The small guys... - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Maeglin · 02-28-2002, 03:05 PM

Oki, I dont know if this has been discussed before but I wonder something...

In the Hobbit it is told that the Hobbits are larger than the littleputts (please help me translate that swenglish to english, whats a littleputt in english?). Where does the "Littleputts" come from and are they mentioned anywhere else? Or is it only as Tolkien compared the length of the hobbits with totally irrelevant beings that doesn't exist in his own fantasyworld?

***Mithadan*** · 02-28-2002, 03:39 PM

Sounds like a translator did a little more than just translate. That reference does not appear in the english version.

Pirotess · 02-28-2002, 03:57 PM

I wouldn't put my life on the line, but i'm almost certain that in the french version that word comes up too. But the translators in french have done such a horrible job, especially with the LOTR books, it's hard sometimes to know if what you read comes from Tolkien or not. [img]smilies/confused.gif[/img]

Rosa Underhill · 02-28-2002, 03:59 PM

Well, the closest match I can think of to "littleputt" is "Lilipucian(sp?". But they were never mentioned in "The Hobbit". They were a diminutive people that Gulliver found during his travels.

Birdland · 02-28-2002, 11:27 PM

Quote:

In the Hobbit it is told that the Hobbits are larger than the littleputts

Maeglin, here's how it reads in the English version (if we are referring to the same passage, which I think we are):

Hobbits "...are (or were) a little people, about half our height, and smaller than the bearded dwarves."

Lilliputs (actually Lilliputians) were the 6 inch tall people of the Island of Lilliput, as described in Jonathan Swift's novel Gulliver's Travels. The word "Lilliput" was created by Mr. Swift, but has come to be used as a general term for anything small.

It's interesting that they would choose that word instead of Dwarves. I thought Dwarves would be a more easily recognizable mythical creature in Sweden than Lilliputs. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Maeglin · 03-01-2002, 12:35 PM

They are, They are, They are!!!

The dwarves are mentioned. And it was the Lilliputs I meanth because in the swedish verision of Gulliver's travels theyr'e names are "Littleputts" as I called them [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img].

I'm translating by my self from the swedish verision of the Hobbit.

*They are (or were) little beings, smaller than the dwarves (and without beards) thoe much larger than the lilliputs.*

Oki, that sentence didn't do very well in english but I translated litterarly.

Grrr... Ake Ohlmark is a terrible translator!!! [img]smilies/mad.gif[/img]

But was the hobbits compared with the lilliputs in the french verision too?
What is this??? Were Ake Ohlmark and the french translator friends or did evrybody have lilliput-mandness??? [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img]

Birdland · 03-01-2002, 11:06 PM

That is funny! Why would he need to throw in the part about the Lilliputs? Overstressing the point a bit, unless people in Sweden have a different image of a dwarf's height than the British do.

Makes me wonder what I'm getting when I read an English translation of a book originally written in another language. (Unfortunately, I speak no other languages. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img] )

I imagine though, that a good translation would shine through.

[ March 02, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

Mat_Heathertoes · 03-02-2002, 06:11 AM

It wondered that too. Maybe the reason is to clarify the translation of the plural of dwarf :- dwarves. This was a word Tolkien admitted he invented. Does the Swedish version explicitly mention the word 'dwarves' or does it have another name for them ?

zifnab · 03-02-2002, 11:50 AM

Why would you compare a Hobbit with a 6 inch race of beings called lulliputs, that are mentioned in other fantasy worlds. Maybe Im not understanding this, but that sounds horrible. I would rather have a hobbits height compared to say the Swedish(whatever language we are referring too) term for a mail-box. At least they similar. I can't begin to understand the concept of comparing a Hobbit's size to that of a race of beings that are so tiny(6 inches), they have to run from rats and birds to stay alive. [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img]

Maeglin · 03-03-2002, 12:55 PM

Yeah Zifnab, That would be terrible! [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img]

Quote:

Originally posted by Birdland...

That is funny! Why would he need to throw in the part about the Lilliputs? Overstressing the point a bit, unless people in Sweden have a different image of a dwarf's height than the British do.

Well actually Birdland, the swedish and Brittish dwarves are the exact same thing in all ways when the brittish and swedish dwarves just as the elves and the trolls come from the norse mythology (the viking mytholgy).

Well I totally agree with you Zifnab. Why take fables from other fantasyworlds? It's like comparing Quigon-Jinn with Gandalf IN The phantom menace.

Birdland · 03-03-2002, 04:15 PM

That's what I kinda figured. Which makes the translation all the more confusing. If you told a Swede a hobbit was a little smaller than a dwarf, he should be able to get a pretty good mental picture of a halfling's height.

Hey, I knew what it meant, and my knowledge of Norse methology was limited to what little they taught in school, plus reading the Marvel comic books about "The Mighty Thor".

If they translated the Swedish text into American English, it would read something like "Hobbits were smaller than dwarves, but bigger than a bread box." (Don't ask me why Americans compare small things to bread boxes. It's just one of those old sayings. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] )

Oh well, maybe that translator was getting paid by the word.

Aralaithiel · 03-03-2002, 06:09 PM

I know why the Americans compare sizes of things to bread boxes!!!! Before bread came in lovely decorated plasic bags, it came wrapped in paper from the bakery. Every house had a bread box in their kitchen to keep the bread fresh since we didn't have those plastic bags. Therefore, you could refer to the size of something by how it compared to a bread box, since everybody would have known what that was and how big it was (the bread box, that is!).
Woohoo!!! Feeling real smart for some reason right now! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

zifnab · 03-04-2002, 02:37 AM

Everybody had a spoon too. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

Bruce MacCulloch · 03-04-2002, 06:51 AM

Yep, hobbits are bigger than spoons! [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

Maeglin · 03-04-2002, 12:40 PM

Anyone heard about the spoon-auntie?

Hup! Sry! Just another stupid swedish thing. [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]

02-28-2002, 03:05 PM	#1
Maeglin Wight Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nan Elmoth Posts: 136	The small guys... Oki, I dont know if this has been discussed before but I wonder something... In the Hobbit it is told that the Hobbits are larger than the littleputts (please help me translate that swenglish to english, whats a littleputt in english?). Where does the "Littleputts" come from and are they mentioned anywhere else? Or is it only as Tolkien compared the length of the hobbits with totally irrelevant beings that doesn't exist in his own fantasyworld? __________________ The fool speaks of what he knows. The wise knows what he speaks of.

02-28-2002, 03:39 PM	#2
*Mithadan* Spirit of Mist Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Tol Eressea Posts: 3,314	Sounds like a translator did a little more than just translate. That reference does not appear in the english version. __________________ Beleriand, Beleriand, the borders of the Elven-land.

02-28-2002, 03:57 PM	#3
Pirotess Pile O'Bones Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: RL unfortunately Posts: 22	I wouldn't put my life on the line, but i'm almost certain that in the french version that word comes up too. But the translators in french have done such a horrible job, especially with the LOTR books, it's hard sometimes to know if what you read comes from Tolkien or not. [img]smilies/confused.gif[/img] __________________ above all shadows rides the Sun and Stars for ever dwell: I will not say the Day is done, nor bid the Stars farewell

02-28-2002, 03:59 PM	#4
Rosa Underhill Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waymeet, the Shire Posts: 297	Well, the closest match I can think of to "littleputt" is "Lilipucian(sp?". But they were never mentioned in "The Hobbit". They were a diminutive people that Gulliver found during his travels. __________________ WWAHD? (What would a Hobbit do?)

03-01-2002, 12:35 PM	#6
Maeglin Wight Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nan Elmoth Posts: 136	They are, They are, They are!!! The dwarves are mentioned. And it was the Lilliputs I meanth because in the swedish verision of Gulliver's travels theyr'e names are "Littleputts" as I called them [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]. I'm translating by my self from the swedish verision of the Hobbit. They are (or were) little beings, smaller than the dwarves (and without beards) thoe much larger than the lilliputs. Oki, that sentence didn't do very well in english but I translated litterarly. Grrr... Ake Ohlmark is a terrible translator!!! [img]smilies/mad.gif[/img] But was the hobbits compared with the lilliputs in the french verision too? What is this??? Were Ake Ohlmark and the french translator friends or did evrybody have lilliput-mandness??? [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img] __________________ The fool speaks of what he knows. The wise knows what he speaks of.

03-01-2002, 11:06 PM	#7
Birdland Ghastly Neekerbreeker Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the banks of the mighty Scioto Posts: 1,757	That is funny! Why would he need to throw in the part about the Lilliputs? Overstressing the point a bit, unless people in Sweden have a different image of a dwarf's height than the British do. Makes me wonder what I'm getting when I read an English translation of a book originally written in another language. (Unfortunately, I speak no other languages. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img] ) I imagine though, that a good translation would shine through. [ March 02, 2002: Message edited by: Birdland ]

03-02-2002, 06:11 AM	#8
Mat_Heathertoes Wight Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: A Broom cupboard in Utumno Posts: 185	It wondered that too. Maybe the reason is to clarify the translation of the plural of dwarf :- dwarves. This was a word Tolkien admitted he invented. Does the Swedish version explicitly mention the word 'dwarves' or does it have another name for them ? __________________ Give me fish now, and keep nassty chips!

03-02-2002, 11:50 AM	#9
zifnab Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: omni-presence Posts: 329	Why would you compare a Hobbit with a 6 inch race of beings called lulliputs, that are mentioned in other fantasy worlds. Maybe Im not understanding this, but that sounds horrible. I would rather have a hobbits height compared to say the Swedish(whatever language we are referring too) term for a mail-box. At least they similar. I can't begin to understand the concept of comparing a Hobbit's size to that of a race of beings that are so tiny(6 inches), they have to run from rats and birds to stay alive. [img]smilies/eek.gif[/img] __________________ Facebook.

03-03-2002, 04:15 PM	#11
Birdland Ghastly Neekerbreeker Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: the banks of the mighty Scioto Posts: 1,757	That's what I kinda figured. Which makes the translation all the more confusing. If you told a Swede a hobbit was a little smaller than a dwarf, he should be able to get a pretty good mental picture of a halfling's height. Hey, I knew what it meant, and my knowledge of Norse methology was limited to what little they taught in school, plus reading the Marvel comic books about "The Mighty Thor". If they translated the Swedish text into American English, it would read something like "Hobbits were smaller than dwarves, but bigger than a bread box." (Don't ask me why Americans compare small things to bread boxes. It's just one of those old sayings. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] ) Oh well, maybe that translator was getting paid by the word.

03-03-2002, 06:09 PM	#12
Aralaithiel Ghost Eldaran Queen Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: A remote mountain in Valinor Posts: 353	I know why the Americans compare sizes of things to bread boxes!!!! Before bread came in lovely decorated plasic bags, it came wrapped in paper from the bakery. Every house had a bread box in their kitchen to keep the bread fresh since we didn't have those plastic bags. Therefore, you could refer to the size of something by how it compared to a bread box, since everybody would have known what that was and how big it was (the bread box, that is!). Woohoo!!! Feeling real smart for some reason right now! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ A lelyat, wen! (Quenya Elvish for "You go, girl!"

03-04-2002, 02:37 AM	#13
zifnab Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: omni-presence Posts: 329	Everybody had a spoon too. [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] __________________ Facebook.

03-04-2002, 06:51 AM	#14
Bruce MacCulloch Dead Man of Dunharrow Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 652	Yep, hobbits are bigger than spoons! [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img] __________________ `A blunderbuss, was it?' said he, scratching his head. `I thought it was horseflies!'

03-04-2002, 12:40 PM	#15
Maeglin Wight Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nan Elmoth Posts: 136	Anyone heard about the spoon-auntie? Hup! Sry! Just another stupid swedish thing. [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img] __________________ The fool speaks of what he knows. The wise knows what he speaks of.