Fan project: Lalaith's deeds - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Urwen · 02-20-2011, 02:28 AM

I might start an AU project where Lalaith lived. Already preparing material.

satansaloser2005 · 02-23-2011, 10:05 AM

Are you requesting help, or trying to give us fair warning, or wanting ideas, or what? I'm sorry, but I don't understand the point of this thread. Perhaps you could enlighten us?

Galadriel55 · 02-23-2011, 04:22 PM

This thread is Urwen's resopnse to this thread. It has nothing to do with insulting or praising Lalaith, just annoying Urwen. She insists on making a way-out-of-proportion-angel out of Lalaith, and it tends to get on peoples nerves. The link I gave is where we sort of "get revenge".

Urwen · 02-23-2011, 04:45 PM

No, in fact, that thread was in response to this thread.

And if you do that, I'll go with cheesy lemon:

Quote:

Nonsense. Lalaith wasn't even born at the time. All misfortune of Nargothrond was caused by very rare creature and the one who slew it. You see, a unicorn lived in forest near Nargothrond. One day, Celegorm went out hunting and slew it. Thus, misfortune came upon Nargothrond and Celegorm was banished cos of that. After that, Celegorm had only one goal in mind: to find Aredhel and escape back to west with her. To his woe, when he arrived in Gondolin, Aredhel was dead. Driven by longing and weariness, he forsook jis oath and went crawling to Melkor, begging him to bring Aredhel back to life. Melkor agreed, but under one condition: Celegorm had to kill Dior and bring the lost Silmaril back to Morgoth. In desperation, Celegorm consented. Once Aredhel lived, Celegorm hid her in secret and safe place. He rallied his brothers, under excuse of fulfilling the oath, to kill Dior. Once Celegorm had the Silmaril, he walked away. He and Aredhel were never seen in Middle Earth again.

And then this:

Quote:

Well, in books it clearly states that Morwen (and Turin) suffered because Lalaith died. Hurin too. He tried to sing a song for his daughter, but failed and cursed Morgoth that Valar (and Turin) would finish him off

Meanwhille, Thingol had shady negotiations with Haleth & Nellas. He made a deal that if they killed him, he would have fun with them in Mandos. You really think dwarves killed him? No, it was Nellas and Haleth with her people, disguised as dwarves. Hurin, of course, participated, as dwarf named Ibanzil (which means 'leader').

Turgon disliked dwarves, and Maeglin disliked mortal men. Yet, they harboured Tuor, along with his little 'sister'. But his 'sister' was, in fact, his cousin. He of course, renamed Lalaith, for purpose of saving Idril. He renamed her after Idril's mother.

Hurin, after killing Thingol, and after Melian left, Hurin threw himself in the sea.

As for Lalaith, she personally threw Maeglin off the cliff. People confused her with Tuor because they're cousins. Real Tuor, along with Idril and many others, already escaped. After washing her hands, Lalaith went after them and joined them at havens of Sirion.

And everybody (except Hurin and Maeglin) lived happily.

Feanor of the Peredhil · 02-23-2011, 04:50 PM

Yes, Urwen, chronology supports that your thread came first.

However, what is being asked is not which came first, but what this thread is for. It seems like you have an idea, some project in mind. What is it and why are you sharing it?

Pitchwife · 02-23-2011, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urwen

cheesy lemon:

???

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

why are you sharing it?

Good question. Urwen, I have to admit you've got me intrigued with your Lalaith obsession. I feel there must be some reason behind your choosing a very minor character in Tolkien's Legendarium and exaggerating her importance beyond all proportion, and I'd love to understand what it is. Care to explain?

TPotSS · 02-23-2011, 05:28 PM

I don't know about "deeds" (I don't think Lalaith would have done a lot in the sense of slaying and adventuring), but I think she would make the world a better place.

If Turin had been able to go to Doriath with his beloved sister, it wouldn't have been even half as lonely and sad for him, and he doesn't grow up so dark. He'd still be there when Morwen and Nienor arrive, and they'd be so happy! And probably when having meetings/conferences with their allies in Nargothrond a more normal Turin would fall in love with Finduilas and yay- another man/elf union!

And meanwhile the best best friend of Turin, Beleg, would be hanging around all the time and I think he'd probably fall in love with Lalaith and they'd get married too! (I've wondered about Nienor... Maybe Mablung?)

So once Hurin got out of Angband, he'd have a family waiting for him and he'd want to stick around. Happy ending!

So even without actual "deeds", I think Lalaith just being the delightful little lass that she is would've been the counter to Morgoth's curse. Call her a minor character if you wish, but she may be far more important than you think.

Galadriel55 · 02-23-2011, 05:38 PM

Quote:

So even without actual "deeds", I think Lalaith just being the delightful little lass that she is would've been the counter to Morgoth's curse. Call her a minor character if you wish, but she may be far more important than you think.

I agree with you on this. Lalaith in COH is indeed what you described (although three elf-man marriages isn't something that's likely to happen). However, the argument is why Urwen chooses to exaggerate everything that concerns this character. Also, why she puts the importance on other things about Lalaith (other than being innocent, happy, unmarred, a source of cheer and love, etc)?

TPotSS · 02-23-2011, 05:49 PM

Well, at least Urwen's a fan of a person, right? For a while I was obsessed with the fox from the chapter "Three's Company" that stumbles across Frodo, Sam, and Pippin and wonders about them.

I invented stories about how the fox was actually one of the Blue Wizards and was keeping watch on things or he was Huan's cousin or something and that he could help warn Fatty about the wraiths or take a message to Radagast so that he'd know for wild creatures to be on the lookout for the hobbits and help them.

I should've started a thread....

satansaloser2005 · 02-24-2011, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPotSS

Well, at least Urwen's a fan of a person, right? For a while I was obsessed with the fox from the chapter "Three's Company" that stumbles across Frodo, Sam, and Pippin and wonders about them.

I invented stories about how the fox was actually one of the Blue Wizards and was keeping watch on things or he was Huan's cousin or something and that he could help warn Fatty about the wraiths or take a message to Radagast so that he'd know for wild creatures to be on the lookout for the hobbits and help them.

I should've started a thread....

Yes, perhaps you should have, if you fancied it at the time (or even if you fancy it now). That would be devotion to a character you like, which would be very reasonable. The reason we're puzzled by this thread is that....well, Urwen's started several....

Pitchwife · 02-24-2011, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPotSS

I invented stories about how the fox was actually one of the Blue Wizards and was keeping watch on things or he was Huan's cousin or something and that he could help warn Fatty about the wraiths or take a message to Radagast so that he'd know for wild creatures to be on the lookout for the hobbits and help them.

I should've started a thread....

You're quite right that this was no everyday fox, but his true story is only remembered by few loremasters nowadays. To the Elves he was known as Oiorusco, the Wandering Fox, and he had been around since the First Age; the tale goes that Eru blessed/cursed him (depending on your point of view) with immortality, human reason and the gift of speech in reward/punishment for killing Lalaith's beloved mutant ninja geese back in old Dor-lómin.

TPotSS · 02-24-2011, 05:38 PM

Sally- I actually meant "bunches of threads". One in every sub-forum for certain, just to make sure Mr. Fox got proper exposure.

Ah, yes Pitchwife, exactly! There had to have been some crazy explanation for him! But Lalaith's ninja geese....? I haven't heard that one.

satansaloser2005 · 02-26-2011, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPotSS

Sally- I actually meant "bunches of threads". One in every sub-forum for certain, just to make sure Mr. Fox got proper exposure.

Ah. Well then, my humblest apologies, Captain.

Urwen · 03-04-2011, 05:37 AM

Because I have a bond with Children of Hurin. And Lalaith is the best way to channel that bond. Besides, I feel sorry that she died so young. I had to blame someone. And Maedhros was a natural choice, for he just HAPPENED to be Morgoth's rreason for unleashing the plague.

Are these reasons good enough for you all?

Project is nearly finished.

Meanwhille, reunion:

Quote:

And of course, Fatty Lumpkin and Old Man Willow were Turin and Nienor reborn. Old man Willow still has Turin's anger within, while Fatty still has Nienor's forgetfulness within.

With Lalaith as Golberry and Sador as Tom, the quartet is back again! Long live Hin Hurin and Sador!

satansaloser2005 · 03-04-2011, 05:04 PM

So am I to understand that you didn't want help/commentary on your project? You were just announcing it? In that case, shouldn't it have gone in a more appropriate section of the Downs (if the announcement, rather than the project itself, needed to be posted at all)? In any case, I hope your project is going well and that, when you do finish it, you post it in the correct section (though I imagine that said project will be rather hilarious).

And as usual, no, that's not a good enough reason, Urwen. You can't blame people for deaths that were brought about by natural causes. If your logic holds, I could blame Nog for the premature death of my older sister, or you, Urwen, for the passing of my aunt from old age (which, if these discussions continue, I'm afraid will become a common cause of death among Downers). I completely understand, and on some level respect, your love and devotion for such a minor character, but villifying and character bashing of another individual just because your Lallie Sue didn't get a happily ever after is not the way to bring people over to love your character and, in fact, is not the way we behave here. Again, I admire your perseverance, but you could probably think of more intelligent, reasonable ways to show your appreciation for Lalaith than by attacking other characters in the books.

And there are my thoughts on the subject. Gee. I hope I wasn't too rash.

02-20-2011, 02:28 AM	#1
Urwen Spirit of Nen Lalaith Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Meneltarma Posts: 5,376	Fan project: Lalaith's deeds I might start an AU project where Lalaith lived. Already preparing material. __________________ Tuor: Yeah, it was me who broke [Morleg's] arm. With a wrench. Specifically, this wrench. I am suffering from Maeglinomaniacal Maeglinophilia.

02-23-2011, 10:05 AM	#2
satansaloser2005 The Sweetest Spoiler Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: from beneath you it giggles incessantly Posts: 5,789	Are you requesting help, or trying to give us fair warning, or wanting ideas, or what? I'm sorry, but I don't understand the point of this thread. Perhaps you could enlighten us? __________________ "My heart always cowers behind the defense of my wit." Friendship is two pals munching on a well-cooked face together. Fenris bookworm.

02-23-2011, 04:22 PM	#3
Galadriel55 Blossom of Dwimordene Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The realm of forgotten words Posts: 10,313	This thread is Urwen's resopnse to this thread. It has nothing to do with insulting or praising Lalaith, just annoying Urwen. She insists on making a way-out-of-proportion-angel out of Lalaith, and it tends to get on peoples nerves. The link I gave is where we sort of "get revenge". __________________ You passed from under darkened dome, you enter now the secret land. - Take me to Finrod's fabled home!... ~ Finrod: The Rock Opera

02-23-2011, 04:50 PM	#5
Feanor of the Peredhil La Belle Dame sans Merci Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: perpetual uncertainty Posts: 5,517	Yes, Urwen, chronology supports that your thread came first. However, what is being asked is not which came first, but what this thread is for. It seems like you have an idea, some project in mind. What is it and why are you sharing it? __________________ peace

02-23-2011, 05:28 PM	#7
TPotSS Animated Skeleton Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: the captain's chair Posts: 42	I don't know about "deeds" (I don't think Lalaith would have done a lot in the sense of slaying and adventuring), but I think she would make the world a better place. If Turin had been able to go to Doriath with his beloved sister, it wouldn't have been even half as lonely and sad for him, and he doesn't grow up so dark. He'd still be there when Morwen and Nienor arrive, and they'd be so happy! And probably when having meetings/conferences with their allies in Nargothrond a more normal Turin would fall in love with Finduilas and yay- another man/elf union! And meanwhile the best best friend of Turin, Beleg, would be hanging around all the time and I think he'd probably fall in love with Lalaith and they'd get married too! (I've wondered about Nienor... Maybe Mablung?) So once Hurin got out of Angband, he'd have a family waiting for him and he'd want to stick around. Happy ending! So even without actual "deeds", I think Lalaith just being the delightful little lass that she is would've been the counter to Morgoth's curse. Call her a minor character if you wish, but she may be far more important than you think. __________________ You can't be a great painter. You only have one ear.

02-23-2011, 05:49 PM	#9
TPotSS Animated Skeleton Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: the captain's chair Posts: 42	Well, at least Urwen's a fan of a person, right? For a while I was obsessed with the fox from the chapter "Three's Company" that stumbles across Frodo, Sam, and Pippin and wonders about them. I invented stories about how the fox was actually one of the Blue Wizards and was keeping watch on things or he was Huan's cousin or something and that he could help warn Fatty about the wraiths or take a message to Radagast so that he'd know for wild creatures to be on the lookout for the hobbits and help them. I should've started a thread.... __________________ You can't be a great painter. You only have one ear.

02-24-2011, 05:38 PM	#12
TPotSS Animated Skeleton Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: the captain's chair Posts: 42	Sally- I actually meant "bunches of threads". One in every sub-forum for certain, just to make sure Mr. Fox got proper exposure. Ah, yes Pitchwife, exactly! There had to have been some crazy explanation for him! But Lalaith's ninja geese....? I haven't heard that one. __________________ You can't be a great painter. You only have one ear.

03-04-2011, 05:04 PM	#15
satansaloser2005 The Sweetest Spoiler Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: from beneath you it giggles incessantly Posts: 5,789	So am I to understand that you didn't want help/commentary on your project? You were just announcing it? In that case, shouldn't it have gone in a more appropriate section of the Downs (if the announcement, rather than the project itself, needed to be posted at all)? In any case, I hope your project is going well and that, when you do finish it, you post it in the correct section (though I imagine that said project will be rather hilarious). And as usual, no, that's not a good enough reason, Urwen. You can't blame people for deaths that were brought about by natural causes. If your logic holds, I could blame Nog for the premature death of my older sister, or you, Urwen, for the passing of my aunt from old age (which, if these discussions continue, I'm afraid will become a common cause of death among Downers). I completely understand, and on some level respect, your love and devotion for such a minor character, but villifying and character bashing of another individual just because your Lallie Sue didn't get a happily ever after is not the way to bring people over to love your character and, in fact, is not the way we behave here. Again, I admire your perseverance, but you could probably think of more intelligent, reasonable ways to show your appreciation for Lalaith than by attacking other characters in the books. And there are my thoughts on the subject. Gee. I hope I wasn't too rash. __________________ "My heart always cowers behind the defense of my wit." Friendship is two pals munching on a well-cooked face together. Fenris bookworm.