Which Female Valar is your favorite?

[littlemanpoet]

Sorry for the inconvenience, I am hoping to have this one closed very soon.

Since there are so many Valar, it is necessary to separate them out in some way, so I have chosen to do so by gender and primacy. Please see the "brother thread" to this one for primary Male Valar. Perhaps I will do a poll thread on the Ainur soon.

Feel free to describe what it is that you like about your favorite Vala, and if possible, what characteristics you feel you share with him.

Sorry, you must pick one Vala for the poll. But feel free to name close seconds and thirds, etc.

[Bêthberry]

Nienna, because of her influence on Gandalf, er, Olorin.

Of course, you realise that splitting up the polls this way avoids going mano e hot tamale.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

But elempi, where have Vairë and Vána gone? Your poll is incomplete! What kind of a discrimination is that?

And whether I am not as sure with Valier as with Valar, Vána was among the possibilities of my choices, so...!!!

Otherwise I am thinking about Estë, also Yavanna because of the trees (with small "t"), Varda because of the stars, but I am not as close to them in other things.

[Macalaure]

I have to second Legate, where are Vairë and Vána?

I would choose Vairë because I somehow like that kind of melancholic air around her - weaving a tapestry of the history of Arda within the Halls of Mandos.

I might pick Niënna in her absence, but she takes melancholy a little too far.

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

So see it, elempi? And I don't want to imagine what feminists could make out of it. Why are you not mentioning all the Valier when you are mentioning all the Valar, even Tulkas who was not there originally, or Melkor, who did no longer count among them? Tsk-tsk. And now even Mac wants Vairë and I want Vána. I'm going to neg-rep you, sir!!! You call yourself a Tolkien fan?

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

So see it, elempi? And I don't want to imagine what feminists could make out of it.

Here's one feminist... but unlike some gentlemen here, I'm not going to make anything special out of it , just politely echo the posed question of why are a few of the Valier missing.

I think that whatever LMP means by "primacy" here

Originally Posted by LMP

Since there are so many Valar, it is necessary to separate them out in some way, so I have chosen to do so by gender and primacy

might have something to do with some people being dropped out, yet I would still like to ask why, and why just Vairë and Vána? Are you going to make a separate poll: which lesser Valie do you prefer, Vairë or Vána? Or what exactly had you in mind and what is this stuff about primacy?

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Here's one feminist... but unlike some gentlemen here, I'm not going to make anything special out of it , just politely echo the posed question of why are a few of the Valier missing.

*ahem* okay But still...

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

I think that whatever LMP means by "primacy" here might have something to do with some people being dropped out, yet I would still like to ask why, and why just Vairë and Vána? Are you going to make a separate poll: which lesser Valie do you prefer, Vairë or Vána? Or what exactly had you in mind and what is this stuff about primacy?

Even if the reason was this "primacy", I don't see why Vána and Vairë should be considered "lesser" than, let's say, Nessa or Estë. We are told that Yavanna, Nienna and Varda were three of the Aratar, so then I would eventually understand if elempi dropped the remaining four. But this just does not make sense. And even in that case (to continue in the "feministic rant" ), I would expect him to also drop those who are not among Aratar even between the male Valar.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Even if the reason was this "primacy", I don't see why Vána and Vairë should be considered "lesser" than, let's say, Nessa or Estë. We are told that Yavanna, Nienna and Varda were three of the Aratar, so then I would eventually understand if elempi dropped the remaining four. But this just does not make sense. And even in that case (to continue in the "feministic rant" ), I would expect him to also drop those who are not among Aratar even between the male Valar.

But if LMP was to create a separate thread for Vána and Vairë we can hardly accuse him of chauvinism, could we? Since thus he would be making more female-threads than male-threads... Useless to judge before we've heard what he has to say on the matter...

[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

But if LMP was to create a separate thread for Vána and Vairë we can hardly accuse him of chauvinism, could we? Since thus he would be making more female-threads than male-threads... Useless to judge before we've heard what he has to say on the matter...

Well, in that case he could be accused of male discrimination...

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Legate of Amon Lanc

Well, in that case he could be accused of male discrimination...

Oh no, LMP, did you ever guess what kind of trouble you got into when you dropped Vána and Vairë? Whatever you planned to do, you're discriminating people...

[littlemanpoet]

Please accept my humble apologies. My decision was based on including those whom I thought were the major Valar, and I was rushing. If there is any way to fix this, I will. Perhaps we should X this thread and start over?

[Bêthberry]

The polls are alot of fun, lmp, especially because we get to be so nitpicky in a light vein. They are not nearly so serious as those balrog wings debates and UT versus Silm versus HoMe quotation marathons. I think they demonstrate that Tolkien's mythology is an infinitely expanding universe--there's always another demi-god or goddess just around the corner who we forgot about because we are having trouble keeping Tolkien's names clear in our heads and not confusing them with their REB counterparts.

Thanks for creating the polls. I'm off now to post my utter discombobulation and bewilderment that some people would actually prefer Ulmo.

[Gwathagor]

Yes, definitely start the thread over. I need to choose Vana, since she's Orome's wife.

[Elmo]

Varda's the most beautiful...



(you can tell I'm not as deep as Belegaer)

[Lindale]

Yavanna. Earth Queen thingy. I'm not very surprised that Tolkien made her second to Varda, but I sometimes wonder why the Elves do not revere her the same way the ancients revered their earth goddesses. Maybe because the Elves are immortal?

[littlemanpoet]

Bethberry's reassurances notwithstanding, I'm going to start a brand new poll on the Female Valar, including the two I left out originally, Vána and Vairë. I'll ask Estelyn or whoever is moderator for this thread to close it. Sorry for the mess, but please let's start over. Thanks!

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Closed - for those who posted here, I'll leave the thread visible for a few days before deleting it, so that you can repost on the new thread.