Rivendell Elves & Lothlorien Elves

[Haldir]

Can somebody please explain to me why the
Rivendell Elves (Elrond, Arwen) got black
hair and why the Lothlorien Elves got blonde
hair (Galadriel, Celeborn, Haldir, Legolas)?

(please give me an explaination even if it
just "screwed up movie" or "they're Sindar
and they're Galads")

[Airetalathwen]

I think it's just genetic. The Elves that are still in ME are collections of the original three groups (Noldor, Vanyar, Teleri.) I'm guessing, that at the beginning,(Way, way, way back to before first age) no specific hair color was predominate in any of the groups. But maybe after separating into smaller and smaller groups, the genetics got more and more narrower, as various tribes secluded themselves from the other elves (like the the Laiquendi, or 'Green-elves') and married only in their little group. Somewhere it says that Thranduil (Legolas' dad and king of the elves in Mirkwood,) has light hair, so maybe his peole did too.

Galadriel is of the Noldor, and she had light golden hair. But her cousin, Aredhel, also of the Noldor, had dark hair.

So I believe it's partly due to the fact that elves are very much kin/tribe oriented, and they like to stay within their own group. So, a certain dominant hair color would eventually keep occuring.

I might have just confused you more that enlightened you!

~Airetalathwen

[obloquy]

The golden hair came exclusively from the Vanyar. Galadriel's grandmother, Indis, was Vanyarin.

[Eruhen]

Really? I was under the impression that blond hair was dominant in the Elves (esp. in the Vanyar), and that Dark hair was dominant in Men. This says that the reason that Elrond and Arwen had dark hair was because they are Peredhil (Half-elven).

In the stories i have read, only Elrond, his brother, Elrond's two sons and his daughter were the only elves mentioned with dark hair. As i understood it, in the begining all elves had golden hair. Only mention of a different hair color has in Elrond's line, because him and his brother were half-elven, who could uniquely choose between a man's death or an elf's immortality, which every one knows Elrond chose the latter and his brother chose the former, thus he became the first king of Numenor. [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img]

[obloquy]

Vanyar
This name was probably given to the First Clan by the Ñoldor. They accepted it, but continued to call themselves most often by their old numerical name Minyar (since the whole of this clan had joined the Eldar and reached Aman). The name referred to the hair of the Minyar, which was in nearly all members of the clan yellow or deep golden. This was regarded as a beautiful feature by the Ñoldor (who loved gold), though they were themselves mostly dark-haired. Owing to intermarriage the golden hair of the Vanyar sometimes later appeared among the Ñoldor: notably in the case of Finarfin, and in his children Finrod and Galadriel, in whom it came from King Finwe s second wife, Indis of the Vanyar.
...it [Vanyar] meant 'pale, light-coloured, not brown or dark'...
.......
In general the Sindar appear to have very closely resembled the Exiles [who were Noldor], being dark-haired...

Quendi and Eldar

Finarfin was of his mother's kind in mind and body, having the golden hair of the Vanyar...

Unfinished Tales

All the Eldar had beautiful hair (and were especially attracted by hair of exceptional loveliness), but the Ñoldor were not specially remarkable in this respect, and there is no reference to Finwë as having had hair of exceptional length, abundance, or beauty beyond the measure of his people.(11)

(Author's Note 11)He had black hair, but brilliant grey-blue eyes.

The Shibboleth of Feanor

[Glim Iceholder]

As i understood it, in the begining all elves had golden hair. Only mention of a different hair color has in Elrond's line

I don't know what lead you to believe that but Tolkien states otherwise. Like others have said, Dark hair was the most common among Elves, only the Vanyar(and those related to them such as the house of Finarfin like Galadriel) had blond/golden hair.

Legolas is a Sindar so I would assume he should really have dark hair. In the Hobbit Thranduil's hair is described as golden which is probably why the movie gave him blond hair, but you must remember the Hobbit was written before Tolkien ever really go in depth on Elves.

EDIT: I just thought of something else, I believe somewhere Tolkien says that some close descendants of Elwe had silver hair.

[ March 12, 2002: Message edited by: Glim Iceholder ]

[Ahanarion]

You can't forget mutation.

[Joy]

In the story of Lùtien and Beren, it states in the Silm that she and her father Thingol have dark hair.

[Joy]

In the story of Lùtien and Beren, it states in the Silm that she and her father Thingol have dark hair. They were of the Sindarin Elves. Galadriel was of the Vanyarin Elves.

[obloquy]

I was about to ask how you'd gotten over 400 posts in about a month, Joy, but I guess now I know. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

[ March 12, 2002: Message edited by: obloquy ]

Someone said that Tolkien wrote the Hobbit before starting a history on the elves.

I don't know where you got that, as when he was a professor he had well and truly started on the mythology of middle earth. Before he even wrote The Hobbit he had maps of his imaginary land and it was from his notes and drawings and language tables that his..ok I'll stop rambling and ranting!

Cut the long of it short, read more about him and enjoy!

"Learning is fun" - Bender, FUTURAMA. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

[obloquy]

Fall of Gondolin was written in 1919. Nary a hobbit. Still, The Hobbit is subject to Bilbo's fancy throughout, and can hardly be taken as concrete evidence of anything. That's not to say he would have fabricated Thranduil's hair color. I was a little too limiting in my first comment here -- the golden hair wasn't exclusive to the Vanyar, but it was rare among the other families. Interestingly, it is written that none of the Vanyar abandoned the Journey and became Avari.