Whats with the 3 rings - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

rudeboy · 07-21-2003, 09:33 AM

When Sauron forged the One ring, the Elves perceived his plan, because they were wearing their 3 rings, which Sauron didn't know about. So Sauron couldn't control them! Now in the war of the ring, why is it that if Sauron (The Great) recovered the one he would be able to control them all again even the 3? What has changed, why cant the elves hide them again?

Lord of Angmar · 07-21-2003, 10:33 AM

I don't think it is implied that Sauron would have control over the bearers of the Three Rings, but rather that if he gained back the One Ring then the powers of the Three would be rendered at naught.

rudeboy · 07-21-2003, 11:04 AM

No in FotR, Chpt 'shadow of the past', Gandalf says to Frodo, that "He will control them all again even the 3 wherever they be" So he will control them, but why couldn't he control them before, or why cant the elves take thm off and hide them again?

Horse-Maiden of the Shire · 07-21-2003, 04:29 PM

He couldn't control them before because he didn't have a hand in making them, whereas with the Nine and Seven he did. And the Elves couldn't hide them because he knew who had them and where they were.

And welcome to the Downs, rudeboy! Enjoy being dead.

Olorin · 07-21-2003, 06:58 PM

I agree with Horse-Maiden of the Shire, before, he didn't know about them (where they were, who had them), but after so long he learned where and who had them hence allowing him to control him. Of course, this is pure speculation. If any one has any hard evidence, I would be pleased to hear it! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

Frodo2968thewhite · 07-22-2003, 02:17 PM

The 3 Rings were already forged, and Sauron wanted them (so he DID know they existed), so he created the One Ring!

Lyta_Underhill · 07-22-2003, 08:22 PM

Sauron knew of the Three Rings and demanded them back, laying waste to Eregion in his attempt to get them (even killing poor Celebrimbor and using his body as a standard! An ignoble end for the last descendant of Fëanor...I won't go there!). The Elves hid them and did not use them while Sauron retained the Ruling Ring. They were unsullied (would not corrupt their wearers-my note here), having been made by Celebrimbor without Sauron's influence, and yet they were subject to the One Ring. When Sauron lost the One Ring, the Elves could use their 3 Rings, but if Sauron regained the One Ring while the Elves wore the 3, Sauron would instantly be aware of them. His Ring rules them all, after all!

I have often wondered if this is why Frodo can hear Gandalf's voice on Amon Hen when he is wearing the Ring. "Take off the Ring, fool!" The info about the 3 Rings I posted above is from "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age" section of my copy of the Silmarillion. Hope this helps!

Cheers,
Lyta

07-21-2003, 09:33 AM	#1
rudeboy Animated Skeleton Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Flitwick, Beds Posts: 47	Whats with the 3 rings When Sauron forged the One ring, the Elves perceived his plan, because they were wearing their 3 rings, which Sauron didn't know about. So Sauron couldn't control them! Now in the war of the ring, why is it that if Sauron (The Great) recovered the one he would be able to control them all again even the 3? What has changed, why cant the elves hide them again?

07-21-2003, 10:33 AM	#2
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	I don't think it is implied that Sauron would have control over the bearers of the Three Rings, but rather that if he gained back the One Ring then the powers of the Three would be rendered at naught. __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

07-21-2003, 04:29 PM	#4
Horse-Maiden of the Shire Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Chillaxin' with Glorfindel-441 miles on the RtR Posts: 1,198	He couldn't control them before because he didn't have a hand in making them, whereas with the Nine and Seven he did. And the Elves couldn't hide them because he knew who had them and where they were. And welcome to the Downs, rudeboy! Enjoy being dead. __________________ "There's a big...machine in the sky...some kind of electric snake...coming straight at us." "Shoot it," said my attorney. "Not yet...I want to study its habits."

07-21-2003, 06:58 PM	#5
Olorin Wight Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Where the sun sails and the moon walks. Posts: 155	I agree with Horse-Maiden of the Shire, before, he didn't know about them (where they were, who had them), but after so long he learned where and who had them hence allowing him to control him. Of course, this is pure speculation. If any one has any hard evidence, I would be pleased to hear it! [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] __________________ Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then don't be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.

07-22-2003, 02:17 PM	#6
Frodo2968thewhite Haunting Spirit Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Shire Posts: 95	The 3 Rings were already forged, and Sauron wanted them (so he DID know they existed), so he created the One Ring! __________________ INAGURAL GOLDEN RING MARATHON, OCTOBER 20, 2005!!! FRODO LIVES!!!!

07-21-2003, 11:04 AM	#3
rudeboy Animated Skeleton Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Flitwick, Beds Posts: 47	No in FotR, Chpt 'shadow of the past', Gandalf says to Frodo, that "He will control them all again even the 3 wherever they be" So he will control them, but why couldn't he control them before, or why cant the elves take thm off and hide them again?

07-22-2003, 08:22 PM	#7
Lyta_Underhill Haunted Halfling Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: an uncounted length of steps--floating between air molecules Posts: 844	Sauron knew of the Three Rings and demanded them back, laying waste to Eregion in his attempt to get them (even killing poor Celebrimbor and using his body as a standard! An ignoble end for the last descendant of Fëanor...I won't go there!). The Elves hid them and did not use them while Sauron retained the Ruling Ring. They were unsullied (would not corrupt their wearers-my note here), having been made by Celebrimbor without Sauron's influence, and yet they were subject to the One Ring. When Sauron lost the One Ring, the Elves could use their 3 Rings, but if Sauron regained the One Ring while the Elves wore the 3, Sauron would instantly be aware of them. His Ring rules them all, after all! I have often wondered if this is why Frodo can hear Gandalf's voice on Amon Hen when he is wearing the Ring. "Take off the Ring, fool!" The info about the 3 Rings I posted above is from "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age" section of my copy of the Silmarillion. Hope this helps! Cheers, Lyta __________________ “…she laid herself to rest upon Cerin Amroth; and there is her green grave, until the world is changed, and all the days of her life are utterly forgotten by men that come after, and elanor and niphredil bloom no more east of the Sea.”