Tol-in-Gaurhoth (Isle of Werewolves)

[Rikae]

Patented Rikae double post ...

So here's what I'm tentatively thinking of right now.

- 3 wolves, unless it's a huge village. Perhaps NW role comes into play when two(three) wolves are dead? NW not being a specific wolf, but a collective ability of the dead pack.

- cobbler, only ever revealed as ordo, whether dead or dreamed

- seer (straightforward normal seer)

- ranger (straightforward normal ranger)

- weaver. This was a role in the first game I ever played. It's a bit like a seer, but instead of seeing one players role, they see whether two players have the same alignment (so, for the weaver, cobbler & wolf would come out as "same alignment"). I'm thinking of having this be another role that only becomes active on death, and looks like an ordo to the seer and in their death narration.

- hunter (undecided about logical vs illogical)

So there will be 3 possible unknown roles among the dead.

-------------------------------------------------
Rules

-The dead may talk day and Night

-during the Night, the dead may elect a ghost. They get 3 chances to do this, and cannot choose the same ghost twice. I'm thinking of doing it this way to force the dead to think about these choices rather than sending back the last night-kill every day. To make the choice whether to send a ghost at all democratic, those who want not to could vote ++no ghost.

- the ghost returns to the game thread the next Day. They cannot communicate with the dead while haunting. They may only make 3 posts, which can only be sentences from Tolkien, but they may make these posts at any point during the day, allowing them to respond to new developments (I'm going for maximum frustration for living, dead, and ghost here, because it amuses me ).
If the first chapter thing is just to avoid pointing to signatures, I think it might be okay to open it up to all quotes, given the last rule on this list. After all, people have always had the ability to hint by alluding to signatures, but they rarely do.

- the dead may also cast a collective vote during the Day (???)
This would also mean the ghost did not get to participate in voting while they were haunting. I kind of like this, since I'd like sending a ghost to be a costly choice the dead will only make if they feel like they have something important to convey, but alternatively, I could let them privately cast a vote to be counted in the dead's election that day, or let them vote on the living thread.

- strict ban on the living giving instructions to the ghost or the dead (aside from the general "Boro is a wolf, vote for him!" type thing directed at everyone). Violators will be yeeted into the void.

[Boromir88]

Yes to not revealing the cobbler if they die.

I think I always err on the side of trying not to restrict content in posts, because I like having as many options on the table as possible. However, I think in this case with the Ghost role, where every day 1 person comes back to the living to pass off cryptic information, Rikae's suggestion makes sense. I think it would be important in having the Ghost role be one where the living players are forbidden to direct the returning Ghost a plan to relay the information.

[Loslote]

I think these rules sound like a fun game, Rikae! I really like the idea of not letting the Living try to dictate to the Dead - I think trying to figure out what the Dead meant after they do something is way more fun than trying to dictate to them ahead of time for both the Living and the Dead anyway. I love the idea of the cobbler not being revealed.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Love all this, Rikae! And after thinking about it, the three posts may be very well enough for the Ghost - some people post only as many (not counting maybe some one-liner vote post) even when alive!

Just for clarification, I assume the Ghost can't quote (as in, quote: <somebody's post> /end quote). That would be unfair and would allow them to skirt around the ambiguity (as in, they could quote the post of someone they want to accuse and add to it their own quote about how Wargs attacked the Fellowship, or something.

And the NW would be the first Wolf dead? Or how would it work? I assume that's the third "unknown role" you are referring to? (Aside from the weaver and cobbler.)

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Just for clarification, I assume the Ghost can't quote (as in, quote: <somebody's post> /end quote). That would be unfair and would allow them to skirt around the ambiguity (as in, they could quote the post of someone they want to accuse and add to it their own quote about how Wargs attacked the Fellowship, or something.

Yeah, I'm thinking they can only post their Tolkien sentences (and a vote, if they get to vote).

And the NW would be the first Wolf dead? Or how would it work? I assume that's the third "unknown role" you are referring to? (Aside from the weaver and cobbler.)

Once total wolves-minus-1 are dead, they can send in a NW pick each night as a group the way they'd normally send a kill, of a living player to block.

[Galadriel55]

Just wanna say that 1) I like Rikae's idea about the Weaver, that would give the DT actual information to convey to the LT and therefore a purpose for the Ghost, and 2) If we want a true Twitter game, I will even get Twitter for this purpose.

[Blind Guardian]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Just wanna say that 1) I like Rikae's idea about the Weaver, that would give the DT actual information to convey to the LT and therefore a purpose for the Ghost, and 2) If we want a true Twitter game, I will even get Twitter for this purpose.

My Twitter name is video game related so that no one IRL can find me, but I will totally change it to my Downs name if we play.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

And the fire died out?

I've been coming back every day to see what's happening. I just figured that as time got close Rikae would put up a planning thread.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Blind Guardian

I just figured that as time got close Rikae would put up a planning thread.

Yeah, several people mentioned wanting a break before the next game so I figured I'd give it some time.

[Rikae]

Discussion thread is up!

[Formendacil]

Okay, there's a little "we're still interested" action on Rikae's CXVI thread, but no sign of Rikae, so I'll post here. What's the state of things? I have motivation and a window of opportunity and I'm not afraid to use either.

From the end of that thread, here's a player-list of those expressing interest (very, very tentative):

Formendacil
Boro
Loslote
Sally
BG
Hui
Soriman

That's 7--or 6 and a mod. Bit tight but not QUITE impossible.

From the Facebook "who's interested still?" post I made a month ago, everyone who either "liked" it or commented--question marks heaving stress:

Legate?
Kath?
Greenie?
Pitch?
Lommie?
Eomer?

Throw five more in and that's eleven: doable.

(BTW, here's a much older potential player list from Rikae's CXVI thread:

Loslote
Legate
Boromir88
Blind Guardian
Lalaith
Pitchwife
Sally
Nogrod (?)
Thinlómien
Kath
Huinesoron
A Little Green)

I'm sure if I really dig back, there's a prospective Mod-list somewhere, and I certainly think Rikae should mod if she wants to--but I think it's a better idea to get a game off the ground NOW if people are ready.

So if someone (me, as a placeholder) were to Mod a game starting, say: Monday, April 19th, 2021, who wants in?

[Huinesoron]

I guess I'll say "in" for the 19th April unless you get lots of people who really want to.

If it were you modding , would you be using Rikae’s setup, another you have planned, or just a standard template (I'm assuming not a long discussion over what it should be)? In any event I'd like to request that we have a Dead Thread even if it's just observing and doesn't interact with the Game Thread at all - it's fun to bicker along and then discover we were totally wrong about everything even while dead!

(I think this point was generally agreed on, so I don't think it's controversial?)

hS

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Huinesoron

I guess I'll say "in" for the 19th April unless you get lots of people who really want to.

If it were you modding , would you be using Rikae’s setup, another you have planned, or just a standard template (I'm assuming not a long discussion over what it should be)? In any event I'd like to request that we have a Dead Thread even if it's just observing and doesn't interact with the Game Thread at all - it's fun to bicker along and then discover we were totally wrong about everything even while dead!

(I think this point was generally agreed on, so I don't think it's controversial?)

hS

I think Dead Threads should be mandatory. :-p This is the Barrow-downs, after all.

I'd like to give "the Ghost" a try in some form, but I am:

A. Thinking of myself as a placeholder name and therefore not too hard about it.

B. It'll depend on the numbers. Though... if it is a SMALL game, (say less than 12ish), it might make for a good test run. I'd say I envision something like:

Six Players
1 Wolf
1 Gifted (ranger? hunter?)
4 Ordos

Ten Players
2 Wolves
1 Cobbler
1 Seer
1 Ghost

Sixteen Players
3 Wolves
1 Cobbler
1 Seer
1 Ranger
1 Hunter
1 Ghost

Honestly, the breakdown per tier is very much spur-of-the-moment. I am, besides not being wedded to modding, very open for suggestion/negotiation there, but I think it illustrates the different tiers of size and how that might impact the roles. I think a Ghost should be possible even in a smaller game, but it WOULD make that game very much a test of that role.

[Galadriel55]

I will not even tempt myself into playing. In the next two months I have a Very Big Exam, then time with family where they deserve my full attention, then the start of a new job. Neither time is good for playing in a WW game. However, I will of course read and goof around and make cobbler apparitions. Also, I am very happy to co-mod, or perhaps even mod, depending on the size. I find that modding is a bit like being the apparition, but also being omnipotent, and therefore not very stressful or taxing. I kinda feel bad though, because I feel that I've modded disproportionately too many times for recent games, having dropped out of many. But if, and only if, no one else wants to mod and Form wants to play, I can take over whatever set up is agreed upon and run with it. If it's done before I go see family, you may even get on-time deadline posts.

[A Little Green]

Originally Posted by Form

So if someone (me, as a placeholder) were to Mod a game starting, say: Monday, April 19th, 2021, who wants in?

Thanks for getting the ball rolling, Form! Count me in please

[Loslote]

As long as we start before June, I'm in! Very excited to get in one more game before the start of the summer.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Looks like with the spring in the air, everything is awakening, including the tombs... Simbelmynë. No, wait...

Anyways, a small game would surely not hurt me. Right? Right?

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

However, I will of course read and goof around and make cobbler apparitions.

I think we have learned to expect that. A game without Cobbler55 would be somehow, hum hmm, lacking.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Also, I am very happy to co-mod, or perhaps even mod, depending on the size. I find that modding is a bit like being the apparition, but also being omnipotent, and therefore not very stressful or taxing. I kinda feel bad though, because I feel that I've modded disproportionately too many times for recent games, having dropped out of many. But if, and only if, no one else wants to mod and Form wants to play, I can take over whatever set up is agreed upon and run with it. If it's done before I go see family, you may even get on-time deadline posts.

"Modded disproportionately too many times for recent games" - the recent games being several years ago, I don't think that's an issue. I think we have reached the stage that whoever wants to mod should mod. Sure, people who modded less recently should get priority if they desire to mod, but there does not seem to be exactly a queue. At least not yet?

[Huinesoron]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

"Modded disproportionately too many times for recent games" - the recent games being several years ago, I don't think that's an issue.

- "Thou didst moderate but ten games past; repent of thine desire for power and dominion!"

- "But that was in 2004."

- "Thy numbers foul have no hold over me, dwimmerlaik!"



hS

[Kuruharan]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

I have motivation and a window of opportunity and I'm not afraid to use either.

I cannot play. I wish I could, but neither my personal nor professional life right now will admit to such a possibility.

But I, as usual, cannot rep Form because I've done it too recently (probably last year sometime) and I just had to publically tell him what an uncontrollable fit of laughter I had when I read the above.

I picture him saying this with quite a deranged look on his face, staring down a hostage negotiator.

[Formendacil]

Originally Posted by Kuruharan

I cannot play. I wish I could, but neither my personal nor professional life right now will admit to such a possibility.

But I, as usual, cannot rep Form because I've done it too recently (probably last year sometime) and I just had to publically tell him what an uncontrollable fit of laughter I had when I read the above.

I picture him saying this with quite a deranged look on his face, staring down a hostage negotiator.

You should never underestimate a deranged man with control of an open window!

We do seem to be few. If we press a reluctant Galadriel to mod for us, we have a confirmed ready-to-play list of:

Formendacil
Huinesoron
Greenie
Loslote
Legate

and... I think?

Soriman
Blind Guardian
Sally

Eight would be manageable in a "1 Gifted, 1 or 2 Wolves" kind of way and I incline to say "let's do it!" but it is only Wednesday and perhaps we shall lure a few more.

[Galadriel55]

Originally Posted by Formendacil

We do seem to be few. If we press a reluctant Galadriel to mod for us, we have a confirmed ready-to-play list of:

I fear I would not have to be pressed hard. How about I do Deputy Mod until someone shows up to claim their rightful place, and if no one does before the start of the game I'll go on modding.

And as such, I think we need to get consensus on a few points before Monday hits us.

The first is roles and numbers. Formy, I think you are missing Boro from your list, he posted in Rikae's thread. Maybe let's confirm that - Boro, BG, and Soriman - you've all posted on the other thread, could you confirm you still want to play? I trust sally will be there, though I would not yet put bets on her being there quite on D1.

With only 9 people, I think 2 baddies is tops. Following "worst case scenario" numbers, 2/9 baddies brings endgame on D3, whereas 3 of them bring it on D2, and that's just too soon. One or two gifteds? If there is only one Gifted, which one? I vote against Hunter, that one just brings the numbers down too much in a single strike for such a small game. Ranger or Seer?

Then, what happens to the dead. A Dead Thread is a must. ^.^ But should they have a role in the game. Are they allowed a vote on the living thread? Do they send a Ghost to haunt the living? And what is their objective in doing so, phrased in such a way that being a dead wolf wouldn't be terrible existence?

Since the games of last summer, I've been mulling over ways to unite the DT in a common cause which lets everyone actively participate on equal footing. What I came up with is this: the Dead hold a grudge at being killed, and take petty revenge by seeking to make as many people as possible join their ranks - ie their goal is to get the Living Thread to reach endgame. That way, its support is always given to the "losing" side, whichever that may be, regardless of the Dead's former roles. However, I'm not sure how that would integrate with the Ghost in practice - what is the Ghost in practice? - and I think the Ghost should see a test run here.

...So, basically, any thoughts on what are the actual rules of the game? Thoughts on the Ghost and DT responsibilities.


And a few minor things that also must be sorted before the start:
Deadline preference? I live in GMT-4. Though in the next 2-3 weeks my schedule is flexible, please be kind and don't ask for 4am local time.
Preference on tied votes? Many people hate the first-to-reach-tie, some hate the last-to-reach-tie, opinions differ on both or none options. Given that this is a small game, would it make more sense to have neither party lynched? Certainly not both. What do you guys think?


That was a much longer post than I intended. But really, I think it's good to figure out what game we're playing before the start date.