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Old 05-25-2003, 03:26 PM   #1
Templeton
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Question Dwarf Runes Punctuation

Hi. I'm very interested in the dwarf runes used in The Hobbit, and I was wondering how punctuation differs. A single dot seems to equal a comma, and two dots seem to represent a period. But that eliminates a lot of other possible punctuations such as question marks and colons . . .
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Old 05-25-2003, 07:19 PM   #2
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Well as I look in my LoTR appendices, I don't see any symbols for puncuation in the Angerthas (Dwarvish Runes).
However, I know that when using the Tengwar to write, a period is represented by two dots (a colon of sorts) and a comma is represented by one dot (like our common period). There are some other punctuations for exclamation marks and queries, but as to colons and semicolons, there are no accepted ones to my knowledge. I just don't think that they were worked in to his (Tolkien's)alphabets or that with the styles of writing presented, they weren't really needed.
I of course could be wrong as I am no authority on the subject. But I am interested in where you found puctuation for the Angerthas... I think I'm gonna have to check for myself at my fav. sites as well.
Thanks for the intrigue, and welcome to the Downs. I hope you're enjoying your death (just a way we refer to ourselves at the Downs - being dead, that is)!
~Scott
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Ok, I just went to www.omniglot.com and I found a page on writing with the Angerthas (or Cirth). This site does say that words are to be sepaated by dots, but doesn't say anything about double-dot action.
Hope this helps a bit.

[ May 25, 2003: Message edited by: Scott ]
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Old 05-26-2003, 05:04 AM   #3
the guy who be short
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in the appendices there is a question mark in the angerthas. have a look
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Old 05-27-2003, 03:12 AM   #4
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Templeton asked about the runes in The Hobbit.
They're not the Angerthas runes.
In The Hobbit Tolkien used the runes that were used in North-west Europe before the introduction of the Latin script.

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Old 05-27-2003, 04:08 PM   #5
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The Guy Who be Short,
I think I might have a different edition of the appendices than you, my copy doesn't show any punctuation.

And Selmo,
I wasn't aware that they were two different scripts. I know that Tolkien's Angerthas (or Cirth) were supposed to be different from the other european runes they resembled (at least in "The Lord of the Rings"), but I wasn't aware that the ones in "The Hobbit" were any different.

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Old 05-28-2003, 02:42 AM   #6
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At the begining of my edition of The Hobbit there's a note by Tolkien explaining that he has used Anglo-Saxon runes on the Dwarves treasure map.

The runes are the same shapes as those in Lord of the Rings but they have completely different sound values.

An internet search for Futharc runes should give all the details.
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Old 06-01-2003, 02:31 PM   #7
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In the angerthas, i think 1 dot is the end of a word and 4 is the end of a sentence. Hope that helps.
I didnt say there was punctuation in my appendices, i said a question mark. Theres also a rune for the word "and".
As for commas, Ive looked around a bit, and i think that they just ignored them in Angerthas. As in, they didnt put them in, and a complex sentence flowed like a simple one.
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Old 06-02-2003, 10:33 AM   #8
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It seemed inappropriate to start another thread when we already have one on runes (even if they are different runes).
Can anybody tell me how to pronounce the strange runes? like o with two dots over it, or e underlined?
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Old 06-04-2003, 02:40 PM   #9
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Don't know what good it could be but I know Viking runes and to write some words in 'em but not that pronunciation thing . [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]
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