar issues an edict that Men are not to enter the Shire.

And in Appendix A:

But [Aragorn II] does not enter [The Shire] and binds himself by the law that he has made, that none of the Big People shall pass its borders.

If Aragorn only meant a ban on settlers, surely he wouldn't have seen the harm in making a brief visit inside to give Sam his award.

Originally Posted by tom the eldest

It is mentioned in the wikia that the upleasant appearance of the haradrim is based on european mongols.and also apparently the squint-eyed description of the evil men is an example of racism towards chines and japanese

I wouldn't put a tremendous amount of stock in anything that starts with wiki, unless it's supported by other sources. Tolkien said in a Letter that Orcs were based on a very debased version of Mongols.

They are (or were) squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types.

Letters # 210

Orcs were the spiritual and physical product of long corruption by Morgoth and Sauron, and their appearance has no real-world equivalent. That Tolkien there added the qualifier "to Europeans" to me indicates that he did not think such a perception valid, but instead a regrettable consequence of unfamiliarity.

[demnation]

Originally Posted by Inziladun

Actually, the edict does indeed appear to totally bar Men from the Shire. From Appendix B The Tale of Years:



And in Appendix A:



If Aragorn only meant a ban on settlers, surely he wouldn't have seen the harm in making a brief visit inside to give Sam his award.



I wouldn't put a tremendous amount of stock in anything that starts with wiki, unless it's supported by other sources. Tolkien said in a Letter that Orcs were based on a very debased version of Mongols.

Letters # 210

Orcs were the spiritual and physical product of long corruption by Morgoth and Sauron, and their appearance has no real-world equivalent. That Tolkien there added the qualifier "to Europeans" to me indicates that he did not think such a perception valid, but instead a regrettable consequence of unfamiliarity.

A knee jerk reaction to the "Orcs are debased Mongols" quote would lead one to cry "racism!" racism!" But a closer look reveals something a bit more ambiguous. Because he is not saying that Orcs are Mongols, or that Mongols are repulsive, but that the (fictional) Orcs are repulsive versions of Mogols. Still, it is about the closest Tolkien gets to saying anything that could be interpreted as blatantly racist. And the funny thing about his Letters is that they contain more evidence that he actually wasn't racist than they contain evidence that he was.

[Belegorn]

I could care less if Tolkien was racist. I do not think he was anyway, at least openly. If you're anti-racist to the point you want a racist to conform to your non-racist ways then don't support his work. I do think in LotR there are some Men who're obviously better than others. I do not believe everyone has to except what is the flavor of the century. My morals are more in line with the Hellenes before the Platonists turned the world upside down.

"it has always been the law that the weaker should be subject to the stronger." [Thucydides; History of the Peloponnesian War, ch. 3, p. 44]

What's next, the term "black Númenórean" is a racist title because it has black in it and they are opponents of Gondor and the good Dúnedain? They're both Dúnedain in any case, but since Tolkien decided to append "black" to a certain segment of them in a negative light, that's kind of racist right? So Tolkien is a racist and anti-feminist, what else, wrote some good books. Cool.