T-I-G LVI: Panic at the Prancing Pony

[Beregond]

As I'm reading: can someone, please, explain what a cobbler is (besides a shoemaker)? I searched the forums: no luck (used too many times without explanation), and I've searched Google without luck as well. I should have asked earlier when I first heard the term, but then I assumed it was a synonym for Bill Ferney's role.

Hi, Legate! I'm almost glad you've gone to bed, your posts are so long (but good, of course).

[Rikae]

Rune: Well, to be blunt, I've seen Nogrod come up with some pretty far-fetched, paranoid conspiracy theories before. It's almost a trademark of his. I've been at the receiving end of them more than once (and yes, as an innocent).

Nogrod has a well-deserved reputation as a legendary player, but he does have this particular weakness.

Anyway, I don't base my assessment of a theory on the reputation of the player who comes up with it.

Berry: A cobbler is a player who is an ordo in all respects, except that xe wants the baddies to win. Ferny is a cobbler with the added ability to send suggestions to the wraiths.

[Beregond]

Thank you, Rikae.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Rune: Well, to be blunt, I've seen Nogrod come up with some pretty far-fetched, paranoid conspiracy theories before. It's almost a trademark of his. I've been at the receiving end of them more than once (and yes, as an innocent).

Nogrod has a well-deserved reputation as a legendary player, but he does have this particular weakness.

Anyway, I don't base my assessment of a theory on the reputation of the player who comes up with it.

Yes, experienced players can come up with far-fetched cospiracys (and often do), so why do you think that Fea's vote for Durelin was an attempt to get a following of newbies?

[Rikae]

Ok, it occurs to me I'm basing a lot of my reasoning on things that not everybody knows, so I'll try to list them all.

First of all, Durelin has played ranger characters before. If I recall correctly, she used to have a ranger avatar, too. She is also a good player who would not go on failing to contribute without RL reasons (and, as a baddie, is too good a player to attempt coasting by that way, either).

Jokes where people make one of the roles their occupation are pretty standard and have certainly been made by ordos before, many times.

Nogrod is a very experienced player and knows all the above perfectly well. However, he's been known to come up with illogical, far-fetched theories against innocents (while innocent) on many an occasion.

Fea is also a very experienced player who knows the above perfectly well. She is also not prone to misleading herself like Nog is. If Fea behaves illogically, there is a reason for it - either she is innocent and it's part of a plot for the village's benefit, or she's evil.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

Yes, experienced players can come up with far-fetched cospiracys (and often do), so why do you think that Fea's vote for Durelin was an attempt to get a following of newbies?

a) Three newbies had yet to vote.
b) Most experienced players would know better. Fea is absolutely one of those.

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Rikae

a) Three newbies had yet to vote.

Personally, I don't like voting before the last hour or so before deadline. At the moment, it's a little less than 5 hours away and I'd much rather wait a while and see what happens before making an ill-conceived vote. Although maybe I will vote now so I won't be accused of bandwagon jumping.

Lari requests that I point out that she agrees and is currently rolling on the floor giggling hysterically like a little girl during a break from watching Twilight. Apparently it's so terrible it's hilarious.

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Mira

At the moment, it's a little less than 5 hours away and I'd much rather wait a while and see what happens before making an ill-conceived vote.

So you'd rather make an ill-conceived vote later?

Really, I don't have any problem with last-minute voting in general.
It's just part o my reason for thinking Fea's sudden agreement with Nogrod was calculated to win support before the last-minute voters could think the better of it (or be advised against it by more experienced players).

By the way, with retractable votes, you don't have to worry about it so much.

[Nerwen]

Okay. I have finished reading the thread.

I will probably vote for Fea. I wanted to see what she had to say for herself, but she doesn't look any better today. Unfortunately she seems more likely to be Ferny than a wraith. I put forward the idea that she was a wraith acting like a cobbler earlier, but her unwillingness (see #450) to suspect any of the other Durelin-voters makes her look like a cobbler who isn't sure who the other baddies are. I still think it would be best to get rid of her, though.

As for why the wraiths would expose an evil Fea by killing Nogrod: they would if they thought he was the Ranger. It seems pretty obvious to me.

EDIT:X'd with Rikae, Mira, Rikae.

[Mirandir]

Things that make Rune look suspicious in my opinion:

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

I have no really good explanation for voting Durlein other than she seem slightly off. . .and that I really want to keep fea in the game.

Why? I understand wanting to keep someone around for the sake of entertainment (and we all know that Fea is an excellent source of that ) but it seems like a silly reason to not vote for someone if you have actual suspicions towards them. Now, this is not saying that he had suspicions towards her, just that it's a silly reason to vote someone else.

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

plus fea supportet me on my day 1 vote, I would be a "skarn" (danish word) not to support her today.

This seems like a very newbie-ish move to me. Yes, I understand feeling a certain sense of loyalty to someone because they agreed with you. However, that is hardly an adequate reason to support them on their next Day vote. It makes it seem like you are unable to come up with justification of your own as to why someone should be killed, or that you are in an ill-hidden alliance. If the latter is the case, however, one would think that he would do a better job of at least attempting to hide it.

Things not about Rune:

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Mirandir and Lari - synchronised werewolfing? They both make a list shortly before things get rolling, and neither suspects Durelin. They both defend Fea, they both change their minds on Durelin, they both make a very similar vote post. It is inconceivable that this was planned, so not both of them are wraiths. A wraith-cobbler combo is possible.

If Lari and I were both wolves (wraiths, whatever), do you really think that we would make it so obvious? Given, we are both friends with Fea in RL. However, part of the reason why we are friends has to do with how alike we think. Just because we justify something that Fea says does not mean that we are defending her - or are aligned in any way with each other - but rather that we have the same or similar thought processes.

Originally Posted by Rikae

So you'd rather make an ill-conceived vote later?

Precisely.

[Macalaure]

Originally Posted by Legate

And one note about Mac. He is suspicious also by his... politeness, yea, that's the word. He is being so nice to everybody.

*shrug*

Originally Posted by Legate

Oh Mac, there will be peace... when you hang from a gibbet at your window for the sport of your own crows.

Is that a challenge? Which one of us can get the other lynched first? I accept!

Of course, looking at the current overall suspicions, you have a bit of an advantage. But that’s ok. I want you to have a fair chance.




Alright, seriously. Right now, I think Legate is innocent, and heavily misled. Considering how he is after me toDay, I guess I will have to have a closer look at him, too, but not toDay. Whether I will change my mind then, I cannot say, of course. We’ll see. Right now, Legate, please remember that you are liable to get a certain idea of somebody’s guilt and then interpret everything so that it fits this idea. We all know that almost everything can be interpreted to look evil. It’s our objectivity and common sense that tells us whether that evilness is likely or not. To me, it is evident that you have lost yours concerning me (unless, of course, you’re evil yourself).

Originally Posted by Mirandir

If Lari and I were both wolves (wraiths, whatever), do you really think that we would make it so obvious?

Umm, no? That’s exactly what I was saying in the lines you quoted...


I’m sick and therefore won’t stay up until the deadline. I’m happy that at last I don’t seem to be one of the prime candidates (though some seem to consider voting me, and seeing the size of the Fea-saving-fraction, I’m still a little uncomfortable). My prime suspect right now is Lari, but I’ll make up my mind again before I vote.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Mirandir

Things that make Rune look suspicious in my opinion:



Why? I understand wanting to keep someone around for the sake of entertainment (and we all know that Fea is an excellent source of that ) but it seems like a silly reason to not vote for someone if you have actual suspicions towards them. Now, this is not saying that he had suspicions towards her, just that it's a silly reason to vote someone else.

Is this it? is this all you can conjure Mirandir?
First you understand it and then it is silly, please decide. . .
I guess what you are saying is that I should not have voted at all! That would have been a bad choice, a more or less random vote is still better than no vote.

Originally Posted by Mirandir

This seems like a very newbie-ish move to me. Yes, I understand feeling a certain sense of loyalty to someone because they agreed with you. However, that is hardly an adequate reason to support them on their next Day vote. It makes it seem like you are unable to come up with justification of your own as to why someone should be killed, or that you are in an ill-hidden alliance. If the latter is the case, however, one would think that he would do a better job of at least attempting to hide it.

no, it is not an adequate reason. . .

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

++Macalaure

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

I put forward the idea that she was a wraith acting like a cobbler earlier, but her unwillingness (see #450) to suspect any of the other Durelin-voters makes her look like a cobbler who isn't sure who the other baddies are.

What? Did I ever say I was unwilling to suspect any of the other Durelin-voters?

*searches out #450*

*reads #450*

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I do not remember ever saying I was unwilling to suspect any of the other Durelin voters. I did say that I thought Rune was innocent.

I don't recall saying anything to that regard about others.

So... what are you talking about?

[Brinniel]

Sally: I found her suspicious yesterDay for her echoing suspicions and playing it safe, and my opinions haven't changed. What's worse is that she was hardly around to contribute yesterDay and hasn't even shown up yet toDay. I understand some of it could be due to RL reasons, but it'd also be very easy for a wraith to avoid the spotlight by keeping quiet and not having any part of the voting fiasco that was yesterDay.

Fea: Looks to be a cobbler or wraith, though more likely the former. I cannot see in any way how her actions yesterDay could have good intentions behind it. Either way, she's too risky to keep alive another Day.

Lariren: The problem I have with her is that her defenses seem shoddy. For one thing, there should've been more to go on than IC posting by the end of Day 2...a lot had happened by then. She says she decided to vote Dury right before Fea did, yet why did it take nearly 25 minutes to post that vote? Also, I don't see why she's so worried about being the possible runner-up against Fea in votes. While plenty of people are talking about her, several others are being talked about too. There's no indication yet that she's going to receive votes, so why so concerned?

Mirandir: Her defenses look more honest than Lari's, but I'd like to hear some further explanation for her vote.

Lommy: While I agree with her suspicion on Sally, I do disagree with how she comes to some conclusions. For one thing, I don't like how many of her opinions of players are based on feeling alone. I don't care for her distrust in me, but then again I honestly can't blame her after I deceived her in the last game she played. Yet even though I do disagree with her on some things, her intentions do look sincere and I believe she is most probably innocent.

Legate: The tone he gives off in his posts feels innocentish, yet at the same time I don't like how he so quickly concludes that Mac must be a wraith and Fea must be a cobbler and leaves almost no room for any other option.

Rikae: Seems so certain that Fea must be a cobbler (though she leaves open the possibility of her being a wraith too). Well I do agree with her, yet she seems so forceful about it, it's almost frightening. I wouldn't eliminate the possibility of a wraith pushing for the lynching of a fellow baddie if it makes her look better.

Aganzir: I'm still not sure about her. I'm slightly leaning towards innocent, as some of her posts do look honest. But at the same time, I'd rather not cast her aside because I know how slick of a wolf she can be.

Beregond: I think he managed to remain fairly sensible compared to others during the voting frenzy. Granted he did vote late, but only by a minute. He has newbieish behaviour, but at the same time he is quite reasonable. Of course, it's possible he's a wraith using newbieness to his advantage, but as of now I see no evidence pointing towards that direction.

Nerwen: I still find her voting on Day 1 suspicious. I don't like that she abstained from voting yesterDay, but she had a good reason for it and she did state she wouldn't vote hours before the deadline. She seems more reasonable toDay, yet careful. I'm still not willing to completely trust her.

Rune: I actually find him the most innocent of Durelin voters. I disapprove of his vote and his reasons behind it, but I don't think he had evil intentions. I think his defense of Fea looks more like someone who likes her as a player and wanted to keep her around for amusement. Not that it's any sort of good reasoning, but I somehow doubt an evil Rune would be so bold to defend her. Plus his judgment was impaired, though that's not a good excuse either. But I think the lesson here is don't drink and vote.

Mac: Spends a lot of time defending and trying to save himself, though one can hardly blame him considering he has been a lynch candidate for two Days now. I'm actually not sure why so many suspect him; I find him to be one of the more reasonable players and his posts look honest to me. I'd say he seems more innocent than guilty.

Menel: Is the submarine of the game. The few posts he has made don't look all that suspicious, however I would like to keep a watch on him.

Greenie: I feel slightly better about her than I did yesterDay, but I still don't trust her.

Suspicious
Fea
Sally
Lari

Slightly Suspicious
Nerwen
Greenie

Watching
Legate
Rikae
Menel

Could Be Anything
Mirandir
Aganzir
Beregond

Innocent
Lommy
Rune
Mac

[satansaloser2005]

Never fear, I am here.

I don't suppose anyone would humor the unhelpful little college girl by posting a vote tally so far?

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

I have a question:

If I try really hard to stop doing impulsive things, can I stay alive a little longer?

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Macalaure

Umm, no? That’s exactly what I was saying in the lines you quoted...

Heh sorry. I tend to not read things all the way through. Consider it a character flaw. I definitely just read the part about it not being planned by two wraiths. Chalk that one up to trying to get a post before being forced to accompany a friend to work.

[Lariren Shadow]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

Lariren: The problem I have with her is that her defenses seem shoddy. For one thing, there should've been more to go on than IC posting by the end of Day 2...a lot had happened by then. She says she decided to vote Dury right before Fea did, yet why did it take nearly 25 minutes to post that vote? Also, I don't see why she's so worried about being the possible runner-up against Fea in votes. While plenty of people are talking about her, several others are being talked about too. There's no indication yet that she's going to receive votes, so why so concerned?

How's this for a defense of my amazing thing to post 25 minutes later: I was still reading posts and thinking. I read slow. Really really slow. So by the time I had gotten through all the posts and the refreshers and made up my mind about who to vote for, yes, it was 25 minutes later and close to the deadline and I wanted to vote before it and therefore had no reasons. I voted for Durelin the Day before and it seemed like my best option at the time(as I stated before).

Can you point to me where I said I thought I would get votes? Clearly everyone thinks I will.

And what if Fea turns out to be innocent? How does that look for me? Who then looks bad? Rune for defending her? Mac and Rikae for pointing out quickly that she could be Ferny?

So, I think I need to vote soon. And I think I really know how to vote. It probably won't be the best way, but I think its the only way I can prove I'm innocent.

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

First you understand it and then it is silly, please decide. . .
I guess what you are saying is that I should not have voted at all! That would have been a bad choice, a more or less random vote is still better than no vote.

Just because I understand something doesn't mean that I don't think it's silly. I understand why people work a million hours a week but still think it's silly. (Lame example, I know, but nothing else came to me.) And I disagree about the voting. I think that no vote is better than a random vote. If you can't come up with a valid justification for a vote, then don't make one.

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

no, it is not an adequate reason. . .

So are you agreeing that you didn't have a good reason for saving Fea and were floundering for something that sounded a tiny bit reasonable?

x-ed with Lari

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Brinniel

Mac: Spends a lot of time defending and trying to save himself, though one can hardly blame him considering he has been a lynch candidate for two Days now. I'm actually not sure why so many suspect him; I find him to be one of the more reasonable players and his posts look honest to me. I'd say he seems more innocent than guilty.

For me and Legate it seems to be the post (I think it was the first he made today) where Macalaure sumarise and analyze on the ending of Day 2. His analyze seems extremely fabricated and dishonest to say the least. It is quite interesting that me and Legate spottet this independently of each other.

I do agree that other of Macalure's posts seem innocent enough, but it is always hard knowing what to focus ones attention on.

Originally Posted by Bringer of the red dawn

I have a question:

If I try really hard to stop doing impulsive things, can I stay alive a little longer?

Priceless

EDIT: Cross posted with Mirandir and Lariren

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

I have a question:

If I try really hard to stop doing impulsive things, can I stay alive a little longer?

Maybe next game?

(Nah, in reality I'd advocate lynching you on Day 1 for being too dull. )

[Macalaure]

Sally - not sure what to make of her
Fea - I'm really not sure about her. Some things she did are hard to bring together with innocence. If I take away Nogrod's death, which could indeed have been because of suspected rangerdom, she looks pretty darn evil.
Lari - two votes with shady reasons and I just don't buy her explanations for it
Mirandir - I'm willing to have faith in her innocence for now
Lommy - innocent
Legate - innocent, for now
Rikae - innocent
Aganzir - I wanted to have a look at her toDay and she ended up slipping by me entirely. Eventually I'll get back to her
Beregond - feels more innocent
Nerwen - raises no alarms
Rune - hard nut to crack. Definitely should heed Durelin's words and relax
Menel - erm, yeah
Lily - has slipped from my attention a little, but at least nothing suspicious jumped out at me
Brinn - innocent

Originally Posted by Lari

Can you point to me where I said I thought I would get votes?

May I be of assistance?

Originally Posted by Lari

There is a high probability it will come down to her and me today and, well, I'd vote her to save myself.

Originally Posted by Lari

And what if Fea turns out to be innocent? How does that look for me? Who then looks bad?

Legate.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Lari

Can you point to me where I said I thought I would get votes?

Right here:

Why would I be happy to lynch Fea today? Same reason you would be, to not die. There is a high probability it will come down to her and me today and, well, I'd vote her to save myself.

EDIT: X-ed with Mac

[Lariren Shadow]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

plus fea supportet me on my day 1 vote, I would be a "skarn" (danish word) not to support her today.

Alright, while I keep deciding who to vote for and contemplating, I would like to say that I took a leaf out of Edward's book and googled "skarn". Which means, at least in one place, "bad boy, maker of trouble". Is this a clue to what Rune is?

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow

Alright, while I keep deciding who to vote for and contemplating, I would like to say that I took a leaf out of Edward's book and googled "skarn". Which means, at least in one place, "bad boy, maker of trouble". Is this a clue to what Rune is?

Could be, or it could be that he's Danish.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Mirandir

Just because I understand something doesn't mean that I don't think it's silly. I understand why people work a million hours a week but still think it's silly. (Lame example, I know, but nothing else came to me.) And I disagree about the voting. I think that no vote is better than a random vote. If you can't come up with a valid justification for a vote, then don't make one.

Alright, but my guess is that you will find very little backing in Bree for that view, at least not voting used to be frowned upon.

Originally Posted by Mirandir

So are you agreeing that you didn't have a good reason for saving Fea and were floundering for something that sounded a tiny bit reasonable?

No not at all. . . I stand by my reason to vote for Durelin, my reason remain that I wanted Fea around, the thing about repaying he for voting Brinn on Day 1 was just a random comment. . .random comments is kind of my thing.

It is easy enough to fabricate a reason for voting for a person, trust me, if I had been a wraith I would have made up an excuse that had to do with Durelin's posts.

Anyways it is a poor case, but it probably comes down to the fact that you have hardly played with me and thus make obvious mistakes when analyzing my actions.

Good night. . .it is late and I want sleep.

EDIT: Cross posted with everybody since Mac

[Nerwen]

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

What? Did I ever say I was unwilling to suspect any of the other Durelin-voters?

*searches out #450*

*reads #450*

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I do not remember ever saying I was unwilling to suspect any of the other Durelin voters. I did say that I thought Rune was innocent.

I don't recall saying anything to that regard about others.

So... what are you talking about?

This, Fea, is you on the subject of the Durelin-voters, all in one post.

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

I really didn't want Mac lynched in a last minute bandwagon (though I had no evidence to back that desire up)-

You tried to save Mac last night (I can't recall seeing anything to back this up, but very well). You didn't say "but toDay I've changed my mind about him" or anything like that. So I guess that would mean you still thought he was probably innocent.

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

Rune really wanted me to stay alive.

You don't say, "but he could have been manipulating me". So Rune's probably innocent.

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

Just- I'm ordo this time around

So you're innocent.

You say of either Lari or Mira (can't tell which) "No more newbie grace period. She's smart. I don't trust her. Nobody else should". But further down you say:

Originally Posted by Feanor of the Peredhil

I lean more toward manipulated newbies, for all that I didn't really intend for them to get manipulated.

So they're probably innocent.

There you go. That's all of them, apart from the late Nogrod.

EDIT: X'd since Sally at #536.
EDIT2:fixed bolding.

[Mirandir]

Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne

Anyways it is a poor case, but it probably comes down to the fact that you have hardly played with me and thus make obvious mistakes when analyzing my actions.

So what you've just said to me is that because I'm a new player and you're experienced I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about and have no ability to read into anything because I don't have a brain. That's pretty much what I'm taking away from that comment right there. I haven't played with any of the people in this game before and none of them have had the gall to essentially tell me that I have no idea what I'm doing. I take extreme offense to that.

I'm going to take some time and calm down and perhaps actually do some homework before I post anything else that I might regret.

[Rikae]

Rune, since you're around, care to answer a question?

What made you think Fea was in such danger yesterDay and needed saving?

[Macalaure]

Rikae -> Fea
Lily -> Fea
Lommy -> Sally
Aganzir -> Fea
Legate -> Fea
Rune -> Mac

Fea 4, Sally 1, Mac 1

I definitely can live with a lynched Fea, but I suspect Lari a bit more and will vote for her.

++Lariren Shadow

I hope Rikae won't have to come and wake me up telling me that I have to retract to save myself.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Mirandir

So what you've just said to me is that because I'm a new player and you're experienced I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about and have no ability to read into anything because I don't have a brain. That's pretty much what I'm taking away from that comment right there. I haven't played with any of the people in this game before and none of them have had the gall to essentially tell me that I have no idea what I'm doing. I take extreme offense to that.

I'm going to take some time and calm down and perhaps actually do some homework before I post anything else that I might regret.

No, what I am saying is that it is a massive advantage to have played with another person before, it gives you a lot better chance of analyzing their actions. What you sugest is my resoning for voting as I did, is simply so far from how I normally play and not something I belive I would ever do. . .
Obviously you have just as much chance of getting a wraith as anybody else, but in this case I know that you are wrong.

Anyways I could also interpret your words as you saying that I am too slow to (as a wraith) think of a proper excuse for a vote and therefor comes up simple atention atracting reasons like "I like this person"

[Nerwen]

Anyway, I may as well vote

++Fea.

EDIT: I've already said why I think she's evil.

[Rune Son of Bjarne]

Originally Posted by Rikae

Rune, since you're around, care to answer a question?

What made you think Fea was in such danger yesterDay and needed saving?

As I remember it I got the impression that Nogrod's case of lynching Fea was gaining support, then I simply voted for the one I thought had the better chance of getting Lynched (It stood between Mac and Durelin)

Seriously, I want to go to bed now!

EDIT: Cross posted with Nerwen

[Meneltarmacil]

YIKES! I totally forgot about the game going on until now!

OK, my suspicions and probable innocents:

Not suspicious:
Aganzir and Brinn from what I said before.
Legate, who seems to be pretty helpful and level-headed and whose reasoning I can agree with.

Suspicious:
Mac and Fea, the former for his confusing Ferny statement and role in Gollum's Day 1 lynch and the latter for reasons that are obvious to everyone.
Rikae, to a much lesser extent due to the Seer comments.

I really can't decide between Mac and Fea right now, but I will vote for someone within the next 30 minutes. Do your best to sway me until then. I'll be over at the Pony getting drunk.

[Nerwen]

I see Mac has posted another of his "everyone in this village is just lovely" lists, with the exception of the obviously doomed Fea and of Lariren Shadow, also under heavy suspicion.

I thought it would be interesting to see who Mac votes for when he's not simply trying to save his own skin. It turns out to be Lari. I need to think this out.

EDIT: X'd with Menel.

[Feanor of the Peredhil]

Originally Posted by Nerwen

You tried to save Mac last night (I can't recall seeing anything to back this up, but very well). You didn't say "but toDay I've changed my mind about him" or anything like that. So I guess that would mean you still thought he was probably innocent.

I haven't changed my mind about him. I still don't support the lynching of Mac. So the guy I've been trying to keep around all game, I'm still hoping to keep around. Okay... I'm with you so far...

You don't say, "but he could have been manipulating me". So Rune's probably innocent.

I said I thought he was probably innocent. Not that I was against suspecting him. Based on personal experience, I simply think Rune wants to keep me around.

So you're innocent.

I know quite well I'm innocent.

You say of either Lari or Mira (can't tell which) "No more newbie grace period. She's smart. I don't trust her. Nobody else should".

That was about Miri, but holds true for Lari as well. Grace period over. They're initiated. If suspected, they shouldn't be treated lightly. This is a blanket statement which has pretty much nothing to do with Durelin. A simple comment of "it's been long enough; they can be held accountable now."

So they're probably innocent.

Probably/maybe/who knows. I suggested that they followed along because they're new and had nothing better to go on, so figured there was no harm in joining the vote. I did not intend to suggest that being new made them innocent, or that I wasn't willing to assume they had malicious intentions.

There you go. That's all of them, apart from the late Nogrod.

So basically what you're trying to argue is that saying I see nothing wrong with people agreeing me means that I think everybody who agrees with me is innocent?

I'm not going to suspect people for sharing my inclinations.

If you're expecting me to start finger-pointing, you've got a long wait. I have no evidence. I'm ordinary. I have nothing to go on but gut instinct. I've got to make votes, but they are all qualified by the fact that the only information available to me is the thoughts I have and the words others speak.

Of those who voted Durelin with me, I think Lari is an ordo, I think Miri is either an ordo or a sneaky wraith (but I lean more toward ordo based on the care with which she constructs her posts and the way she reacts to Nights); I think Rune wouldn't follow me as loyally as a puppy if he had something to hide, though I can't guarantee that without knowing his role; I think Mac could be anything, because I've seen him first hand in several roles, and I'm done trying to protect him. Hopefully the fervor for his demise has faded, because I think he's useful to keep around. As for Nog? Rest in peace, old buddy. We know he was innocent.

Originally Posted by Rikae

What made you think Fea was in such danger yesterDay and needed saving?

Totally fair question. I await an answer, if you haven't gone to bed yet, Rune. Because up until people started noticing Nog's comment, I took it as a joke. Hence my teasing/flirty "Stop that!"

Originally Posted by Rune

As I remember it I got the impression that Nogrod's case of lynching Fea was gaining support, then I simply voted for the one I thought had the better chance of getting Lynched (It stood between Mac and Durelin)

Ah.

Still... I'm not at all sure people took Nog seriously until you came to my 'rescue'... I took Mirandir's enthusiastic response as a joke at my expense, and I don't particularly remember who else was 'supporting' the idea.

I know I wasn't concerned about my own wellbeing at that moment, though. I was too busy trying to kill Durelin. Honestly, I swear I was just trying to figure out how anybody innocent could keep posting in character when what the village was looking for was some sort of substance or personal thought.

Ugh... I don't want to have to vote for somebody I don't suspect or barely suspect in order to try to save myself.

At the risk of reminding everybody of last night's fiasco, anybody with me on wanting to lynch Rikae to find out what the seer thing was about yesterday?

Then again, I'm more enthusiastic about lynching Legate because he's claiming such certainty about my role when I know perfectly well that certainty of my role necessitates his statements about me being blatant lies. Either he's lying or he's just really, really confidently wrong.

[Brinniel]

Originally Posted by Fea

Honestly, I swear I was just trying to figure out how anybody innocent could keep posting in character when what the village was looking for was some sort of substance or personal thought.

But you see, the difference between her IC posts and the IC banter on Day 1 is that I think it did provide some personal thought, even if subtly. I find IC posting typical of Durelin; it's a style she's comfortable with. However, it apparently makes everyone else uncomfortable for some reason. IC posting shouldn't always be considered suspicious, and it is possible to provide substance in an IC post. After all, some WW games are played out entirely in character.

[Mirandir]

I am going to bed. Tired to the point of not being able to stay up for another 2 hours for deadline. That being said, my vote is for Rune for the reasons stated above. I don't have the energy to come up with any more attacks.

++Rune

[Meneltarmacil]

OK, I'll vote. And since I'm still undecided, I'm actually going to roll a d20 to figure this out. 1-10 and my vote goes to Mac. 11-20, and it's Fea who gets it.

2.

++Macalaure