WW: LXXXVI - The Halls of Mandos

[Rikae]

This is an experimental game with an additional game thread for the dead.

Activities on the living thread:
Plain old werewolf, except: Roles are not revealed upon death.

Activities on the dead thread:
Every Day, the dead people get to vote on giving one of the living an extra vote. Their voting ends at the same time as the living vote ends, so it will be unknown to the living who among them has the extra vote. The identity of the double voter will be revealed in the narration. Every Night (beginning when there are at least 3 dead), the dead people vote for one among themselves . At the end of the vote it will be revealed whether the person counts for the wolves or the innocent. (In other words, they will be told whether a fellow dead person is a wolf or not.)

The living may not look into the dead thread. There is, of course, no way to actually enforce that, so players are on the honor system.
The dead can continue reading the living thread, but, of course, may not post there. They may also read the entire dead thread, including parts posted before their own death.

Participation in the Mandos thread is optional. No modfire is awaiting anyone.
Living players who do not vote for two consecutive days will be modfired (moved to the dead thread).

Players who don't abide by the lovely werewolf rules will be modfired (for real), glazed, and used to mix cookie dough. :P

Macalaure will be my co-mod, and we can start the game once we have a full village (ideally 20, but we'll go ahead with fewer if signups are slow).

Deadline will probably be around 10 or 11 PM EST.

Multiple lynches of any number of players are allowed. In Mandos, tied votes will be decided by a coin toss.l


The roles (let us know if you have any suggestions/comments):

-3 wolves. Normal wolf pack.
Clarification:
Living wolves can PM one another by Night, and dead wolves can PM one another at any time. Living wolves, however, cannot communicate with dead wolves.

-3 cobblers. No special powers.

-Beren and Lúthien - Lovers: when one dies, xe spends 1 Day among the dead, then returns to the living for 1 Day, after which both die. Aligned with the village, win if village wins.

-Glorfindel - Ranger: like the lovers, Glorfindel will spend 1 Day in Mandos and then return to the living the Day after that. Before his return, he has one protection per Night; after his return, he will have the ability to protect two people every Night. He can protect himself. He cannot protect a person twice in a row.

-Seer. Normal seer, except that xe continues to dream after xer death. Can only dream of the living when alive, can only dream of the dead after his death. Can detect cobblers.

-Hunter. Normal illogical hunter.


Players:

Shasta
Nogrod
Aganzir
Glirdan
A Little Green
elronds_daughter
Mänwe
Nerwen
Loslote
Wilwa
Legate
Lommy
Nessa
Blind Guardian
satansaloser2005
the phantom
Boromir88
Mithalwen
Anguirel
Fea

[Loslote]

Oh, wow. This looks like so very much fun! I am definitely in.

[wilwarin538]

This looks too amazing to pass up, so despite being sorta busy with school I have to join! School isn't that important anyway.

[Nogrod]

Oops! A cool idea indeed!

Wouldn't you wish to lynch me early, Please! This is the first time I'll beg for it!

I like the new Ranger & seer -rules!

I do hope you'll bring the number of cobblers down if we don't have 20 players though...? I mean if the living are not able to know what was the alignment of the dead, a bunch of cobblers will make it just... nightmarish.

Like they would know in turn... heh.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

How can Glorfindel die for real? Just wondering, because the way I'm reading it now, it's that at the beginning he protects one person per night, wolves kill him, he spends a day in Mandos, comes back the next day powered up. Is it just that if he dies again he dies for real?

Also, for the roles that can vacillate between the two threads - can information from the Mandos thread leak into the 'alive' thread that way, or are players that vacillate on the honor system not to reveal anything from there?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Now that sounds really too interesting! Sign me in for sure.

And for that matter, I think Lommy also wanted to sign up (Greenie had said that as part of her own sign-up).

Originally Posted by Rikae

Multiple lynches of any number of players are allowed.

Ai, ai, I predict that this will not end well... but anyway, does this mean it works also for Mandos? I assume not, because it won't make much sense, so what are the rules for a tie of votes for Mandos?

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Legate

Ai, ai, I predict that this will not end well...

Hey, it worked fine in the Orc-game... for the Orcs anyway.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Shasta

How can Glorfindel die for real?

First time he dies he returns after spending one Day in Mandos. Second time he dies, he goes to Mandos for good.

Originally Posted by Shasta

Also, for the roles that can vacillate between the two threads - can information from the Mandos thread leak into the 'alive' thread that way, or are players that vacillate on the honor system not to reveal anything from there?

Yes. That's the point, in fact. We should have mentioned that.

While the living officially know nothing about the roles of the lynched/killed, the dead accumulate knowledge one by one and the two people who can return from the dead can provide some light for the living.

Originally Posted by Legate

Ai, ai, I predict that this will not end well... but anyway, does this mean it works also for Mandos? I assume not, because it won't make much sense, so what are the rules for a tie of votes for Mandos?

Ah, we missed that, I think. No double choices for the dead, but we haven't thought about the tie-breaker, yet. Will soon be added.

[Nessa Telrunya]

Woah, this sounds great! I may be slow this week because I'm starting a new semester, but go ahead and sign me up!

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

Hey, it worked fine in the Orc-game... for the Orcs anyway.

That's exactly what I was thinking. I was among those who got lynched back then...

[Aganzir]

This sounds fabulous.

This is a silly question, but when a person dies, is she allowed to read the entire Dead Thread and not just from her death on?

[Macalaure]

You're allowed (and encouraged) to read the entire dead thread.

[Rikae]

Great to see everyone!

Do you think it's too difficult for the village? They do have the reincarnating ranger, as well as a way to access the dreams of a dead seer, but I'm not sure if that is enough to balance the large number of baddies & lack of knowledge. Perhaps I could add another advantage for the innocents.

Cobblers are important so that the dead thread can potentially be a den of cobblery (more so the better the village does, even) & wolf kills won't automatically be known innocents. If the innocents do badly, the influence of the dead will be more positive, too.

You can imagine, I love being able to force people to rely more heavily on interpreting posts...

[Mänwe]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Multiple lynches of any number of players are allowed.

Sorry Rikae and Mac, but could you clarify how this works please?

[Rikae]

If two (or more) players are tied for the highest number of votes, they both (all) get lynched.

[Mänwe]

Ah! Thanks

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Ah, we missed that, I think. No double choices for the dead, but we haven't thought about the tie-breaker, yet. Will soon be added.

So I take it that the Dead Thread doesn't sleep (ie. they post both night and day)? And when the first person is lynched, she can just vote to reveal her role, right?

Does the seer see cobblers as ordos?

[Glirdan]

Just a forewarning to all that with the added adition to now being a part of my local community theatre group in my life (yes, the same one that I was a part of last year and had to leave Boston early for :P), my time may be cut back quite substantially. Everything is all up in the air so don't be surprised if I am not posting frequently.

Oh, and in case anyone is wondering, we're performing Miss Saigon

[Rikae]

Yep, the dead vote night and day. I'm not sure whether to give the seer the power to see cobblers or not yet.

[Kitanna]

The DL for Nog's game was too pressing for me because it was right when I got out of work. Buuut....despite my better judgement I might have to play. Please put me down as a maybe. I'll look at my work schedule and let you know.

[elronds_daughter]

This sounds like lots of complex fun. It'll make me feel better if I get dead too quickly.

[Shastanis Althreduin]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Yep, the dead vote night and day. I'm not sure whether to give the seer the power to see cobblers or not yet.

Well, you were looking for another advantage to give the innocents... but on the other hand, making it that simple to find the cobblers may make them too harmless.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

You're allowed (and encouraged) to read the entire dead thread.

Oh, that might be quite a lot of reading... especially if Cobblers wreak havoc there... well, I guess that's the point...

Originally Posted by Rikae

Do you think it's too difficult for the village? They do have the reincarnating ranger, as well as a way to access the dreams of a dead seer, but I'm not sure if that is enough to balance the large number of baddies & lack of knowledge. Perhaps I could add another advantage for the innocents.

Cobblers are important so that the dead thread can potentially be a den of cobblery (more so the better the village does, even) & wolf kills won't automatically be known innocents. If the innocents do badly, the influence of the dead will be more positive, too.

Not sure if difficult, I would say more like totally different. They will have strong Ranger and such, but there will be basically no immediate knowledge gained from lynching somebody etc. You may as well be in the dark for several Days.

Originally Posted by Rikae

You can imagine, I love being able to force people to rely more heavily on interpreting posts...

I would have expected you not to overestimate interpreting posts after the last game's experience...

Originally Posted by Aganzir

So I take it that the Dead Thread doesn't sleep (ie. they post both night and day)? And when the first person is lynched, she can just vote to reveal her role, right?

Hey, that's actually an important point - and it could be a problem. How are you going to solve it during the first days? Because by Night 2, you'll have 1 person on the dead thread, by Night 3, three people, if everything goes "normal". Will there be a vote in Mandos only from Night 3 onwards, or after there are at least 3 dead people (in case there is a Ranger save the previous Night and so on, because then you could not effectively have a vote if there are just two people voting)? The point is, if the first person could simply vote herself, then of course she would do so if she is innocent, and clearly, if she is a Cobbler/Wolf, she probably wouldn't want to do that... unless you make it e.g. so that person who dies first is automatically revealed in any case, etc...

[Macalaure]

Re: tie-breakers in the dead thread. Rikae edited it into the original post, but just so everyone knows: they will be decided by a die.

It should also be added that dead wolves and living wolves may not pm. Two dead wolves may pm again, Night and Day. The same rule holds for the lovers.

Originally Posted by Legate

Oh, that might be quite a lot of reading...

It will be interesting, I think, whether it will be or not. Participation is not required after all, and the first few nights and days there will only be a few people.

Originally Posted by Legate

How are you going to solve it during the first days? Because by Night 2, you'll have 1 person on the dead thread, by Night 3, three people, if everything goes "normal".

Another rule we talked about, but failed to put down here: the voting for the extra vote will start once the first person joins the dead. The vote for the revealing of roles starts once the population reaches 3.

[Aganzir]

Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin

Well, you were looking for another advantage to give the innocents... but on the other hand, making it that simple to find the cobblers may make them too harmless.

I don't think so. They'd have to look suspicious enough so the wolves don't kill them but innocent enough so the seer doesn't dream them... Which provides some additional challenge for them. And a known cobbler isn't necessarily a harmless cobbler.

[Rikae]

I think I will give the seer the ability to see cobblers; after all, the seer might be a cobbler for all the village knows, and only the dead (or someone who returns from the dead) will be able to verify the seer's identity. For the village to detect a cobbler with certainty will still take several steps and a bit of luck.

[Macalaure]

Actually, with the way we have it right now, the seer's role can't be verified with certainty at all, since the dead people can only distinguish wolves and non-wolves. The seer can only be told apart from an imposting cobbler by circumstantial evidence.

[elronds_daughter]

I'm assuming, even though it wasn't stated outright, that the dead are allowed to read the living's conversation so as to best choose the recipient of an extra vote... Unless of course the extra vote is meant to be rather random...which I could see having some benefit, but....oh, dear, now I'm just confusing myself.

[Blind Guardian]

Finally! A game where the Dead participate!

Heck yeah I'll play!

[Rikae]

Yes, the dead can read the living thread.

BG - yep, this is the ideal game for anyone who fears being lynched/killed early on.

[Glirdan]

Hence why I am here....after all, I'll be dead in two Days anyways

[wilwarin538]

Originally Posted by Glirdan

Hence why I am here....after all, I'll be dead in two Days anyways

Aww. *snuggles* I promise not to vote for you.......unless you act suspicious.

I have to say that this player list is pretty awesome. This is going to be epic. Hopefully I have time to participate more than last game.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

I just want to say that this game looks amazing and I am very much looking forward to following it.

[Inziladun]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

I just want to say that this game looks amazing and I am very much looking forward to following it.

Ditto. I'm taking a long overdue WW break, and it'll be nice to watch everyone else in the pressure cooker.

[Boromir88]

I came in to check if the DL was do-able, but didn't even get that far, you had me at "additional thread for the dead." Mwahaha no way anyone can miss this new creative idea (including the Lovers and Glorfindel roles! ). And it just so happens that the DL works fine, preferably 11 pm, but 10 works out too.

[Nogrod]

The DL for me (and the other Finns) will be quite bad indeed, so we'll have to vote quite early.

But on top of that, I'm once again trying to play a bit more easily (not topping the posters' list... just not to lose my sleep).

Let's see how I can manage with that.

I'm trying...

[Rikae]

Nog - well, that's a good way for you to get lynched early!

So, if Fea and Kitanna are in, we're good to go. Otherwise, there's room for two more...

[Kitanna]

I'm afraid I can't join. Too much to do at work, not enough time to play.

[Anguirel]

I have to say I'm kind of toteing it up

(is that how you spell toteing?)

(toting? totting? surely not.)

((if you'd have me. I must say I'd be quieter and more temporally challenged than previous form))

[Mithalwen]

Oh Captain, my Captain!