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10-04-2010, 10:39 AM | #1 |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14
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How big was Ancalagon?
From the Silm: "Before the rising of the sun Earendil slew Ancalagon the Black, the mightiest of the dragon-host, and cast him from the sky; and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin."
But Thangorodrim was the highest mountains in Middle-earth. So how big was Ancalagon, that his crashing to earth would break whole mountains??? Merely Godzilla-sized wouldn't cut it. He must have been like a mile long at least; and it's hard to imagine what Earendil even did to fight something that size... |
10-06-2010, 10:25 AM | #2 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Muddy-earth
Posts: 1,307
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I'm not too sure how to interpret mighty in this case. Might doesn't always come in size, being bigger doesn't always mean stronger or better. Ancalagon may have been heavier, more armoured or more intelligent than the other dragons. His fiery or icy blast (if he had one) could have been more potent, of course these things we don't know, along with his size (in which you may be right). What we do know is that he fell from the sky, we don't know how far he fell, weight gains power the faster it moves. The thing that is always overlooked when discussing Earendil, is The Silmaril and Vingilot. This normal ship was hallowed by the Valar, it was filled with a wavering flame , pure and bright, on it sat Earendil with the Light of The Two Trees combined blazing from the Silmaril, nothing Black and Evil could stand up to that for long.
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10-06-2010, 11:18 AM | #3 |
Curmudgeonly Wordwraith
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It could be the "towers of Thangorodrim" refer to outlooks or bastions of Angband, the great fortress which lay within Thangorodrim. It is entirely within reason that towers would have been built by Morgoth after the great Eagles moved their abode to the Crissaegrim, as there are references to ''terraces" on Thangorodrim in relation to Morgoth's fortress as well.
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10-06-2010, 11:37 AM | #4 | |||
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14
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The towers as buildings: possible. But elsewhere 'the towers of Thangorodrim' clearly means the mountain peaks: Morgoth raised them as slag-heaps, etc.
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What I meant about the size was the breaking of (possibly Everest-size) mountains. Quote:
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Also, the Eagles of Manwe were in the battle too, and Thorondor was pretty gigantic himself ('thirty fathoms' - 180 feet across his wings). Last edited by Vultur; 10-06-2010 at 11:44 AM. |
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10-06-2010, 02:12 PM | #5 | |
shadow of a doubt
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Back on the streets
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Anyway, I don't think you can take the depiction of the War of Wrath too literally. It's highly mythological in it's outline, and also, from an outside perspective, a much older text, and should be read differently to more detailed and realistic first age stories like Coh.
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10-06-2010, 02:21 PM | #6 |
Blithe Spirit
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,876
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I know its a bit blasphemous but think of Merlin - of the Dragon crashing down on Camelot and breaking the towers. It would happen. I agree with Morthoron, that the "towers" were constructions of Morgoth, not of nature.
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10-08-2010, 01:54 AM | #7 | |||
Wisest of the Noldor
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As has been said already, though, the account in the War of Wrath should perhaps not be taken too literally.
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10-07-2010, 02:28 PM | #8 | |
Haunting Spirit
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: On the road, again...
Posts: 73
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You really wouldn't ask where is the gate to underworld that Orfeus used in serch for Euridika. As well as doubting Arthur's foretold return when England is in gravest peril will get you nowhere. And by the way, where did Agamemnon assemble fleet of thousand warships? I this manner I could ask how is it possible for Volcano (meaning Mount Doom) to erupt with such violence, after engulfing a piece of gold. There weren't any preliminary eruption before, or any earthshaking. And then in matter of seconds it all burst out. I'm not any volcanologist, but reality is different, prove me wrong. My point is, that Ancalagon was pretty damn big. I wouldn't try to measure him. I see him just as manifestation of terror that Morgoth unleashed, malice that even Ainur were shocked to witness. Ancalagon is more an idea, presence, as well as Earendil, aka "Star of Hope". I'd see Ancalagons fight with Earendil as symbol, Hope defeating Malevolence, that even the mightiest of the mighty (Valar) could not match.
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10-07-2010, 11:54 PM | #9 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
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I believe it's 'philologist', my good fellow
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10-07-2010, 02:48 AM | #10 |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: The Shire (Staffordshire), United Kingdom
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[QUOTE=Vultur;640325]and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin."QUOTE]
This could be a piece of hyperbole, a completely over-the-top exageration of Ancalagon's fall, to point out just how great it was. Hyperbole was much used in the ancient literature that Tolkien loved. Or it could be a metaphor, showing that Ancalagon's death was the turning point of the war that led to the complete destruction of Morgoth's empire, including the towers of Thangorodrim. . |
10-07-2010, 08:55 AM | #11 |
Pile O'Bones
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14
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