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View Poll Results: What Confession Do You Belong to?
Atheism 19 16.67%
Buddhism 4 3.51%
Christianity (Catholic) 20 17.54%
Christianity (Orthodox) 7 6.14%
Christianity (Protestant) 37 32.46%
Confucianism 0 0%
Hinduism 0 0%
Islam 2 1.75%
Judaism 6 5.26%
Other 19 16.67%
Voters: 114. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-22-2006, 08:05 AM   #1
HerenIstarion
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Public Research: Religion - What Confession Do You Belong to?

What is the point? Not much, really - as social surveys go, most of them are intended A. to help somebody to sell something B. to satisfy ‘scientific’ curiosity. As I’m not selling anything, this must be the latter case – I would like to learn whom LoTR (and other works too, but mainly LoTR) appeals to.

The poll is private, as the information I’m after is. Only numbers and percentage will be seen, no names. You are not requested to post information you provide for the survey unless you wish so – but do so, of course, if you feel inclined to. But confessional debates are strictly prohibited – you are not supposed to battle over ‘whose faith is the True one’ – restrict to issues like whether Tolkien’s work has more or less meaning for you because of your faith etc.

The idea closely follows up proposal as given here (To Administration – Proposal), which, in itself, was born in the course of the discussion in Does LotR Have Cross-cultural Appeal? thread. The idea of making special sub-forum for the essay was not supported, but my curiosity is still nagging me. I hope I won’t share the fate of certain member of feline family for this feeling of mine and post the survey into Barrow-Downs sub-forum (as it concerns BD members more than Tolkien’s work per se). It is understood that the survey won’t be very objective (not one public research is), as it will be carried out only with English speaking Internet users, and greater bulk of readers worldwide may have read the books in their native tongues. But let us assume that we are after English speaking Internet users, than survey may be viewed as more accurate than not – as I assume, the confessional representative ratio on message boards must be more or less similar.

Unfortunately, poll questions’ number is limited to ten, so I have to resort to ten as above, leaving out finer definitions like Shia’ or Sunni’ Islam and very whole religions like Sikhism, Jainism or Shintoism (as I list religions with greater level of population). However, I allow for Christian origins of Tolkien’s work, therefore Christian confessions are given in [greater] detail, while all others only in general. I assume as a given that greater majority of Tolkien readers will be Christian, so I’m interested in their division between confessions as well as in sheer percentage as compared to other religions. Atheism is not religion, of course, but consistent Atheism resembles one very much. I propose, therefore, that members who view themselves as merely secular/irreligious people or are agnostics, or adhere to theosophy, list themselves in option ‘other’ rather than in Atheism, but that is not mandatory prescription – be free in your choice.

My apologies for not being able to provide finer definitions for Orthodox Christianity (it includes, therefore, Eastern Orthodox Church and all the multitude of Oriental Churches, Armenian and Copt and Abyssinian included) and Protestantism (so it includes every confession after the Reformation and Anglican Church too, despite differences there are and my doubts whether it would have been better to include Anglicans within Catholicism. However, if Anglicans feel my classification is incorrect, they are free to list themselves into another option. They are not free to debate confessional issues in the thread, though – see above). However, I voted against my primal idea of making separate poll for Christian confessions – two similar threads would have been confusing, or so I thought.

The poll will be open for indefinite length of time, allowing for appearance of new and return of now missing old members.

Please take time to vote on supplementary polls:
Civilizations
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How did you learn about Tolkien?
The Book You Started with
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First Read
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Mothertongue (part 2)
Free Cheese
Race (Slavs and other Vikings, Varangians, and Sarmatians)
Mothertongue (Indo-European Languages)
Mothertongue (Part 4 - Europe)
Field of Study
Field of Activity
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Old 01-22-2006, 08:47 AM   #2
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Deja vu, anybody? Whatever happened to the last poll, Mr Istarion?

As for my faith, it hasn't been much affected by Tolkien. The underlying conflict between good and evil is probably prevalent in all religions. This does not mean religion is the only manifestation of this conflict. As an agnostic with more interest in the potential of humanity than that of a potential God, I feel this conflict in life too.

What exactly am I saying here? I'm not sure. Perhaps that morality, when it comes down to it, has no bearing on faith, nor vice versa. Tolkien, to me, deals with moral concepts, good and evil, friendship versus enmity, life versus death etc. All concepts common to humanity as a whole, not to one religion, nor to all religious people.

Coherence is my enemy.
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Old 01-22-2006, 09:06 AM   #3
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I'm a Zoroastrian by birth; my father is a Parsee, a descendant of the Sassanid Persians who fled from the Islamic conquest of the Persian Empire in the seventh century AD, and settled in India. It's a tiny, highly inbred, and extremely competent community; Parsees in droves have become lawyers, doctors and politicians. They did extremely well under the British Raj; our lot became shipping magnates.

My father though is somewhat out of the ordinary; he's taken his Zoroastrian skill to the bloody arena of university life, and is an English don at Oxford. He also married, rather than, as would have been usual, a first cousin, my mother, a Scottish Episcopalian and novelist.

I don't see that Zoroastrianism and Christianity are in any sense irreconcilable, and I am proud to designate myself a Zoroastrian Episcopalian. Or perhaps Zoropiscy for short...

In addition I am ready to hope in, if not believe in, anything and everything that appeals to me...
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Old 01-22-2006, 10:07 AM   #4
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I am an atheist, but I cannnot deny that the Lutheran faith is a big part of me. Not that I belive in any of that nonsence(metaphysical asbects of religion), but the teachings of moral, respect and love for one another is so deeply rooted in hour society that it is a part of me too.

By the way did you know that the belive in the Norse Mythology became an offical religion in Denmark some years ago, now it is the fastes growing religion in Denmark. (I think) In anycase they have some thousand members now.

In Denmark religion is not that big a deal to people anymore. (exept for the jewish and muslim minoreties)
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Old 01-22-2006, 10:08 AM   #5
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Heren, m'love, you've ended your title with a preposition. I suppose I'm only upset that it was an 'e' instead of an 'o'. My writing teachers would slaughter you in your sleep.

And to clarify my vote, I was raised in a Methodist/Catholic home. It turned out one atheist and two agnostics, one with Buddhist leanings and a fascination for world religions and philosophy. We all like the LotR.

Hope that helps your research.
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Old 01-22-2006, 11:08 AM   #6
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Where is Jedi Knight on this poll? When the UK did their census in 2001, they had a list of religions to choose from, including 'Other'. There was a campaign for people to enter 'Jedi Knight' under other to skew the public records.

In a way, I'm officially a Protestant as I am a full member of the CofE, but that is not what I currently follow, and I was a definite Atheist for a while but am not now, so I say 'Other'. This 'Other' could be said to be something approaching universalist unitarian, which means I have left all the options open and have not decided that one creed is more important than another. It also leaves open the option of not believing at all if I so wish. Basically, it's about coming to your own conclusions and forming your own relationship with God or not - as you see fit, and being open to listening to what others believe, or what they don't believe.

Even then I would not wish to be 'labelled' as I might feel very differently at any given point in the future.

This is what comes from being an incredibly indecisive person.
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Old 01-22-2006, 12:36 PM   #7
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I am an atheist, but I cannnot deny that the Lutheran faith is a big part of me. Not that I belive in any of that nonsence, but the teachings of moral, respect and love for one another is so deeply rooted in hour society that it is a part of me too.
Rune, even if you do think it is nonsense, I would ask that you would be more polite or careful in sharing your views. I am a Lutheran, and I certainly do not think it is nonsense. While I don't think you intended it to be so, your words are rather offensive and insulting.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:01 PM   #8
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Can growth in faith through Tolkien be a little indirect? The books that have had the biggest effect on me religiously are those of C.S. Lewis. Lewis was a close personal friend of Tolkien, as well as being fellow member of Inklings, an informal club to discuss and encourage its members essays into fiction...
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Old 01-30-2006, 02:39 PM   #9
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Can growth in faith through Tolkien be a little indirect? The books that have had the biggest effect on me religiously are those of C.S. Lewis. Lewis was a close personal friend of Tolkien, as well as being fellow member of Inklings, an informal club to discuss and encourage its members essays into fiction...

Well Iwould say yes since Tolkien was an influence on Lewis's conversion although he was disappointed that he reverted to the church he had been brought up in rather than becoming a Catholic..
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Old 01-22-2007, 07:32 PM   #10
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Pipe Hmm...

Apparently, I didn't vote here earlier. I am surprised. Well, seeing as I have a paper to write and a book to read for tomorrow, I think it's a good idea that I do so now .

My mom is Lutheran, from a German-Lutheran father and Polish-Catholic mother (who has since converted). My dad is Catholic from a Irish-Catholic family. My mom's family is full of the go-to-church-on-Christmas-and-Easter sort of Christians who are very conservative, and my dad's family has some Catholics, some members of the Unification Church, and some weird agnostic-like Christians who I don't know how to define in the slightest, but who are mostly pretty liberal.

I was raised in the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America, the crazy semi-liberal branch of Lutheranism. I went to Sunday school, Bible camp, mission trips, and so on, for most of my life, until I got to college. I decided Christianity just didn't work for me, and consequently became atheist. I researched Neopaganism, but I prefer being an atheist. Interestingly, I go to a Lutheran school.

I think The Lord of the Rings helped ferment my politically liberal, anti-authoritarian worldview, which helped me reject organized religion. It certainly reinforced my environmentalism. I don't think I will ever be able to go back to an organized religion.

Oh, and I really like seeing what sorts of changes everyone's gone through in their lives. Fascinating!
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Old 01-22-2007, 11:55 PM   #11
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I actually voted sometime ago, but haven't actually posted anything until now.

My parents actually met through their church, and so my sister and I have been baptized, raised, and confirmed as United Methodists. As a child, I always went to church with my parents, though lately, much to my mom's distress, I rarely go to church at all anymore.

While I do believe in God, I'm not a very religious person, and simply don't feel the need to be at church. Though I am still Methodist, I don't really focus on what any certain church believes in. I find myself strongest by holding on to my own beliefs, whether it is what my church taught me or not.

When it comes to Tolkien, I cannot say that LotR or any other of his works have ever influenced me at all...
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Old 01-26-2007, 05:40 PM   #12
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a new vegetable for the recipe

I'm a Muslim (Traditional Sunni). I'm nominally a follower the Hanafi rite, but in practice follow the Shafi'i rite because that's the dominant madhab within my local community. I'm interested in Sufism and may join the Qadiri or Shadhili order in the future.

Tolkien's works haven't been influential upon my faith. I liked the nobility of the characters in LoTR and appreciated that aspect of the work. It is something that I have noticed to be lacking in the characters of the other modern western literature books that I have read (admittedly few). I also enjoyed the general lack of mention of any religion or religious practices in the book. I didn't care for the Silmarillion as much because of the polytheism that Tolkien introduced into the history.
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Old 01-26-2007, 07:03 PM   #13
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Happy atheist here .....I try to think as little about religion as possible.
If there is religion in LoTRs, I take it like I take the religion in the greek/roman myths.....interesting stories, that's all.
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Old 01-27-2007, 04:01 AM   #14
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I'm a Muslim (Traditional Sunni). I'm nominally a follower the Hanafi rite, but in practice follow the Shafi'i rite because that's the dominant madhab within my local community. I'm interested in Sufism and may join the Qadiri or Shadhili order in the future.

Tolkien's works haven't been influential upon my faith. I liked the nobility of the characters in LoTR and appreciated that aspect of the work. It is something that I have noticed to be lacking in the characters of the other modern western literature books that I have read (admittedly few). I also enjoyed the general lack of mention of any religion or religious practices in the book. I didn't care for the Silmarillion as much because of the polytheism that Tolkien introduced into the history.
It's nice to see the plurality in here... every additional "vegetable" is welcome

And, the polytheism thing... I always took (and I think Tolkien did as well) the Valar just like "angels" or "stewards" (like Denethor instead of Aragorn). After all, they are under the will of Eru. So I wouldn't make so much of a trouble of it...
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Old 01-28-2007, 03:01 PM   #15
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Boots Random Title #154

I guess since I participated in the poll, I should give an explanation. I marked Protestant, though I think of the term as non-Catholic and non-Orthodox. My parents met at the local Non-denominational Christian church, and I have since been raised and baptized in that particular church. I consider the Bible to be the final authority on morality, and the differences in denominations to be results of different interpretations on the Bible.

Has LOTR had influences on my beliefs? Surprisingly no. I'm still trying to find all those pieces that are considered to have Christian influence. I don't find LOTR to be as allegorical as say, C.S. Lewis's work.
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Old 08-13-2007, 09:50 PM   #16
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Seventh Day Adventist

I am a Seventh Day Adventist, I don't know what type of Christianity that settles into, but it is not Catholic thats for sure...We believe that everyone would be happier if they took Jesus Christ as their savior and read their bibles, and had a close walk with God.
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Old 07-05-2016, 09:07 AM   #17
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Having a day off post-Mooting has given me a deep dive into the Archives for interesting material, which is now coupled with a wake from my normal Huorn state into posting.

Rereading this thread, it occurs to me that while I answered the black and white question of which religious confession I call home, I did not really delve into the implicit question of "how does your faith (or lack thereof) affect your reading of Tolkien, or vice versa?"

Perhaps that's just as well--ten years ago I would have been even wordier than I am now, and I think my answer has probably changed. The black and white question hasn't: I remain a practicing, believing Roman Catholic; but I have grown a little bit in the intervening decade, both as a Catholic and as a Tolkien fan.

Ten years ago, although I was happy to note that I shared Tolkien's faith, I was actually rather bristly towards most arguments that tried to read anything religious into his work, a stance drawn largely from Tolkien's own cordial dislike of allegory. I started reading Tolkien when I was ten or eleven and I was neck-deep in fascination with his world before I discovered he was a Catholic and while I did eventually discover the Letters and was happy to discover he had been a Catholic too, I did not really change in my conviction that this had no implicit bearing on anything in his fiction. I was, after all, also discovering "On Fairy-stories" about that time, and my summation then of my response to Tolkien would have been to disavow anything overtly Catholic in Middle-earth as attempting to force upon the text an interpretation that did not allow the art of storytelling to be supreme.

To an extent, I still feel that way, though I might highlight the connection between good storytelling and my faith a bit more strongly. As I see it, the best storytelling has the quality of Truth to it, so what allows the story to excel as a story will make it more congruent with Truth itself, which as a believer of course means my faith. In the precise case of Tolkien, this is an easy transition to make, since his own worldview and thus his own tastes in storytelling, were formed and fed by his Catholicism.

Beyond that, in the last decade I have left seminary and the deliberate path of a life in the Church and gone on to a secular career. Tolkien has remained a major influence on my creative thought and has become even more of a rolemodel (or warning) of how to live as a practicing Catholic in a non-Catholic context. In some respects, he has been a model that has encouraged me to be a Catholic amongst non-Catholics rather than seeking to be within the company of other Catholics.

His works too, mainly The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion are read a little differently these days. They are well-worn pieces of mental furniture to me. Coupled with the breadth of their content and their beauty, this has made them a solace to me in hard times, not entirely unlike the Bible. Which is not to say that I think of them as Divinely Inspired, but I do incline--more than I used to--to see them as the products of a Catholic mind and thus to find the struggles within them as reflections by a mind with similar faith working through the great issues of life.
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Old 07-05-2016, 09:42 AM   #18
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This is a thread I've somehow missed all this time. Thanks Form, for unearthing it.

I selected the Christianity-Protestant option. I was born and reared in the Baptist denomination, though my parents weren't notably devout. We attended church fairly regularly, but throughout a good deal of my childhood faith wasn't a large part of my life.

I had read The Hobbit and LOTR well before my 'epiphany' in adolescence, the point at which I became a committed follower of Jesus Christ. Since that time, Tolkien's works have to me echoed many elements of my faith, and the meaning of the books is much deeper than when I read them in childhood.

Like Form, I too can find moral and spiritual solace in Tolkien sometimes. For example, there have been times when I was obliged for financial reasons to sell items that, while cherished, really served no purpose, and it was very unlikely I would ever actually use them. At those instances, I could almost hear the voice of (not Vigo!!) Aragorn saying to me "he who cannot cast away a treasure at need is in fetters".

Other times I think of the mercy shown to Gollum by Bilbo and Frodo, and the way in which that worked to ultimate good that the hobbits never imagined. Tolkien helps me to keep a sense of perspective; a knowledge that my daily struggles and triumphs are part of a larger picture that may not become clear to me for a long time, or never on this earth. But as long as I persevere and keep the faith to my best ability, the great Playwright will work all ends for good.
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:07 PM   #19
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White Tree

Since we're sharing, I thought I'd throw in my two cents. Hopefully it doesn't take us too far off topic.

I think it's great how although people come to Tolkien's works with different perspectives and worldviews, we all get something meaningful out of them. A writer's worldview can inform their storytelling without being overt about it, which makes it relatable to different groups/types of people. I don't care much for allegory myself -- high school studies of Orwell beat that thoroughly out of me -- and I don't think I would enjoy Tolkien's works nearly as much if his Catholicism was clearly front and center, because I don't share those beliefs. (And I don't think the writing would have been nearly as good. Take, for example, Pullman's His Dark Materials books -- while I share the author's atheism and generally like the plot, the writing is not what you would call subtle. )

Being nonreligious, I find inspiration in other things, including literature. The melancholic yet, at the end of the day, optimistic tone in LotR fits my attitudes about the world. "Above all shadows rides the Sun, and Stars forever dwell..."
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