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Old 08-03-2004, 01:07 PM   #1
Hookbill the Goomba
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Hookbill the Goomba is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Hookbill the Goomba is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Hookbill the Goomba is lost in the dark paths of Moria.Hookbill the Goomba is lost in the dark paths of Moria.
Dark-Eye The dangers of Ring making

I was kind of confused by a few things when re-reading "The shadow of the past" in LortR and "Of the third age" in Silm. Did Sauron see the danger in making the ring? It was quite foolish of him to allow such a thing to hold so much of his power.
Did he know that if it were destroyed that he would be left as a wandering sprit with no power or ability to take shape?
Gandalf says that the thought would not enter into his wildest thoughts that they would seek to destroy the thing. Sauron, being a Miar spirit, will have known of Olorin being famously the wisest of the miar, If sauron knew that he had come to Middle earth he would know that he would have wisdom enough to counsel others to destroy the ring.
He surly would have known about him, if not after rescuing Thrain from his dungeons in his time as the necromancer, but surly after the white council threw him out of Mirkwood.

When Sauron was concocting this plan for world domination did he not think it was a bit silly to create something with so much of his power inside of it. It seems that the ring becomes of less importance to him as he grows in strength, in "The shadow of the past" Gandalf says that all of sauron's thought is "bent" on the ring. However, Sauron seems more interested in the war towards the end of the Return of the King. I think this is most apparent in the way that he orders the ring wrathes to stop searching for it and lead out the troops instead.

I guess what my question in simple terms is "What was Sauron thinking? What thought poses lead up to him saying 'Yes, I'll make a ring that, if destroyed, will render me completely defeated.' and why did he make it if these dangers were around? Surly he was not that blinded by Melko!"

My apologies if this has already been discussed elsewhere, I ask it because I can't find any answers anywhere, as I was asked this by a sibling and could give no answer.
I think that if you want facts, then The Downer Newspaper is probably the place to go. I know! I read it once.
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Last edited by Hookbill the Goomba; 08-03-2004 at 01:09 PM. Reason: Title
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Old 08-03-2004, 01:23 PM   #2
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Well think about it He needed the nazgul defending him and he would have plenty of time to find the ring if he destroyed the world of men plus he Gandalf would come to the frontline which meant one of his most powerful adversaries would be right there he also knew Saruman was seeking the ring he would Saruman find it for him then take it back
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Old 08-03-2004, 01:23 PM   #3
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I think the key is that Sauron never thought that somebody would destroy the Ring. Even more than that, when one is making something they are not usually thinking too much about the consequences if the thing is destroyed. I believe that this is something that did not even enter into Sauron’s thinking until the Last Alliance.

I also happen to belong to the school of thought that says Sauron did not entirely understand all the possibilities of the Ring. He knew what he wanted it to do and what it did. However, this does not mean that he understood all the possible consequences of his actions.

(the phantom should be appearing in this thread shortly.)

So, my answer to your question is that he did not even think of that at all.
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Old 08-03-2004, 02:16 PM   #4
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Did Sauron really know Gandalf was Olórin? I somewhat doubt it. He may have known Saruman was Curumo but that would be all,concerning the identity of the Istari.
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Old 08-03-2004, 06:31 PM   #5
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I can understand why Sauron would never have even considered that his enemies might try to destroy the Ring. Sauron was nothing if not power-hungry, and the insanely power-hungry often can't even comprehend the idea of not seeking power. So, in a way, Sauron saw Gandalf, Denethor, Saruman, Aragorn, and all those who were wrapped up in the Ring mess as rivals for his power. I'm too lazy right now to find the actual quote, but at one point Gandalf explains that Sauron thinks the new Bearer would use the Ring to throw him (Sauron) down and put themselves in his place; Sauron can't even imagine that they might try to throw him down and put no one in his place. I guess he sees everyone in Middle-earth as potential mini-Saurons.
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Old 08-03-2004, 08:04 PM   #6
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The following quote of Gandalf's, at the White Council, tells us that even though Sauron poured much of his power into the ring...he still was very strong.

"It is not needed that the Ring should be found, for while it abides on earth and is not unmade, still the power that it holds will live, and Sauron will grow and have hope. The might of the Elves and the Elf-friends is less now than of old. Soon he will be too strong for you, even without the Great Ring; for he rules the Nine, and of the Seven he has recovered three.
But, he desired complete power and therefore wanted and needed the Ring for that.

Also from the Silmarillion:
Now the Elves made many rings; but secretly Sauron made One Ring to rule all the others, and their power was bound up with it, to be subject wholly to it and to last only so long as it too should last. And much of the strength and will of Sauron passed into that One Ring; for the power of the Elven-rings was very great, and that which should govern them must be a thing of surpassing potency...
The elves then saved only three of their rings, the most powerful: Narya, Nenya and Vilya. But they didn't use them while Sauron had the One Ring. The power of all the rings was bound up into the One Ring, and Sauron never dreamed that anyone would voluntarily give up that power. So, I am sure that he felt safe in making it. However, when the last three hold-outs (ring-bearers Gandalf, Elrond and Galadriel) all resisted the opportunity of possessing the One Ring (thus voluntarily relinguishing the power of their respective rings) the stage was set for the destroying of the One Ring. Sauron couldn't see the danger of being destroyed by the destruction of the Ring because he never even contemplated the possibility of someone giving up the power they held.
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