Astronomy and astrology in Middle-Earth?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

We all know how important the stars were for the Elves and in the whole Middle-Earth, the light in the world, whose part the stars are, was itself a matter of wars uncountable. I would like to explore one thing here: How was it with astronomy and/or astrology in Middle-Earth? Were they cultivated? To what extent? We know the stars in Middle-Earth had somewhat dubious nature: they came from the dew of the Two Trees. But it seems that they were observed - and the question is, was it only for, let's say, entertaining purposes (watching the skies on clear summer nights and making poems), or did some people (Men, Elves...) study their movements (astronomy), eventually make some conclusions based on that (astrology)? Throughout the books, there are some mentions of people observing the skies, like Tar-Palantír, or the stewards of Orthanc:

Originally Posted by TT; Chapter 8: The Road to Isengard

A strong place and wonderful was Isengard, and long it had been beautiful; and there great lords had dwelt, the wardens of Gondor upon the West, and wise men that watched the stars.

The fact that it is said here that these were wise men seems to imply that they did not watch the stars just for their amusement, but for some other purpose connected with their wisdom. That would point to astronomers. To what extent did they cultivate this science? If the stars were nothing more than dew of the Trees, then...? Could the astronomers map their movements, their luminosity, and what else? Distance? Hard to believe. Satellites of planets? Are there any? And what about Sun and Moon - do we have Crater Copernicus or is it just a hole on the surface of Tilion's vessel? What did Tolkien say about this topic? Did his views change at any point?

Astrology, if there was any, is a matter even more controversial. Here on Earth, the origins of astrology are in ancient cultures who saw the skies as some sort of reflection of this world (or: this world as reflection of the heavenly unchanging - or hardly changing - world above) and believed in that the events in this world can be explained and predicted by seeing them in the skies. For example, if Jupiter was the star (resp. planet) that was considered to belong to the nation of X, and let's say suddenly it was eclipsed by another planet, the astrologers could proclaim that the nation of X will be facing serious threat in the near future from the nation to which the other planet belonged (this was a very vague example, but I hope you got the point). The interpretations were of many scales, from the global one (as shown above) to the individual one, where later the fates of individual people were predicted from that. After all, it remains till today. The question is, was this used in Middle-Earth? And if it was, then by whom, for what purposes and how would it work? For example one could find it hard to believe the Elves would support astrology: not the ones who were in Valinor, at least, because they would have known that the fate of Middle-Earth lay in something different. Or did it? It would be easy to say that the stars contained some "coded information" about the fate of Arda that was put inside them, and it will be quite easy to come up with it as a superstition among the less educated Men or even wild Elves and it would be, I think, quite easy to believe it. Again, did Tolkien say anything about that?

I am looking forward to seeing any contributions; if any of you come up with any quotes, either from the books or from the Letters and other stuff, that speak more about this matter, it will be most welcome.

[The Might]

I recommend http://www.physics.ccsu.edu/larsen/tolkien.html for further information.
Especially http://www.physics.ccsu.edu/larsen/jrrt.html is quite interesting and provides some good quotes.
Clearly, Tolkien was interested in astronomy and so also used it to create a feeling for the reader that the action takes place in a real place.

And so why wouldn't people in M-e look to the stars as well. Why it is wise men...well simply because some peasant from South Gondor doesn't have the education needed to understand what really happens in the sky. You had to have learned something in Minas Tirith's library or in Rivendell.

Now, as far as astrology is concerned...I don't really think so. Of course maybe Malbeth the Seer made his prophecies after consulting the stars, maybe he just took a look at the shape of the clouds and the behavious of chickens as I think the Roman augurs did. As far as I am aware we don't know really.

This however again brings us to that topic I so dislike about providence, fate and luck in M-e. Somehow, it seems however that people there simply had this gift, as Aragorn is said to have gotten it from his mother's side.

So I guess that in Middle-earth prophecies were made without looking at other stuff, but simply be "feeling" wha was going to happen. Maybe some had this power to somehow sense Eru's plan or something like that.

My conclusion: Astronomy - yes, important; Astrology - no, possible

[William Cloud Hicklin]

Remember that the Numenoreans and to a lesser extent the Gondorians were great mariners: which implies that astronomy was cultivated for the purpose of navigation. This might conceivably have even included longitude as well as latitude: there are clock-independent ways of calculating long, such as tracking Jupiter's moons, provided you have sufficiently accurate instruments and the tables worked out correctly. Nor I suppose should we discount the possibility that the Numenoreans had developed the marine chronometer, since even the backwards Shire-hobbits had clocks.

[The Might]

Good idea WCH, that would definitely be a good reason.
Again, this goes well with the theory from the site linked above where astronomy is seen as part of the background of the story. The world needs to be feel real, and so to a certain extent (as this still is fantasy) mirror our own.

[Morwen]

In The Mariner's Wife Meneldur is said to have spent a lot of time contemplating the heavens (at least until he became king) and gathering information on that subject from the Eldar. I believe he also built a tower expressly for the purpose of star gazing.

I can't recall any references to astrology but the appearance of new lights in the sky was seen as significant, e.g. the appearance of the Gil-Estel shortly before the war that ended the first age. In FotR, in (I think) "The Ring goes South" reference is made to a red star, observed by Frodo, shining brightly in the sky. A reference to Mars perhaps, signifying impending war?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by The Might

My conclusion: Astronomy - yes, important; Astrology - no, possible

I would agree with that. Though it will be still good to look more on what all could be studied in the skies... for example the problematics of meteorites and similar things (several swords were made of meteoritic iron, as it is mentioned even in the texts you provided links to... anyway, these links are very good, thanks for that, Miggy).

Originally Posted by Morwen

I can't recall any references to astrology but the appearance of new lights in the sky was seen as significant, e.g. the appearance of the Gil-Estel shortly before the war that ended the first age. In FotR, in (I think) "The Ring goes South" reference is made to a red star, observed by Frodo, shining brightly in the sky. A reference to Mars perhaps, signifying impending war?

Well, the case of Eärendil surely is not the "normal" astrology, as it was only one rare occassion. Similarly in Frodo's case, I always considered this star rather being there to evoke the image of the Eye of Sauron (it is said there that it seemed to Frodo like an eye), of course I don't think it was THE Eye, but rather Frodo's subconscious stirred after the recent events transformed this star in his mind to the sign of something scary (reminds me of Lovecraft's "Polaris" and things like "What the Moon brings" here - Frodo's state of mind clearly was not perfectly okay at that time).