Balrogs, yet again. - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Elenhin · 09-06-2001, 07:39 AM

<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Haunting Spirit
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Re: Ad: Balrogs, yet again.

On Gandalf's Elven Ring:
While it is stated in LotR and other places that the Elven-Rings were of no use in a battle, can it be absolutely so? We know that Narya had the power to "rekindle the flame in the hearts of the Free Peoples" (or something like that) and Gandalf seemed to have taken advantage of that power during the siege of Minas Tirith. Could it be possible that the Ring encouraged Gandalf and discouraged the Balrog?

We also know that Gandalf did lots of fire-magic (fireworks, naur an edraith ammen etc.) and that Galadriel did lots of water-magic (the Phial, the Mirror)... and that Gandalf wore the Ring of Fire and Galadriel the Ring of Water. To me this suggests that the powers of the Three Rings may not have been only in preservation and healing - there must have been something which made Narya different from Nenya and Vilya after all.

About Gandalf as a fire-spirit:
Wasn't it said in the Silmarillion that Olorin was a pupil of Lorien and that he often listened to Nienna? I haven't usually connected these two Valar to fire in any way.

Also note that while Gandalf calls the Balrog a "flame of Udun" he says that he's a " servant of the Secret Fire" and the " wielder of the Flame of Anor" (not that he's a fire himself, like the Balrog).

I always took the "wielder of the flame of Anor" as a reference to Narya and connected Gandalf's fire magic to the Ring, not to his original Maia-nature.
Not that my impressions are necessarily correct, but I just wanted to throw in my thoughts as well.

--
Elenhin

"My god, it's full of stars!"</p>

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09-06-2001, 07:39 AM	#10
Elenhin Wight Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Vantaa, Finland Posts: 205	<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Haunting Spirit Posts: 52</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE> Re: Ad: Balrogs, yet again. On Gandalf's Elven Ring: While it is stated in LotR and other places that the Elven-Rings were of no use in a battle, can it be absolutely so? We know that Narya had the power to "rekindle the flame in the hearts of the Free Peoples" (or something like that) and Gandalf seemed to have taken advantage of that power during the siege of Minas Tirith. Could it be possible that the Ring encouraged Gandalf and discouraged the Balrog? We also know that Gandalf did lots of fire-magic (fireworks, naur an edraith ammen etc.) and that Galadriel did lots of water-magic (the Phial, the Mirror)... and that Gandalf wore the Ring of Fire and Galadriel the Ring of Water. To me this suggests that the powers of the Three Rings may not have been only in preservation and healing - there must have been something which made Narya different from Nenya and Vilya after all. About Gandalf as a fire-spirit: Wasn't it said in the Silmarillion that Olorin was a pupil of Lorien and that he often listened to Nienna? I haven't usually connected these two Valar to fire in any way. Also note that while Gandalf calls the Balrog a "flame of Udun" he says that he's a " servant of the Secret Fire" and the " wielder of the Flame of Anor" (not that he's a fire himself, like the Balrog). I always took the "wielder of the flame of Anor" as a reference to Narya and connected Gandalf's fire magic to the Ring, not to his original Maia-nature. Not that my impressions are necessarily correct, but I just wanted to throw in my thoughts as well. -- Elenhin "My god, it's full of stars!"</p>