The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Books
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-04-2018, 02:07 PM   #1
Victariongreyjoy
Animated Skeleton
 
Victariongreyjoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 39
Victariongreyjoy has just left Hobbiton.
Questions about the host of Valinor

It was stated in the books that Enw were the commander of the host against Morgoth. The foot soldiers were the Vanyar. My question is: Did other Maiar participate in the struggle? Ilmar, Uinen, Tilion, Oss or others? Did the Maia had lesser spritis that were foot soldiers?
Victariongreyjoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 11:25 AM   #2
Rhun charioteer
Haunting Spirit
 
Rhun charioteer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 70
Rhun charioteer has just left Hobbiton.
It's certainly possible and could be at least part of the reason the war of wrath was so cataclysmically destructive. I can also see maybe Ulmo participating in the war after all Beleriand did sink beneath the waves even if he wasn't actually there and the other valar didn't participate at least not directly.
Rhun charioteer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2018, 03:30 AM   #3
Victariongreyjoy
Animated Skeleton
 
Victariongreyjoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 39
Victariongreyjoy has just left Hobbiton.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhun charioteer View Post
It's certainly possible and could be at least part of the reason the war of wrath was so cataclysmically destructive. I can also see maybe Ulmo participating in the war after all Beleriand did sink beneath the waves even if he wasn't actually there and the other valar didn't participate at least not directly.
So the powers of the Maiar can also be very devastating? Are these Maiar I mentioned even more powerful than Gandalf and Saruman?
Victariongreyjoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2018, 04:17 AM   #4
Huinesoron
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Huinesoron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: The Fair City of Nargothrond
Posts: 511
Huinesoron is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victariongreyjoy View Post
Are these Maiar I mentioned even more powerful than Gandalf and Saruman?
But what is 'power'? Sauron had more worldly power than any other Maia in the history of Arda, but his chief servants could still be beguiled by the Voice of Saruman. Gandalf, meanwhile, arguably exercises his greatest power simply by keeping the flame of hope burning in the hearts of Men; his greatest feat wasn't destroying the Balrog, or breaking Saruman's staff, or calling down fire to strike a host of werewolves, but the simple act of knowing who could be trusted with the Ring - and who could be trusted to accompany him.

By Sauronian measures, Osse is probably the most powerful of the Good Maiar: according to some parts of the Legendarium, he was strong enough to hold the Lonely Isle against the will of Ulmo himself. But Uinen is able to restrain Osse, so perhaps you count her the greater? On the flip side, by Gandalfesque standards, Eonwe has the greatest power - because he was able to lead the Host of Valinor to victory.

hS

"Do not go to the Elves for counsel..."
Huinesoron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2018, 09:29 AM   #5
Andsigil
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Andsigil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The Deepest Forges of Ered Luin
Posts: 701
Andsigil is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huinesoron View Post
But what is 'power'? Sauron had more worldly power than any other Maia in the history of Arda,
I would argue that Melian had more.

But, you're correct in that his was vast. That is a double-edged sword, however, because the act of building up his worldly power diminished his inner power (much like Morgoth) and he was reduced to the pathetic figure of Sharkey in the end, and killed by Wormtongue.
__________________
Even as fog continues to lie in the valleys, so does ancient sin cling to the low places, the depression in the world consciousness.
Andsigil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2018, 12:27 PM   #6
Victariongreyjoy
Animated Skeleton
 
Victariongreyjoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 39
Victariongreyjoy has just left Hobbiton.
Sauron's power

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huinesoron View Post
But what is 'power'? Sauron had more worldly power than any other Maia in the history of Arda, but his chief servants could still be beguiled by the Voice of Saruman. Gandalf, meanwhile, arguably exercises his greatest power simply by keeping the flame of hope burning in the hearts of Men; his greatest feat wasn't destroying the Balrog, or breaking Saruman's staff, or calling down fire to strike a host of werewolves, but the simple act of knowing who could be trusted with the Ring - and who could be trusted to accompany him.

By Sauronian measures, Osse is probably the most powerful of the Good Maiar: according to some parts of the Legendarium, he was strong enough to hold the Lonely Isle against the will of Ulmo himself. But Uinen is able to restrain Osse, so perhaps you count her the greater? On the flip side, by Gandalfesque standards, Eonwe has the greatest power - because he was able to lead the Host of Valinor to victory.

hS

"Do not go to the Elves for counsel..."
Since Sauron's power were quite vast, could he be closer to a Ainur than a Maia when he made the ring of power?
Victariongreyjoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2018, 01:05 PM   #7
Galadriel55
Blossom of Dwimordene
 
Galadriel55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: The realm of forgotten words
Posts: 7,386
Galadriel55 is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Galadriel55 is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Galadriel55 is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victariongreyjoy View Post
Since Sauron's power were quite vast, could he be closer to a Ainur than a Maia when he made the ring of power?
Maiar are Ainur, together with the Valar. Do you mean Valar? If so, I would say no. The difference between Maiar and Valar seems something inherent, and not proportional to the extent of external power manifestation. It's not like you get a certain amount of power points and reach the Valar level.
__________________
- These taxes, they are like sacrifices to tribal gods?
- Well, roughly speaking, but paying taxes is more painful.
Doctor Who: The Sun Makers
Galadriel55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:03 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.