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Old 05-28-2003, 03:10 PM   #1
Rose Cotton
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Silmaril Silmarillion for school

I'm doing a book report on the Silm for school. If a book that we read is above our grade level we get extra points on it. So I was wondering what reading level do you think the Silmarillion is? Thanks.
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Old 05-28-2003, 04:28 PM   #2
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I've actually read that it is 12th+ grade level, but wait a sec I'll get a more accurate opinion...

After at least a few hundred clicks, I have Microsoft Word's decision on the grade level which is... *drumroll* heh, that's funny: Word says the same thing: 12.0, which I believe is as high as it can judge (no grade levels beyond 12).

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Old 05-28-2003, 05:08 PM   #3
Rose Cotton
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YAY! I'm in 8th grade so that means extra points for me!

Are there any other opinions?
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Old 05-28-2003, 05:28 PM   #4
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It's way above eigth grade. I have been told many times (by teachers and other such folk) that when they first read it that it was quite hard to comprehend. And kudos to you since it's certainly not above you!
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Old 05-28-2003, 05:39 PM   #5
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Silmaril

Too bad my teacher has never read the book and all she has to go by as far as the grade level is my word.

Me to teacher: Of course it's 12th grade material. I would never lie to you! [img]smilies/evil.gif[/img]

Hopefully I can convince her.
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Old 05-28-2003, 05:40 PM   #6
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Tolkien

You can rest assured that you'll get your extra credit. I'm currently a senior and can tell you that most people in my grade, nay my school (teachers included, no really) would struggle with it themselves.

Many props tho you though for reading such a difficult book at your age. Believe me, it pays off in dividends in the future. Plus, it's one of the best books ever too!

And if you need to convince her that it's at the level you say, just have her read the Ainulinale. It'll have her head spinning around in circles for sure.

~Scott

[ May 28, 2003: Message edited by: Scott ]
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Old 05-28-2003, 06:50 PM   #7
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I agree with Scott. If your teacher thinks that you're lying to her about the grade level, just open it up to a random page, and ask her to read it. She will definitely have a different opinion of you after that. I really think it's great that you're reading books like that at your age. I first read it when I was in about sixth grade, so kudos to all young ones reading the Silmarillion!
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Old 05-28-2003, 09:32 PM   #8
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Yup! I agree it is way above grade eight! I can’t believe your teacher says it is not 12th grade material! Make her read the book!!

[ May 28, 2003: Message edited by: Niluial ]
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Old 05-29-2003, 09:51 AM   #9
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I read it when i was 13 and loved it, so congratz to you for reading it [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

I agree with what has been said, give the teacher the book and she will see that the language used is complex and way above the stuff that is generally thought of as reading material for young teenagers

[ May 29, 2003: Message edited by: Aule ]
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Old 05-29-2003, 11:37 AM   #10
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I'm 16 now and I read it this year,and i can agree it's on a high level.Plus English isn't my mother's tongue either.(Though I've been reading tough scientific English since I was 9 or so.)
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Old 05-29-2003, 01:35 PM   #11
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I read it when I was 14 - but, ahem, in Danish. (The library didn't have it in English! I had no choice!) Still, it's way above "your" level. Can't tell which 'grade' but in age I would say age 18-19. (Now you don't come tell me you're 25, okay? I could just imagine... [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img] )
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Old 05-29-2003, 05:13 PM   #12
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Alright, so now I know this is above my level. Now I need help with the actuall report. I must have taken my stupid pills this morining because I can't think of the Themes (morals) of the Silmarillion. Could you help me think of some? Thanks!
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Old 05-29-2003, 07:15 PM   #13
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Sting

Wow, you're in eighth grade? Me too. But I'm out of school now. Yeah! I first read it in grade 5, and I loved it, but I couldn't make much sense of it, and I didn't remember much of it. When I read it again last summer, it made a lot more sense, but it's still pretty confusing at times, especially remembering what Finarifn did as opposed to Finrod and Finwe and Feanor and Fingolfin and Fingon and....
Anyway, I'm not quite sure about the themes of the Silm. You're sure us helping you wouldn't be considered cheating? [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] Ummmm... Christians like me might notice some (okay, a lot) of Christian values, etc. in the Silmarillion (in all of Tolkien's works, really). Maybe it's because Tolkien himself was a Christian [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] . Uh, let's see, as to themes or motifs (don't ask me about the difference, because I don't know), there;s true love in Beren and Luthien, there's the classic Scandinavian tale of doom, gloom, and woe (Turin and co.), of course the victory of Good and the ultimate defeat of Evil, the corruptability of Mankind, honor and glory and all of those types of things, and you might even say that elves represent the ideal Mankind, perhaps an uncorrupted Man before the Fall. There, that should at least get you started, and have fun with your book reporrt! Good luck! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 05-29-2003, 09:08 PM   #14
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Yes its definitly above 8th grade reading level. I'm a 11th grader and I read it this year and it was pretty tough, mainly because it takes alot to keep every name straight. The F's (Finwae, Finrod, Fingolfin, etc.) are tough but its a great book and you'll have fun reading it.
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Old 05-29-2003, 09:10 PM   #15
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Themes:

A. The dangers of Pride (as seen in Turin, Feanor, Melkor, Turgon, etc.)

B. The wonders of Love (Beren and Luthien, Thingol and Melien)

C. The roots of Corruption (Melkor, Sauron, Elf-Orc transformation)

D. The supremacy of Good (Valinor, War of Wrath, Earendel, Valar, Iluvatar)

I suppose that's good enough for a paper. I'd love to write it for you, but alas I have two papers to write myself by the end of next week.

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Old 05-29-2003, 09:16 PM   #16
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I can see a theme of pride-with both Beren and Feanor.

I can also see the theme of greed as being a good one.

You could also tie in to and analyse the quote "Power corrupt, but absolute power corrupts absolutely," to the downfall of Numenor.

I love coming up with good paper themes... man I'm a geek.

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Old 05-29-2003, 10:29 PM   #17
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Wow... 12th grade? No wonder I'm having problems with it... what kind of a book report is it, wondering?

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Old 05-30-2003, 04:37 AM   #18
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Sting

The book report is nothing drastic. We call it a "story outline". You say the title, the author, the plot, the themes, etc.

It was very sad for me to write the plot because I had to leave out all the good stuff and just write a quick outline about the Simarils since they are the main goal in the story. Here's what my plot looks like.(Don't worry about telling me what you think because I've just handed the report in anyway.):

Ainulindale: In this tale Eru creates Arda and the Valar. He aloud some of the Valar to descend to the earth in order to shape and govern it. Melkor, the most powerful used his strength to destroy instead of creates. In the shaping and destroying the world was formed.
Quenta Silmarillion: When the elves first were born there were two lands; the one of the Valar, called Valinor, and the one across the sea that was ruled by Melkor, called Middle Earth. The elves were born in Middle Earth. For their own safety Manwe summons them to live in Valinor. Not all sailed across the sea. Those who did not attempt the journey were known as the Avari and later the Moriquendi. The others were called the Vanyar, the Noldor and the Teleri. The Vanyar and the Noldor all reached their destination but the Teleri split at the shore. Those who stayed became the Sindar while the others dwelt on the shores of the Valinor.
For many years the elves lived happily in the lands of the Valar. However, the Noldor became restless. The most restless of them all and perhaps the most skillful and powerful of all elves was Feanor. It was he who forged the pride and bane of many; the Silmarils. The three Simarils hold the light of the two trees of the Valar. When Morgoth destroys the trees the Valar ask Feanor for his Simarils but he refuses. However, once Feanor goes home he finds that his Simarils have been stolen by Morgoth. He and his sons take an oath to recover the Simarils from any person no matter what the costs and bans the Noldor together to pursue him. They travel back to Middle Earth. There, the Noldor, sometimes with the help of others battle Morgoth. All seems to be in vein, for Mandos cursed them so that all their deeds turned on them.
One by one, each Noldor nation fell to Morgoth. The only ones able to recover the Simarils were not even Noldor Elves. They were Luthien, Sindarian Princess and the human Beren. Their son Earendil traveled to Valinor with the Simaril to ask the Valar to save the peoples of Middle Earth from Morgoth. Being half-elven he was able to speak on behalf of both Men and Elves. At Earendil’s plea the War of Wrath ensued. Morgoth was defeated, imprisoned in “The Door of Night” beyond the “Walls of the World” and the Valar confiscated the remaining two Simarils.
Maedhros and Maglor, the only sons of Feanor that remained now, bound by their oath, reluctantly capture the Simarils from the Valar. They find that the evil they have committed in trying to regain the treasure has made them unworthy of it and the jewels burn their hands. Maedhros, in despair, flung himself into a fiery chasm. Maglor threw his into the sea. The remaining Simaril that Earendil had possessed was bound to his brow as he sailed the sky. Therefore, the Simarils find their rest in the sky, the water, and the earth.

See what I ment by cutting things out? I even had to leave out Alkallbeth so it didn't look like I was getting too detailed. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

[ May 30, 2003: Message edited by: Rose Cotton ]
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Old 05-30-2003, 04:22 PM   #19
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Sting

That was already very detailed! And it was quite good for a brief and simple plot outline with very little "real" details and a lot of things left out by necessity. I know that if I had written that paper, it would be at least five pages just for the story outline! So well done. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] I wish for your sake and your teacher's (had I not already read the Silm twuce, I would have gotten a headache just reading about all the different complicated things). It would have been cool if you had beenable to do an in-depth paper for, say, Beren and Luthien, or the Fall of Gondolin, or something like that. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 06-04-2003, 05:49 PM   #20
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I did a project on the Silmarillion a few weeks ago as well, only I had to include a theme. My theme was the futility of war. If I get time the weekend I might put it up.
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