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Old 03-19-2005, 11:55 AM   #81
Anguirel
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Together, I think the Bridge of Khazad Dum, Lothlorien, and the Great River represent the absolute peak of the FOTR soundtrack.

The Bridge (Track 13, appropriately enough), is quite simply the most dramatic track on the FOTR CD. I see the scene swimming before my eyes. And...how do I describe this...the Fellowship theme is far more...urgent...than in, say, the Ring Goes South. I'm struggling with the musical vocabulary, but there are these sort of higher notes streaming from it, like sparks off a blade. The shadow and flame really emanates from it, and especially later from the choir.

Like others, I at first didn't like Lothlorien, either visually or musically. I remembered the joyous haven, the relief I'd experienced on my first reading; how I was literally begging my book to stay longer, never to leave the safety and beauty of the golden eaves. The "menace" of Track 14 just didn't seem right. But it's grown on me (as has the film interpretation, with the fabulous FOTR EE.) It's simply another point of view, and an interesting one. What must Boromir, Gimli, Merry or Pippin have thought on entering this strange land of dreams, where the branches resounded with laments? The melancholia of the place is caught exactly.

As for the Great River...it's actually the most fully Elven music in FOTR. I can never be satisfied with listening to it once; I have to replay the voyage...
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Old 03-19-2005, 02:33 PM   #82
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I love this track because it portrays the Argonath and their granduer so well while at the same time it has a melancholy tone since the Argonath are a reminder of the Kingdom of Gondor during its greatness and now it is in a weakened state.

Quote:
Et Ešrello Endorenna utķlien.
Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!

Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come.
In this place I will abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world!
This is actually a foreshadowing of what is to come, the return of the king; because Aragorn sings this in ROTK as he stands in Minas Tirith. I didn't realize that untill now, so thanks for the lyrics Encaitare
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Old 03-23-2005, 10:35 PM   #83
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Just had to say this is a fantastic idea for a thread and as soon as Im not so heavily burdended with schoolwork i will be right on to making some contributions!
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Old 03-25-2005, 08:32 PM   #84
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Track 16: Amon Hen

The track begins sounding rather eerie, with the choir and strings slowly building. At this point, Boromir is trying to convince Frodo to give him the Ring, and the choir sings the following (in Quenya):

Quote:
i tuo...
i macil...
... (a?)staldaron...
marinyŽ... cor...
i tuo...
i macil...
a lelyat
tķrenna...
i tuo...

the strength...
the sword...
... of-the-valiant (?)...
I-live... ring (?)...
the strength...
the sword...
let they go (?)
to-victory...
the strength...
It seems like a little bit of a rough translation, but it corresponds pretty well to what is going on. Boromir truly believes that he can save Gondor by use of the Ring. After this little episode, the strings become dominant for a bit as Frodo tries to run.

The brass solo which immediately follows reminds me of the Minas Tirith theme that we'll hear in RotK, symbolizing Boromir's fierce loyalty to his land. I have not watched FotR in a long time, so I'm a bit rusty on what exactly is going on after this -- battle shots, I imagine. But at 2:07, the Isengard theme returns with the Uruk-hai. It stops at 2:36, but not before delivering three last hammerblows, which further drive home the point that Boromir, our valiant warrior, is being shot down. The choir returns, mournfully backed up by strings:

Quote:
... i alda helda
i ehtelŽ lin(d)a.
Manna lelyalyŽ
VoromirŽ...
canelya ... dessŽ si .... mas

... the tree naked
the spring beautiful.
Where-to you-go
Boromir...
your-valour... ?-in now ... ?
For me this is the most emotional track, because in the movie the sound fades until it seems as though everything is happening very far away, and the music covers most of it up. You can hear Boromir's cries, and see Merry and Pippin's distraught faces just by listening.

Gentle brass and strings playing the Fellowship theme end the track; I believe this is played in the movie when Boromir is finally dead.

One thing I'm not so sure about is this: supposedly, the following lines are sung while Boromir is being shot:

Quote:
ŕ-velin i vegil an aegas
egor i bilin a linnas

I-do-not-love the sword for sharpness,
or the arrow for swiftness
This is of course from Faramir's speech in TTT (the book): "...but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend: the city of the Men of Numenor..." It's a beautiful passage, and very appropriate for what is going on. However, it doesn't seem to be in the track itself. Maybe it's just in the movie?
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Old 03-26-2005, 05:02 PM   #85
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Quote:
I have not watched FotR in a long time, so I'm a bit rusty on what exactly is going on after this
This site, has a good run down of what's going when on the soundtracks.

Quote:
However, it doesn't seem to be in the track itself. Maybe it's just in the movie?
It's only in the EE, thus not on the soundtrack, and it plays while he's defending Merry and Pippin.

I'm very behind, but I'll try to catch up to these three tracks either tonight or tommorow....

Edit:
Quote:
Does this piece fit your thoughts of what Elvish music would sound like? If not, what would you do differently? How does this (either the contents of the track or your own ideas) fit in with Lorien's history and people?
1. Not really, my ideas for Elvish music prior to watching these films wasn't very in depth beyond "Tra la lally, down in the valley..."

Not sure I'd change anything, the otherworldy Middle-Eastern effect worked well in the film.

The Great River:
Quote:
Et Ešrello Endorenna utķlien.
Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!

Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come.
In this place I will abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world!
I hadn't noticed that before, it's remarkable how much depth the use of Tolkien's language adds to score, it's something the Bashki cartoon didn't have.

The epic rendition of the 'Ring theme' as they pass the Argonath is one of highlights of the album, in large part because it's the only full statement of the theme on the CD.

Amon Hen:
Together with The Breaking of The Fellowship this one the better musical endings to a film I've ever see_er, heard.

The Seduction theme playing as Aragorn (not Boromir) is tempted by the Ring gives an eerie start to the proccedings.

Then, the brass, which I believe you've correctly connected to Minas Tirith, as Aragorn faces down the Uruk-hai, this minute and a half is some of the best action writing I've ever heard.

The Isengard theme as heard here is frightening, menacing, as Boromir, Merry and Pippin are set upon by the orcs.

The track finishes with a mournful rendtion of the 'Fellowship' theme as Boromir dies, how long ago Moria and that full, triumphiant statement of it seem now...

Missing on the CD are the fantastic additions to the EE; namely: the 'Nature/Moth' theme as Merry and Pippin create a diversion to allow Frodo to escape, and the new choral pieces as Boromir defends the two young Hobbits.



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Old 03-26-2005, 10:29 PM   #86
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Thanks for the link!

Quote:
The Seduction theme playing as Aragorn (not Boromir) is tempted by the Ring gives an eerie start to the proccedings.
Ah, yes, seduction. That was the term I was looking for and just couldn't come up with while writing my last post. Quite an appropriate title for it, too.
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Old 03-27-2005, 01:14 PM   #87
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The Seduction theme is very key in the movies (and in the book) because almost all the characters are seduced by the ring. Even Sam is almost seduced by it. As the dutch title of LOTR says they are Bound by the ring It is one of my favourite theme songs because it doesn't only sound seductive, its also melancholy due to all the evil influences the ring brings with it. It certainly fits with Boromr because he ends up loosing his life in the quest of getting the ring to Mordor. Overall I really like this track due to its contrast between the quiet of the rings power, and Boromir's death compared to the loudness of battle. This is usually split in strings with choir for the quiet parts (and a solo for lowbrass) to Full blown brass for the battles. However, I really like it that Howard Shore decided not to go along this path completely but to turn down the volume of the music halfway through the fight.
Encaitare thanks once again for the lyrics, I didn't know their meaning yet so its great to finally see what they are actually singing.
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Old 04-01-2005, 02:49 PM   #88
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Track 17: the Breaking of the Fellowship

This track is just so beautiful and sad... I love it.

So we start out with strings on a pedal tone under very "round"-sounding brass; the two then merge to a melancholy variation on the Shire theme -- Frodo, while with quite a ways to go, is not the hobbit he was when he first left home. As Sam comes after Frodo, the strings drift along even as he does under the water.

At 1:44, Frodo pulls Sam out, and the theme becomes more hopeful -- especially as the original whistle that we heard in Track 2 returns, although it's much sadder. It shows us that while there will be suffering, at least Sam and Frodo will be together.

Cut to Boromir's boat and those who will be the Three Hunters. There is a snippet of the Shire theme again which then changes to the Fellowship theme. The theme is no longer full; several instruments seem to be missing, as their group is broken.

Percussion grows and then fades in the background as the Shire theme and eventually the whistle return. After this solo, the percussion returns muted under strings. Edward Ross' vocal solo follows, accompanied at times by a boys' choir. It brings in the phrase "there and back again," implying that while hardship will ensue, all is not lost. There is still hope. Strings and brass do a short conclusion of this solo, which leads nicely into the next track... but that's for next week.

Do share your thoughts.
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Old 04-01-2005, 04:27 PM   #89
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Gosh, is it Friday already?

The emotional highlight of the score, don't how much there is to say.....love the tom-toms(?) near the end.


I love In Dreams, it's, as Shore has called it, "The Hobbit Hymn"; I greatly prefer it to what to comes next and wish it came at the begining of the credits in the movie.




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Old 04-01-2005, 09:02 PM   #90
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This track announces the end of a wonderful hour of music.I also really like "In dreams" but what annoys me is that sometimes the choir says in dream and doesn't pronounce the s. I know its silly but ever since my music teacher got mad at us for not pronouncing words correctly when singing I have a habit of listening for it when I listen to other singers.
The repeat of the hobbit theme makes me think about the beginning of the story and how far they have come. I also take note of the changing moods that have occured during this soundtrack. In the end the soundtrack has noticably become darker which sets the tone for the soundtrack of TTT.
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Old 04-08-2005, 09:11 PM   #91
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Silmaril Track 18: May it Be

Happy Friday, everyone! TGIF to the max.

We have come to the final track of FotR; this consists of Enya's song followed by an instrumental finale. Lyrics:

Quote:
May it be an evening star
Shines down upon you
May it be when darkness falls
Your heart will be true
You walk a lonely road
Oh, how far you are from home

MorniŽ utķliŽ
Believe and you will find your way
MorniŽ alantiŽ
A promise lives within you now

May it be the shadow's call
Will fly away
May it be you journey on
To light the day
When the night is overcome
You may rise to find the sun

MorniŽ utķliŽ
Believe and you will find your way

MorniŽ alantiŽ
A promise lives within you now

A promise lives within you now
"May it Be" itself sounds much like Enya's other songs -- in my opinion, this is not a bad thing. It does have the gentle string and vocal accompaniment that she uses often in her songs. Parts of the melodic line are similar to the Shire theme.

I like the use of "MorniŽ utķliŽ / MorniŽ alantiŽ" (Darkness has come / Darkness has fallen) -- I think these were the first Elvish phrases I ever learned. The point that there are indeed dark forces at hand is addressed, but other parts of the lyrics, such as "believe and you will find your way," have a message of hope and encouragement. The lyrics as a whole remind me of the Irish blessing:

Quote:
May the road rise to meet you.
May the wind be always at your back.
May the sun shine warm upon your face.
And rains fall soft upon your fields.
And until we meet again, May God hold you in the hollow of His hand.
And note that all the "blessings" given in "May it Be" will eventually come true -- a star will even shine down upon Sam in Mordor.

When the song is over, we hear the Shire and Fellowship themes, first soft and then rising in triumph. While this part of the story ends on a sad note (Boromir's death, the breaking of the Fellowship), it's still evident that there is strength left in the sundered friends.

Since the bulk of this track is taken up by the song, let's talk about that, shall we? How do the lyrics apply to the situations at hand? And to which character(s) do you think the lyrics are directed?
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Old 04-09-2005, 08:51 PM   #92
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I actually have a fond memory of this song. At my highschool we have a Grande Ball. This is the time when the grade twelves wear their grad dresses again.Also the band students provide all the music. So me and my friend got together and I sang "May it be" while my friend provided the piano part.

Appart from that I like this song because it is very like Enya but it also fits the mood of the overall soundtrack. Its neat that they let the previous track,"The Breaking of the fellowship" smoothly flow over into May it Be. I think it might actually be my favourite credit swong out of the three. (Gollum's song,Into the West)
But they have one thing alike,great lyrics. I think the lyrics for every song are excelent.

The lyrics of May it Be clearly bring a message of hope. To me it says that although you will go through some very dark times and there are many dangers ahead,you will make it Frodo Baggins.And when you have made it good wil return.
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Old 04-15-2005, 09:46 PM   #93
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The Two Towers! Track 1: Foundations of Stone

Hey, congrats, guys! We made it to TTT! Still interested?

Right. Track One. The opening brass is like a "welcome back". I envision a thick book, leather-bound and inviting with yellowed pages, being opened to its second chapter. And we, the eager readers, fall back once more into the tale. We are immediately reminded of what's going on by the strings' repetition of the Ring theme. (In the movie, I absolutely love the camera panning over the mountains. Awesome shots there.)

The violins continue; the sound is sad and nothing ever seems to resolve completely. At 1:42, we are whisked back to the Bridge of Khazad-Dum. We hear the brassy battle carry out, and the segment has the same conclusion at 2:30 as it did back in track 13 of FotR -- that low string tone. But since here we see things continue from Gandalf's point of view, the music picks up almost immediately with the choir. At 2:32 we hear:

Quote:
[Quenya]
Mettanna.
Nurunna!


To the end
To the death!
Chanting in Khuzdul begins as the foes descend ever deeper into the former Dwarven realm. Starting at 2:44:

Quote:
Irkat-lukhud ma
katabrikihu
Ulfat-atam ma
tanakhi uduhu
bin-n‚t azn‚n tarsisi

No shaft of light
Can breach it
No breath of air
Comes from it
Only an endless dark rises
Here, it would seem that the trumpets/brass are Gandalf (as we have heard in past tracks), the throbbing drums are the Balrog ("drums, drums in the deep"), and the ongoing chanting simply represents the setting.

At 3:32, the drums cease for a few moments as Gandalf and the Balrog fall over the surface of the water. I particularly like this section -- it sounds almost more epic than what we're previously been hearing. In fact, it reminds me of some of the victorious music we'll hear in RotK, not surprisingly: since they are about to hit the water, it can't bode too well for the Balrog. At this point we hear:

Quote:
[Quenya]
Mettanna
NŠrendur
An mauya mahtie
Mettanna

To the end
Servant of fire
For you must fight
To the end
Thusly the track ends, and for a little while we are kept in the dark as to exactly what will happen.

Only portions of the written lyrics were used in the actual track. Full Quenya lyrics are here and full Khuzdul lyrics are here.

My apologies for posting this so late (it's almost midnight for me, anyway) -- my internet randomly shut down on me this afternoon.
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Old 04-18-2005, 04:35 PM   #94
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I remember watching TTT for the first time and getting goosebumps because of the beautiful combination of image and music.

In the soundtrack for FOTR we actually don't hear the ring theme but on this soundtrack we do. I was really glad when I heard the theme on the TTT soundtrack because it is central to the story and the melody is so haunting.

Anyway, I'm too tired to think of more since I have a jetlag. I will expand on this post later.
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Old 04-22-2005, 02:38 PM   #95
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Track 2: The Taming of Smeagol

Before I begin, I have a question for all readers/participants thus far: is anyone still interested? It seems that Lathriel, ttbk (sometimes) and myself have been the only ones posting as of late, and I'd like to know if anyone else is following the thread. I'd certainly like to continue, but if no one is going to respond, then I don't know if it's worth it to post.

So anyway, track 2. It starts off with the Shire theme on clarinet, but the strings and choir add a darker tone -- the familiar characters are coming to a place that is completely new.

The second section, in which Gollum is climbing down the wall, does indeed have a sound like creeping footsteps. The harsh brass and strings follow as Frodo and Sam fight off Gollum. The track ends with the same footstep-like tones, on brass and vibraphone, I believe.

Apologies that this is so short -- it's not a very eventful track.
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Old 04-22-2005, 03:25 PM   #96
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Come on peoples!!! Join the discussion. Talk about anything form how this track makes you feel,to any memories that are connected to it or how you feel certain themes relate to the book or movies.

I have to agree with you Encaitare, this track isn't very exciting although it is neat how the vibraphone (or is it dulcimer) is chosen to represent Gollum. I have the LOTR symphony by Johan de Meij where Gollum is portrayed by a saxophone(I don't know which kind but its smaller then an alto sax)I like the dulcimer better because it is much more subtle and it really portrays his ability to be quiet when he has to be,plus his tendency to sneak from here to there.
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Old 04-22-2005, 03:33 PM   #97
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I'm still interested I just really haven't had much to say or I just haven't had the time to say anything. And ending on that note I still have nothing to say, but I do have stuff for the next track from TTT.
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Old 04-22-2005, 04:22 PM   #98
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Sorry I haven't been around, school has been keeping me insanely busy lately.





ttbk
Edit: In passing, an observation about The Prophecy, since I wasn't here for that discussion: This is really reminescent of a Biblical epic from the fifties and sixties, like The Robe (just scroll down and listen to the first sample). I thought that was kinda neat.

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Old 04-23-2005, 01:26 AM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Encaitare
I have a question for all readers/participants thus far: is anyone still interested?
Since you're asking readers, not just participants, yes! I don't have the time to participate actively in this discussion, but I do enjoy reading it. So please do carry on!
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Old 04-24-2005, 12:59 AM   #100
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Shield Catching Up

I'm certainly still interested.

Some miscellaneous comments:

1. The Breaking of the Fellowship is lovely, but I sometimes feel slightly too remniscent of Titanic. Sort of standard cinematic emotional tune number 16. But I only get that feeling when I'm struck with cynicism...

2. I'm not that fond of "In Dreams", but the choir is omitting the s on purpose, so the soloist alone sings it. This is a means of making sure the s will be synchronised, and will start and finish at the right time. My objection is that there's something a bit blocked up about the soloist's voice, as if he has a slight cold...

3. I love "May It Be". In fact, I find myself singing it under my breath in unguarded moments...

4. The Two Towers, for me, is a motivational CD. I play it when I'm stirring myself to write. The Foundations of Stone are a nice menacing introduction, though they don't quite match either The Prophecy or A Storm is Coming.

5. I never really rate the Taming of Smeagol, or the later Passage of the Marshes. Unlike some of the Rohan tracks, they rely strongly on knowing and seeing what's going on, and aren't much good at conjuring images in their own right.

6. I cannot wait to rhapsodise on how much I love the Rohan theme!
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Old 04-24-2005, 11:42 AM   #101
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This is one my fave threads!

Somehow it is much easier for me to listen to TTT's soundtrack than FotR's. I guess the score isn't as gloomy as in FotR and it's more "melodic".
The Shire theme gives me immediately a calm feeling: everything's going to be fine though in the movie Frodo and Sam have just started their lonely and almost hopeless journey to Mordor.
Otherwise I think this is the lamest track in TTT. The song's latter half's dissonant chords are really unpleasant to listen to. And as Encaitare said, it doesn't really happen very much in this piece.
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Old 04-24-2005, 01:48 PM   #102
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What I like about the FotR soundtrack are the location themes.

What I like about the RotK soundtrack is the encompassment of every emotion I have ever felt.

What I like about the TT soundtrack is the fact that it blends the two perfectly. We will later hear the Rohan theme (which, like ungoliant, I love to no end) and when the Rohirrim arrive at Helm's Deep, it's a wonderfully majestic version of the theme.

Just my random thoughts.
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Old 04-25-2005, 11:02 AM   #103
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I don't really like May It Be....the coda with the Fellowship theme is nice though.


Foundations Of Stone, ahh, I love the way the music starts before the visuals do, and on further viewings it's like you already that you're zooming over mountains.

A reprise of the Gandalf v. Balrog music, but this time instead of etheral ooohs it goes to battle music! Booming brass, and violent choir as Angel and Demon wrestle within the depths of the earth! I love it!

And then the beautiful moment when the orchestra gives way and the choir is alone in the cavern with the lake and the falling star....


The Taming Of Smeagol, after a brief statement of the Shire theme to re-orient us after the fury of the last track we get a choral piece that isn't in the film, a nice melody that turns menacing (?with hints of Gollum's theme from Fellowship underneath the end?), some suspense music as Gollum's second theme plays as he stalks down the cliff. Then a rapid, dissonant piece as he attacks the Hobbits, then quiets again as they resume their trek to Mordor...

One interesting thing about the album is that, unlike FOTR, it's not in chronological order beyond these first two tracks. Shore used a lot of 'mini-suites' for TTT and ROTK.




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Old 04-29-2005, 03:18 PM   #104
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Since Encairtare will be back late tonight I have the honour of introducing the next track.

Track #3 The Riders of Rohan

It begins fast but then the melody slows down to make way for the Rohan theme. In this track the Rohan theme is first played by the brass,then the violins and lastly by the Hardinger. The Hardinger is a scandinavian fiddle and it has extra strings that vibrate to give the fiddle's unique sound.

The Rohan theme is central to the second movie and it also happens to be my mom's favourite theme of all the soundtracks. The theme certainly fits the moment in the movie and it gives you a feeling of being swept into ME if you aren't there already.

I myself really like the fact that a folk instrument is used for the theme instead of a more common instrument.

So how do you feel about this track? Is the Rohan theme your favourite?
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Old 04-29-2005, 03:55 PM   #105
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The theme for the Rohirrim might just be my favorite theme from the movies as well. The success of the theme at evoking the character of the Rohirrim continues to astonish me. In particular, something about the tone color of the hardinger instantly conjures up visions of the riders sweeping across the plains, at least for me. Part of what's so striking is, I think, the juxtaposition of the more rustic, perhaps more soloistic, tone color of the hardinger and the more familiar orchestra. My favorite moment is when the hardinger comes to the point where the brass ended the phrase, but instead of ending it leaps up over some climactic orchestral chords.
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Old 04-29-2005, 07:14 PM   #106
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I too like the hardinger. It seemed to me that the sound is depressed state of Rohan in instrumental form.
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Old 04-29-2005, 09:05 PM   #107
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I like the feeling of danger we have at the beginning of the track, since the Rohirrim first seem like they might be hostile towards our heroes.

All the music associated with Rohan is very beautiful, not just the theme played by the hardinger. The string theme at 1:42 is musically similar, and yet provides different images for me. This gentler theme seems to represent the practical side of Rohan, a place with strength that is being held under the surface. The theme the hardinger plays encompasses many other aspects of the society: majesty, beauty, honor. The melody does not sound happy, but it does sound driven and inspired.

The end bit of the track, if I'm not mistaken, is when Theoden has Grima thrown out of Meduseld. A bit jumpy, really. Grima doesn't really have enough of a part -- or even enough of a definite affiliation with anyone -- to have a full theme. The closest thing I can think of is the low brass like we hear in the Isengard theme.
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Old 04-30-2005, 12:55 PM   #108
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Shield The Rohan Theme!

I play this, and several other Rohan tracks, when writing battle scenes...

This is the first track, perhaps, which causes images to swell before the eye; I can see Eomer's eored speeding by; Eowyn in her white dress; the flag of the White Horse on the wind.

My only regret is that it feels too short and leads on to a piece of music I found as uninspiring as the scene it went with. All that unsubtle business with the corpse...

But that is later, and for the moment we are in Edoras, shorn of its glory but not of its romance. I love the point at about 2:24 when we are transported into the cramped, sorrowful, mourning of the golden hall; and the fiddle comes into its own here. But there's a beauty amid the tears; a feeling that hope is on the horizon. At about 3:36 the track feels like it's come to a slightly menacing end, but trickles on in a minor way, ever so slightly claustrophobic, smothering the chance of redemption we saw before.

Incidentally, I shuddered when Bernard Hill and others seemed to think that the Rohirrim were Celts. Was this a PJesque decision? The white horse motif and Norwegian fiddle would seem to hint otherwise.
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Old 05-04-2005, 01:41 PM   #109
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I'll respond to the track tonight (hopefully!), but right now I thought y'all might want to hear the latest on the complete score box-set:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Adams
>>>Why is it so hard to release a complete score for this movie? It's not like they have to hurdle through loads of legality.>>>

Well, that depends on who is releasing it, does it not? Remember that during the whole process there was a major shake up at Warner Brothers Records, and that the division that was responsible for the three original soundtrack CDs (Reprise) essentially ceased to exist. Many executives lost their jobs or resigned, and a lot of the key people who had been pushing this material through were no longer on the map. This doesnít mean that the LOTR project was ever abandoned, or even in trouble, but it did take time to find someone to champion it once again. Despite the fact that the project seems like a no-brainer success just waiting to happen, you still need to find someone thatís got space on his plate to shepherd it through. It is a huge, huge project, and more than slightly high profile.

>>>Yeah I know they want alternate cues, unused materials, ect.... but they all already exist. >>>

Unfortunately thatís not right. Not everything was mixed. Sure film mixes existed for almost everything, but not album mixes. And since the previously released music will now exist in a different context, a good portion of that will need to be remixed as well. Including the bonus material, you could easily be dealing with 12 to 13 hours of music that need mixing. Thatís a huge job Ė and youíve got to pay someone to do it. And that means you need to get a large budget approved very early. So assuming you have the producer with the time and energy, the mixer with the expertise and the willingness, you still need to push everything though a big company. Again, thatís not at all a bad thing, itís just how things work. But it still takes time.

>>>2. They might be waiting to tie it into some other product (Like a book: Music of the Lord of the Rings)>>>

Oh sure, blame me! Really though, my timeline is entirely dictated by the record companyís decisions. Thereís no way on earth theyíre going to hold this project up because some Chicago area guy decided he wanted to walk the beach while contemplating the best way to describe the Shire Theme. They say jump, I say, where should I land?

>>>3. They may have wanted to wait until the LOTR fans were ready to absorb an expensive set.>>>

This is a very good point. No matter how you slice it, thereís going to be a certain price tag attached to this project. So how best to release it? Do you strike while the iron is hot, and get it out right after the last movie? Thatís a time problem and perhaps unlikely to recoup the studioís budget Ė everyone just got finished buying the one-disc soundtrack, thatís a pretty egregious double-dip. Do you put it out right after the last DVD? Thatís an expense problem. If your average LOTR fan just spent $60 on the extended ROTK DVD, will he turn around and drop another $150 on CDs? At Christmastime? Do you cut it down then? Just put out a new mix and a handful of unreleased tracks? Maybe cut everything from the extended editions? The fans would be out for blood, and really no one involved wants to put out a compromised version of this.

>>>4. It could be: production problems, legal problems, art problems, permission problems>>>

Well the good news there arenít any ďproblems,Ē there are just decisions that need to be made. Think of it this way, the more material involved, the more people involved. The more people involved, the more time-intensive the decision making process will be.

Fortunately, Iím happy to say most of these decisions have been made now. In fact, the last I heard, things are pretty well set at this point. Why no announcement yet? Well, youíve got to realize that advertising is part of the decision making process as well. These things tend to be announced when theyíre going to be most effective at capturing attention, but without being crass. As I say, Iím hoping to be able to report something in a month or so, but Iím giving that timeline because thatís the next time Iím planning to be in NY at the office, so Iíll ask then if itís ok to say something.

Oh and as for the FSM quoteÖ Iím a huge fan of Mr. Bettencourt, but I have to respectfully contradict him by saying that his quote is inaccurate in at least two ways and accurate in at least one wonderful way.

Ok, my vagueness is even annoying ME now. Sorry, guys!


Also, I've been going through the DVDs to see how much music is missing and I could post a track list for disc one if anyone is interested.




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Old 05-04-2005, 01:48 PM   #110
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ttbk-- Thanks for posting that! Sounds like it will be great whenever it comes out. Although when I saw "Doug Adams" I immediately thought of the late great writer...

Quote:
I could post a track list for disc one if anyone is interested
What do you mean? A lsit of corresponding tracks of music in the DVDs?
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Old 05-04-2005, 04:39 PM   #111
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Quote:
What do you mean? A lsit of corresponding tracks of music in the DVDs?
Yeah, basically; it's my guess at a track list for the first CD of the box-set....


The Riders Of Rohan:
This track has three pieces of music, the first is the pounding, rhythmic bit as Eomer and co. surrond the Three Hunters.

This reminds me of something out of The Magnifcent Seven (which I was listening to today), something about the driving rhythms...I like it, especially the way it ends by seemingly circling itself around the Hunters same as Eomer does then suddenly halts.

The second, and shortest, underscores Gandalf riding from Edoras, the main thing of note is the "White Rider" theme making it's first appearance on the album.

The third, is simply splendid, the lead in with Eowyn's theme on strings, and the build-up to the fiddle solo of the Rohan theme, I find this piece quite moving.





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Old 05-04-2005, 07:32 PM   #112
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Shield Riders of Rohan

For some reason the very beginning of this reminds me of horses galloping. I think it has to do with the percussion in the opening bars. Very suspenseful music, like music played during a hunting scene.

Then the French horns and trumpets (I believe it's trumpets and horns...) come in with the Rohan theme and then the strings and finally the Hardinger. It's a very pretty and calming theme. One of my favorites on the TTT soundtrack.
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Old 05-05-2005, 08:40 PM   #113
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Quote:
Yeah, basically; it's my guess at a track list for the first CD of the box-set....
Go for it.
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Old 05-06-2005, 11:10 AM   #114
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Proposed (by me) tracklist for disc one:
#1: "Prologue" (7:10)**
#2: "The Shire, Middle Earth"(:58)
#3: "Concerning Hobbits"(1:31)
#4: "The Road Goes Ever On...."(:39)
#5: "A Wizard is Never Late"(4:05)**
#6: "Very Old Friends"(1:39)
#7: "A Night To Remember"(1:26)
#8 "Party#1"(:45)
#9 "Party#2"(:57)
#10: "The Sackville-Bagginses!"(1:43)
#11: "Goodbye"(1:00)
#12: "It's In My Pocket"(1:43)
#13: "The End of My Book"(1:09)
#14: "Riddles in The Dark"(1:18)
#15: "Neither Secret, or Safe..."(3:14)**
#16: "The Green Dragon" (:20)
#17: "Rosie" (:17)
#18: "It Is The One Ring" (1:48)
#19: "Bilbo Found It" (:23)
#20: "Sauron endured" (:44)
#21: "Remarkable Hobbits" (3:53)**
#22 "The Journey Begins" (1:47)**
#23: "Wood Elves" (:49)
#24: "To Isengard!" (:40)**
#25: "Reason Exchanged for Madness" (2:27)**
#26: "The Treason of Isengard" (:55)**
#27: "Shortcut To Mushrooms" (:49)**
#28: "Brandybucks and Tooks" (:14)
#29: "Get off the road!" (:13)*
#30: "The Black Rider" (2:36)**
#31: "At The Sign of The Prancing Pony" (:27)**
#32: "No Gandalf" (:21)
#33 "Strider" (:38)**
#34 "Frodo Baggins" (:23)
#35 "Nazgul In The Night" (1:12)**
#36 "Journey To Rivendell" (2:07)
#37: "Second Breakfast" (1:08)
#38: "Desecration of Isengard" (:39)
#39: "A Knife In The Dark" (1:40)**
#40: "Even the Smallest Creature..." (4:02)**
#41: "Weed" (:48)
#42: "AATF" (5:23)**
#43: "Short Cuts Make For Long Delays" (1:01)
#44: "Many Meetings" (3:18)**
#45: "Aniron" (2:02)*
#46: "Men? Bah!" (2:23)
#47: "Broken Heirloom" (1:06)
#48: "Isildur's Bane" (1:12)
#49: "Gondor Needs The Ring, Not A King" (2:08)
#50: "The Fellowship is Formed" (3:10)**

79:41 of music, 35:07 released
*=released, **=partially unreleased
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
My estimated times aren't perfect, obviously, but I'm pretty sure they're close enough that this will all fit onto one CD.

The major unreleased music:

"Prologue": Unreleased except for the part in Gollum's cave

The Fellowship theme playing over the title card

A lot of the Shire and Hobbit themes leading up to the party

Tons of the Ring theme, which is almost non-existent on the album

The Passing of the Elves

"Journey To Rivendell" which develops the Fellowship theme a bit

And then quite a bit from after they arrive at Rivendell, especially the use of the Gondor theme at the council.





ttbk

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Old 05-06-2005, 09:26 PM   #115
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Looks like you got it all figured out!
If that big CD set comes out I am definitly going to buy it. The rest of my family rolls their eyes but I don't care. There are so many little pieces of music that I hear while watching the movies that aren't on the soundtrack. Plus it would be nice if they added some of Merry and Pippin's songs.
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Old 05-07-2005, 01:32 PM   #116
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Track 4: the Passage of the Marshes

Whoops! With my AP test yesterday I completely forgot to post. Shan't happen again (if I can help it).

Low brass and timid strings set the scene for the atmosphere of the Marshes. They provide an extremely eerie feel. When the music gets more forceful around 1:04, there are voices added, although I can't find any lyrics or translation.

The voices around 1:20 make me shiver.

Afterwards, things calm down a bit as the continue through the Marshes. At 1:53 and continuing, there is a variation of the Ring theme. Then at 2:26, we hear those creeping footfall noises previously attributed to Gollum. I'm not sure what instrument that is -- I originally thought it was a xylophone of some sort, although it now sounds to me like a plucked string being played very quickly. Any ideas?
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Old 05-07-2005, 05:05 PM   #117
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Sometimes I skip this track cause it scares me. In general music has a big affect on me and if music is somewhat eerie it can really scare me. (Like Shelob's lair in ROTK)
Every time I hear the track I can see the ghosts (from the movie)that try to reach out to Frodo and that freaks me out.
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Old 05-12-2005, 07:03 AM   #118
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Quote:
we hear those creeping footfall noises previously attributed to Gollum. I'm not sure what instrument that is -- I originally thought it was a xylophone of some sort, although it now sounds to me like a plucked string being played very quickly. Any ideas?
I believe it's a hammered dulcimer, If I remember correctly from the documentary with TTT:EE.

Like Alice, I seem to have fallen down the rabbit hole and become very late...


Not really much to say about this one I think, very effective horror music (especially the voices! *shudder*), sort of a return to their roots for both Shore and Jackson.

Then it plays out with Gollum leading them on.

One thing, this track seems to start exactly where the previous one left off musically.





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Old 05-12-2005, 03:00 PM   #119
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Track 5: the Uruk-hai

I'm posting this a day early because tomorrow I am departing with the school band for a trip to Disney World(!) until Monday. We've got to meet up at 3:30 AM ( ) in order to catch an early flight, so there's no sensible way for me to post tomorrow.

So track 5 begins with the Fellowship theme once more, sounding subdued at first and then very triumphant as the Three Hunters track the Uruk-hai in search of Merry and Pippin.

An oboe plays the theme as well -- it seems like a hobbity sort of sound, and for me it ties in the fact that the loyalty and friendship within the broken Fellowship is the motivation behind this hunt.

Around 1:30, the Rohan theme kicks in, but it is quickly dominated by low brass. The hammering rhythm in the background reminds me of Isengard, which has hold over Rohan, but then this too is overwhelmed by the theme of Mordor, which in turn has hold over Isengard. At 1:24, the Isengard theme returns.

I'm looking forward to next week -- more Rohan theme goodness!
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Old 05-13-2005, 07:05 AM   #120
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Shield I love this...as usual...

...this track summons to the mind one of the most iconic moments of the film (and book), when the Three Hunters are running across the plains. I remember being excited beyond words when I heard it. 28 seconds in the Fellowship theme (I think? Duh-duh, duhh, duh-duh-duuhh) cuts in, swelling the heart and making me want to jump off my chair. We then hear only a few notes of Rohan before the Forces of Evil take over. The dichotomy, the struggle, the epic of the story, is perfectly encapsulated. But the moment at 00:28 is still the peak, certainly of the track, possibly of the film...it has what Tolkien called eucatastrophe. It seems to me a far more potent expression of this than the badly mishandled arrival of Aragorn at the Pelennor Fields in the film of ROTK.
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