The beginning of TTT - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Orodhromeus · 04-13-2002, 10:59 AM

I've been thinking of what will the beginning of the next movie will look like. I mean what precise scenes will be shown? We know more or less what will be in it, but how would you like to see it beginning? It may sound trivial, but I can't get it off my mind!I imagine it beginning with Gandalf at the top of shiny snowy mountains. Then a large being passes in front of the sun. The viewer recognizes Gwaihir. Next scene, Caras Galadhon. Gandalf talks with Galadriel. Here, the general situation is reminded by Celeborn & Galadriel to those who saw FotR long ago or those who didn't see it at all. Galadriel tells Gandalf her predictions for each member of the remaining Fellowship (including that Frodo-will-die-thing). End of intro. The logo shows up. Darkness. Merry & Pippin wake up as they are let off by the orcs and hit the ground. They understand there's an argument going on between them. The Orcs talk in the Common Tongue. Killings, Pippin cuts his ropes. They go on. Pippin cuts his Lórien coat and leaves a piece on the ground. Cut to the Three Walkers. They eventually find the piece of coat. As they see 106 riders approaching, cut to the rough landscape of Emyn Muil.What do you think of it? Do you see it otherwise?[ April 13, 2002: Message edited by: Orodhromeus ]

Lhunbelethiel · 04-13-2002, 11:24 AM

I wonder if they'll do a recap of FOTR to catch people up? (like at the beginning of FOTR when they gave the backstory)I think they might start with the death and river burial of Boromir, maybe....?

ElanorGamgee · 04-13-2002, 11:46 AM

I kind of hope they start with Pippin and Merry in the Orc camp. Maybe one of them could have a dream that kind of sums up the situation at the end of FotR.

04-13-2002, 12:05 PM

I think that they might start the film with Faramir or the people of Gondor finding the broken horn and seeing Boromir go past

Kuruharan · 04-13-2002, 01:57 PM

Sad to say, but I don't think there will be much about Merry and Pippin with the orcs. Why should there be? They are all Saruman's uruks. No orcs of Mordor or the Misty Mountains. There'd be no argument about where they are going, no intertribal bickering, in other words, no fun! It would just be Merry and Pippin being dragged along by the orcs. After a while that would get really boring.Worst of all NO UGLUK!!! One of my favorite characters probably ends up on the cutting room floor! (Or just cut out of the script entirely for all I know.) Good grief! What's a Uruk gotta do to get some screen time here?!!

Tigerlily Gamgee · 04-13-2002, 02:18 PM

It's hard to say where it may start. I doubt that it will start with an introduction to the heeps of new characters. It is possible that it will start with a recap. But, it could also start with the Fellowship, Gandalf, Merry and Pippin, Sam and Frodo. I just don't know! I am really excited to find out. Well, only about 8 months to go

Araen · 04-13-2002, 03:05 PM

If they start with anything taht involves Boromir's death it will be a rather upsetting note and it could put a damper on the hwole film. That is how it normally is with really sad stuff at the begining.

Marileangorifurnimaluim · 04-13-2002, 09:15 PM

I like your version Orod. I think I'd make one change, and that is instead of moving to Merry and Pippin first, I'd have Frodo and Sam early. We want to keep the focus on the Ring and Frodo, since that's the central theme, especially for those who didn't see the first movie. It's a natural lead-in from Galadriel saying "the quest with claim his life." Switch to Frodo and Sam highlighted against the sharp peaks of Emyn Muil, the thunderous glow of Mordor in the distance, looking dirty and tired. Frodo: "We're lost." Sits with a *sigh*. Sam: "What a pickle. There's the one place in the world I've never wanted to go, that's exactly where I'm trying to get to. And we can't get there, nohow."Orod, you have a good sense for this. Where do you think we should cut to Pippin and Sam? Before the meeting with Gollum? How would you work in the history of Gollum, which we know will be shown?Absolutely there will be the chase of the orc band and Merry and Pippin's escape. Even if scenes of it hadn't been in the trailer/preview, it's essential to the story. How does Merry and Pippin arrive at Fangorn and bring about the fall of Saruman? How does Aragorn/Legolas/Gimli meet Eomer? How/why do they meet Gandalf in Fangorn? The chase across Rohan is so key, you'd have to write an entirely different story to replace it.What will be missing, alas, he's my favorite too, is Ugluk and his knocking heads with Grishnahk. There has been no basis established for Saruman's double treachery.*Maril rubs hands together.* Let's have some fun.[ April 13, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ]

Orodhromeus · 04-14-2002, 11:34 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Sad to say, but I don't think there will be much about Merry and Pippin with the orcs. Why should there be? They are all Saruman's uruks. No orcs of Mordor or the Misty Mountains. There'd be no argument about where they are going, no intertribal bickering, in other words, no fun! It would just be Merry and Pippin being dragged along by the orcs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I don't remember where I saw this but I think it could be quite true: Lurtz was the leader of Saruman's Uruk-Hais, and Lurtz was killed. That would make a fight for supremacy likely. The uruks would fight each other just to see who would be their leader.And Maril' you're right, we could get Sam & Frodo first, and make the logo appear while we fly over Emyn Muil and gradually approach the 2 Hobbits. "we're lost" conversation. Nightfall, lembas luncheon. Sam tells Frodo he feels they're followed. Frodo starts telling Gollum's story after what he had heard from Bilbo & Gandalf when a sinister form starts climbing down steep ridges. We hear "precious" or something as Gollum-ish, and cut to Pippin & Merry.How 'bout that?

04-14-2002, 11:38 AM

I think it will start with Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli. That's how the book starts, and it is a logical place to pick up the story. BTW, someone said they didn't think there would be a lot with Merry and Pippin, but the book dedicates a whole chapter (which is pretty long) to those two. At least I hope they show a whole bunch...Pippin's my favorite character!!

Orodhromeus · 04-15-2002, 01:30 PM

Well, seeing Merry & Pippin with the orcs/uruks depends wether there will be a fight among the orcs. We'll probably see Éomer & his éored killing them, and the Fangorn part is definitely going to be left untouched (maybe trimmed of songs & Bregalad).pippin_fan, don't you think Gandalf's comeback comes first? Or do you think he'll be shown directly as the White Rider to the 3 walkers?

Marileangorifurnimaluim · 04-15-2002, 03:01 PM

I think we'll see Merry and Pippin with the orcs and Uruk-hai, just to emphasize how awful their experience is. It's also crucial character development. Without their war-like experience there, you can't possibly imagine them sword-sworn to Gondor and Theoden respectively, or bold enough to take a slice out of the Nazgul king.That's another reason Frodo wasn't shown standing up to the Nazgul at the fords, since we weren't shown his first moment of bravery against the Barrow-wight. I think they'll skip the fight between the Mordor and Isengard orcs, but show Pippin's escape attempt. I also think they will simplify it as an escape attempt, instead of a pre-planned tossing of the Lorien cloakpin, and show the pin fall by accident. I suspect they'll want us to really despise Saruman, and this is a good way to do it.

pippin_took0 · 04-16-2002, 01:09 PM

I think the first bit on the actual TT story will be Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli running after the orcs. Or possibly Pippin and Merry with the orcs.

Kuruharan · 04-16-2002, 04:31 PM

I've seen pictures of Aragorn picking up Pippin's broach so that's still there. (At least I think that's what those shots were.) I think what will happen is that they will just show the orcs trundling across the countryside, the Three Hunters following them, and then skip to the big gory battle between the Riders and the Uruks. It saves time and you still get to have lots of blood and killing.I think that the movie will probably start with a brief visit to Frodo and Sam, but I think they will cut to Aragorn & co. for a while before they get to the part where Frodo and Sam meet Gollum. I think that PJ will want to make the meeting with Gollum a big important part of the movie (he'd better) and not want to rush it by having loose ends.So, brief cut to Frodo and Sam, followed by Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas chasing orcs and then getting to the eves of Fangorn. Then I think there will be the meeting with Gollum.

Peregrin Boffin · 04-16-2002, 06:02 PM

I think Gandalf should be shown where he is in the book. Its a much bigger moment if that is his first appearance in the film.

04-13-2002, 10:59 AM	#1
Orodhromeus Wight Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Greece Posts: 106	The beginning of TTT I've been thinking of what will the beginning of the next movie will look like. I mean what precise scenes will be shown? We know more or less what will be in it, but how would you like to see it beginning? It may sound trivial, but I can't get it off my mind!<P>I imagine it beginning with Gandalf at the top of shiny snowy mountains. Then a large being passes in front of the sun. The viewer recognizes Gwaihir. Next scene, Caras Galadhon. Gandalf talks with Galadriel. Here, the general situation is reminded by Celeborn & Galadriel to those who saw FotR long ago or those who didn't see it at all. Galadriel tells Gandalf her predictions for each member of the remaining Fellowship (including that Frodo-will-die-thing). End of intro. The logo shows up. Darkness. Merry & Pippin wake up as they are let off by the orcs and hit the ground. They understand there's an argument going on between them. The Orcs talk in the Common Tongue. Killings, Pippin cuts his ropes. They go on. Pippin cuts his Lórien coat and leaves a piece on the ground. Cut to the Three Walkers. They eventually find the piece of coat. As they see 106 riders approaching, cut to the rough landscape of Emyn Muil.<P>What do you think of it? Do you see it otherwise?<p>[ April 13, 2002: Message edited by: Orodhromeus ]

04-13-2002, 11:24 AM	#2
Lhunbelethiel Wight Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area (aka Bay of Belfalas) Posts: 103	I wonder if they'll do a recap of FOTR to catch people up? (like at the beginning of FOTR when they gave the backstory)<P>I think they might start with the death and river burial of Boromir, maybe....? __________________ ~~All that is gold does not glitter, not all who wander are lost, all that is old does not wither, deep roots are not touched by the frost...~~

04-13-2002, 11:46 AM	#3
ElanorGamgee Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 314	I kind of hope they start with Pippin and Merry in the Orc camp. Maybe one of them could have a dream that kind of sums up the situation at the end of FotR. __________________ Soli Deo Gloria

04-13-2002, 01:57 PM	#5
Kuruharan Regal Dwarven Shade Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold Posts: 3,685	Sad to say, but I don't think there will be much about Merry and Pippin with the orcs. Why should there be? They are all Saruman's uruks. No orcs of Mordor or the Misty Mountains. There'd be no argument about where they are going, no intertribal bickering, in other words, no fun! It would just be Merry and Pippin being dragged along by the orcs. After a while that would get really boring.<P>Worst of all NO UGLUK!!! One of my favorite characters probably ends up on the cutting room floor! (Or just cut out of the script entirely for all I know.) <BR>Good grief! What's a Uruk gotta do to get some screen time here?!! __________________ ...finding a path that cannot be found, walking a road that cannot be seen, climbing a ladder that was never placed, or reading a paragraph that has no...

04-13-2002, 02:18 PM	#6
Tigerlily Gamgee Hostess of Spirits Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Meduseld Posts: 1,056	It's hard to say where it may start. I doubt that it will start with an introduction to the heeps of new characters. It is possible that it will start with a recap.<BR>But, it could also start with the Fellowship, Gandalf, Merry and Pippin, Sam and Frodo.<BR>I just don't know!<BR>I am really excited to find out.<BR>Well, only about 8 months to go __________________ ~ ExerciseJunky.com (Hobbits fitness of choice!)~ ~Lady of Rohan: An Eowyn Fansite ~ ~The NEW/OLD Barrow Downs Photo Page~

04-13-2002, 12:05 PM	#4
Varda Guest Posts: n/a	I think that they might start the film with Faramir or the people of Gondor finding the broken horn and seeing Boromir go past

04-13-2002, 03:05 PM	#7
Araen Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 70	If they start with anything taht involves Boromir's death it will be a rather upsetting note and it could put a damper on the hwole film. That is how it normally is with really sad stuff at the begining. __________________ "Where is the horse and the rider, where is the horn that was blowing, they have passed like rain on the mountains, like wind in the meadow, the days are damned in the west? behind the hills? there are shadows... "

04-13-2002, 09:15 PM	#8
Marileangorifurnimaluim Eerie Forest Spectre Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Buried in scrolls of fanfiction Posts: 798	I like your version Orod. <P>I think I'd make one change, and that is instead of moving to Merry and Pippin first, I'd have Frodo and Sam early. We want to keep the focus on the Ring and Frodo, since that's the central theme, especially for those who didn't see the first movie. <P>It's a natural lead-in from Galadriel saying "the quest with claim his life." Switch to Frodo and Sam highlighted against the sharp peaks of Emyn Muil, the thunderous glow of Mordor in the distance, looking dirty and tired. <BR>Frodo: "We're lost." <BR>Sits with a sigh.<BR>Sam: "What a pickle. There's the one place in the world I've never wanted to go, that's exactly where I'm trying to get to. And we can't get there, nohow."<P>Orod, you have a good sense for this. Where do you think we should cut to Pippin and Sam? Before the meeting with Gollum? How would you work in the history of Gollum, which we know will be shown?<P>Absolutely there will be the chase of the orc band and Merry and Pippin's escape. Even if scenes of it hadn't been in the trailer/preview, it's essential to the story. How does Merry and Pippin arrive at Fangorn and bring about the fall of Saruman? How does Aragorn/Legolas/Gimli meet Eomer? How/why do they meet Gandalf in Fangorn? The chase across Rohan is so key, you'd have to write an entirely different story to replace it.<P>What will be missing, alas, he's my favorite too, is Ugluk and his knocking heads with Grishnahk. There has been no basis established for Saruman's double treachery.<P>Maril rubs hands together. Let's have some fun.<p>[ April 13, 2002: Message edited by: Marileangorifurnimaluim ] __________________ Deserves death! I daresay he does... And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them?

04-14-2002, 11:34 AM	#9
Orodhromeus Wight Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Greece Posts: 106	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Sad to say, but I don't think there will be much about Merry and Pippin with the orcs. Why should there be? They are all Saruman's uruks. No orcs of Mordor or the Misty Mountains. There'd be no argument about where they are going, no intertribal bickering, in other words, no fun! It would just be Merry and Pippin being dragged along by the orcs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I don't remember where I saw this but I think it could be quite true: Lurtz was the leader of Saruman's Uruk-Hais, and Lurtz was killed. That would make a fight for supremacy likely. The uruks would fight each other just to see who would be their leader.<P>And Maril' you're right, we could get Sam & Frodo first, and make the logo appear while we fly over Emyn Muil and gradually approach the 2 Hobbits. "we're lost" conversation. Nightfall, lembas luncheon. Sam tells Frodo he feels they're followed. Frodo starts telling Gollum's story after what he had heard from Bilbo & Gandalf when a sinister form starts climbing down steep ridges. We hear "precious" or something as Gollum-ish, and cut to Pippin & Merry.<P>How 'bout that?

04-14-2002, 11:38 AM	#10
pippin_fan Guest Posts: n/a	I think it will start with Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli. That's how the book starts, and it is a logical place to pick up the story. <BR>BTW, someone said they didn't think there would be a lot with Merry and Pippin, but the book dedicates a whole chapter (which is pretty long) to those two. At least I hope they show a whole bunch...Pippin's my favorite character!!

04-15-2002, 01:30 PM	#11
Orodhromeus Wight Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Greece Posts: 106	Well, seeing Merry & Pippin with the orcs/uruks depends wether there will be a fight among the orcs. We'll probably see Éomer & his éored killing them, and the Fangorn part is definitely going to be left untouched (maybe trimmed of songs & Bregalad).<P>pippin_fan, don't you think Gandalf's comeback comes first? Or do you think he'll be shown directly as the White Rider to the 3 walkers?

04-15-2002, 03:01 PM	#12
Marileangorifurnimaluim Eerie Forest Spectre Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Buried in scrolls of fanfiction Posts: 798	I think we'll see Merry and Pippin with the orcs and Uruk-hai, just to emphasize how awful their experience is. It's also crucial character development. Without their war-like experience there, you can't possibly imagine them sword-sworn to Gondor and Theoden respectively, or bold enough to take a slice out of the Nazgul king.<P>That's another reason Frodo wasn't shown standing up to the Nazgul at the fords, since we weren't shown his first moment of bravery against the Barrow-wight. <P>I think they'll skip the fight between the Mordor and Isengard orcs, but show Pippin's escape attempt. I also think they will simplify it as an escape attempt, instead of a pre-planned tossing of the Lorien cloakpin, and show the pin fall by accident. I suspect they'll want us to really despise Saruman, and this is a good way to do it. __________________ Deserves death! I daresay he does... And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them?

04-16-2002, 01:09 PM	#13
pippin_took0 Haunting Spirit Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Middle Earth Posts: 82	I think the first bit on the actual TT story will be Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli running after the orcs. Or possibly Pippin and Merry with the orcs.

04-16-2002, 04:31 PM	#14
Kuruharan Regal Dwarven Shade Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold Posts: 3,685	I've seen pictures of Aragorn picking up Pippin's broach so that's still there. (At least I think that's what those shots were.) I think what will happen is that they will just show the orcs trundling across the countryside, the Three Hunters following them, and then skip to the big gory battle between the Riders and the Uruks. It saves time and you still get to have lots of blood and killing.<P>I think that the movie will probably start with a brief visit to Frodo and Sam, but I think they will cut to Aragorn & co. for a while before they get to the part where Frodo and Sam meet Gollum. I think that PJ will want to make the meeting with Gollum a big important part of the movie (he'd better) and not want to rush it by having loose ends.<P>So, brief cut to Frodo and Sam, followed by Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas chasing orcs and then getting to the eves of Fangorn. Then I think there will be the meeting with Gollum. __________________ ...finding a path that cannot be found, walking a road that cannot be seen, climbing a ladder that was never placed, or reading a paragraph that has no...

04-16-2002, 06:02 PM	#15
Peregrin Boffin Pile O'Bones Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: HOME VII Posts: 13	I think Gandalf should be shown where he is in the book. Its a much bigger moment if that is his first appearance in the film.

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