The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Fun and Games > Middle-earth Mirth
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-02-2016, 03:37 PM   #241
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
- in order to set yourself up to enjoy major influence on the better method of killing (as you did, with Inzil's lynch).
That is not true.

I did not want Inzil lynched yesterday and argued against it. See Post 167 and Post 209.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 03:53 PM   #242
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Do you mean these?

Quote:
CONCLUSION FOR THE MOMENT: He might be a good lynch target…but for the time being I’d really rather not…and I will get to why in a minute.
Indeed. You said much the same about Lalaith -

Quote:
CONCLUSION: She might be a wolf. Not sure she’s the best lynch target, but she definitely might be a wolf.
- and Lommy -

Quote:
CONCLUSION: Unsure. Could well be a wolf…but might not be.
- lots of "mights" there. In fact, I think your strongest candidate was, well -

Quote:
CONCLUSION: I might be completely off base on this one. I admit that, and am certainly open to discussion and persuasion on this, but out of all the players in the game right now, I feel worst about him.
- me.

When it came down to Inzil versus Lalaith, though -

Quote:
Make no mistake about it, I do not trust Inzil. He may very well be bad and we may need to eject him.

However, of the realistic candidates on offer, I feel worse about ++Lalaith.

Sorry, Lalaith. You know I love you.
I'd almost argue you seem to have felt worse about Inzil earlier - it's a bit hard to tell, though, with all the "mights" floating around. However, at the time you quasi-voted, the votes stood thusly -

Quote:
Loslote=>Lalaith
Zil=>Lalaith
Lommy=>Inzil
Legate=>Inzil
- with Lalaith, Boro, and myself to vote. Lalaith could obviously be expected to vote for Inzil in self-preservation, and Boro abstained (eyebrow-raising; I'd have expected him to care more, I suppose). In any case, it's an interesting tie to have made; your vote kept the votes tied for as long as possible, and you made it fairly plain in your post that you'd be fine with Lalaith or Inzil. It seems disingenuous that you'd then try to use that as evidence today that you didn't want Inzil lynched.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:05 PM   #243
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
However, at the time you quasi-voted, the votes stood thusly
You are continuing with your transparent attempts to twist my words. I in no way quasi-voted. When I voted I flat out stated that I wanted Lalaith lynched yesterDAY.

There are three wolves, therefore, I am allowed to suspect more than one person at a time.

We are, however, only allowed to lynch one person at a time. So I have to make a choice about which potential candidate to support at any one time, based on factors such as the intensity of my belief in their guilt and the likelihood of my vote tipping the scales toward lynching the candidate I feel most strongly to be guilty.

For the record, a quasi-vote looks like this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
++Lottie 4 Rep

I'd go with Lommy or Boro, at this point. Outside shot at Inzil, I suppose, but the first two (mostly after Lommy's most recent spin on things I've done).
Talk about wishy-washy...

Quote:
It seems disingenuous that you'd then try to use that as evidence today that you didn't want Inzil lynched.
Inzil might have been bad...and given that we've lynched him I hope he was!

What I object to is your implication that my alleged support of lynching Inzil yesterDAY, an allegation that is not backed up by the easily examined facts, is somehow indicative of my participation in some elaborate and torturous plot to deceive the Ward and win the game as a wolf.

What I pointed out was that your assertion fell flat on its own merits.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:06 PM   #244
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
I suppose another good question would be, why would a Borowolf use his vote on the cleared innocent Lottie so early on in the day, when the game hinges on a single vote (assuming an innocent Inzil)?

Well, voting anyone but Lottie at this stage is silly. Although he did try, early on, as has been pointed out. Regardless, look at who Lottie has suspected today - Lalaith and myself, for the most part. Whereas Lommy and Kuru are basically given a pass - it's a reasonable assumption to think she'd continue going after Lalaith and I today and leave his packmates alone.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

Last edited by Shastanis Althreduin; 11-02-2016 at 04:06 PM. Reason: X'ed with Kuru
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:14 PM   #245
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
You are continuing with your transparent attempts to twist my words. I in no way quasi-voted. When I voted I flat out stated that I wanted Lalaith lynched yesterDAY.
I'm not twisting anything. You're overreacting a bit, I'm afraid. Each time I've used the phrase "quasi-vote", I've used it to mean the vote that we would cast if we were voting traditionally. In which case your "vote" for Lalaith was a "quasi-vote" - because you didn't have to adhere to it.

My own quasi-vote was in no way "wishy-washy", either - Lommy had very recently acted in a way which made me suspect her and I'd suspected Boro based purely on process of elimination. Inzil was there purely because I thought Lalaith looked better, and they were the two on the chopping block, but I specifically put him last. How is that "wishy-washy"?

Quote:
What I object to is your implication that my alleged support of lynching Inzil yesterDAY, an allegation that is not backed up by the easily examined facts, is somehow indicative of my participation in some elaborate and torturous plot to deceive the Ward and win the game as a wolf.
I think I've already pointed out that your support of Inzil's lynch was something more than "alleged". Yes, you ended up plus-plusing Lalaith, but you did so in a manner that shifted responsibility for the eventual choice entirely off of you and you made it patently clear that you were okay with either candidate.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:15 PM   #246
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Anyway, as entertaining as this is, we are reaching voting time.

Since, Heaven Knows, I wouldn't want to be accused of quasi-voting, I'd like to be able to make all my votes clearly and in one post.

As I said at the start of the DAY, I think both Shasta and Lalaith are wolves.

It seems like Lalaith is on quite a number of people's suspicion lists so can we accumulate enough votes to tell our Rep to lynch her?
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:22 PM   #247
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
I'm not twisting anything. You're overreacting a bit, I'm afraid. Each time I've used the phrase "quasi-vote", I've used it to mean the vote that we would cast if we were voting traditionally. In which case your "vote" for Lalaith was a "quasi-vote" - because you didn't have to adhere to it.
Fair enough. I interpreted that you meant the phrase as a short hand for implying that I was not being clear in who I wanted to see lynched yesterDAY.

My apologies on that.

Quote:
My own quasi-vote was in no way "wishy-washy", either - Lommy had very recently acted in a way which made me suspect her and I'd suspected Boro based purely on process of elimination. Inzil was there purely because I thought Lalaith looked better, and they were the two on the chopping block, but I specifically put him last. How is that "wishy-washy"?
It is wishy-washy because you did not state one specific preference for yesterDAY's lynch.

Again, we can only lynch one at a time and one of the first things I said in this game is that...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuruharan View Post
2) We cannot trust the intentions of the representative! This is a vital point to establish. The Ward must make clear to the representative the appropriate target selection. The only way to hold the representative accountable is if the target is clear and then punish them if they deviate from the Ward's will.
I was adhering to my own principles.

Quote:
I think I've already pointed out that your support of Inzil's lynch was something more than "alleged". Yes, you ended up plus-plusing Lalaith, but you did so in a manner that shifted responsibility for the eventual choice entirely off of you and you made it patently clear that you were okay with either candidate.
No. That's just a lie. I wanted Lalaith lynched, still do, in fact. I voted that way.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:23 PM   #248
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
"Quite a number"? That's stretching things just a tad, don't you think? Lottie has said she suspects Lal, that's true, and Lal shows up on Legate's list as well... but Legate has said he thinks Boro a more likely wolf, Lommy doesn't appear to suspect Lalaith much at all and seemed to come down on the side of suspecting Boro (distancing, in my own opinion, but based purely on what's been said today...), and I think my feelings on Boro vs. Lalaith are pretty clear at this point.

So why you'd continue to push Lalaith over Boro when the facts clearly show that more people suspect Boro escapes me.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

Last edited by Shastanis Althreduin; 11-02-2016 at 04:24 PM. Reason: X'ed with Kuru x1
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:24 PM   #249
Loslote
The Werewolf's Companion
 
Loslote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enceladus
Posts: 2,581
Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Send a message via Yahoo to Loslote Send a message via Skype™ to Loslote
Shasta, I disagree so strongly with your interpretations of what's been going on that it's almost like we're playing totally different games.

I do think the wolves *need* to attack at least one of Legate or Kuru toDay, simply because of the way the numbers currently stand. If all three of Legate, Kuru, and I are out of the running for the lynch toDay, then that leaves only four people - Lommy, Lalaith, Boro, and Shasta. We have between three and two wolves in those four people, depending on Zil's alignment. The chances of us hitting a wolf are really very good so long as we stick to only these four people. If we suddenly expand that to include Legate and Kuru, then our chances go way down. So I'm very suspicious of the people trying to cast suspicion on either of those two - yesterDay it was mostly on Legate, toDay it seems to mostly be on Kuru, but both Days the suspicion was flaky and unsubstantiated.

I feel much worse about Shasta following his attacks on Kuru and Boro toDay, both because of the potential motivation behind the attacks and the manner of the attacks themselves. He seemed almost desperate to swing the momentum back against Kuru, and kept picking at little things like why Boro didn't vote yesterDay (which made sense to me, he didn't have enough time to read through properly and didn't think he had a good idea of who might be guilty yet) or why Kuru didn't want to lynch Boro toDay despite suspecting him (again, makes perfect sense, we have targets that deserve higher lynching priority). I would put Shasta at the top of my list toDay.

Edit: xed since Shasta's #244
__________________
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night.
Double Fenris
Loslote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:27 PM   #250
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
It is wishy-washy because you did not state one specific preference for yesterDAY's lynch.
I believe I said I didn't have one. It'd be worse of me to push a lynch on someone I didn't think was a wolf, don't you think?

Quote:
No. That's just a lie. I wanted Lalaith lynched, still do, in fact. I voted that way.
I've already explained why that vote doesn't actually mean much other than looking good.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

Last edited by Shastanis Althreduin; 11-02-2016 at 04:27 PM. Reason: X'ed with Lottie
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:29 PM   #251
Lalaith
Blithe Spirit
 
Lalaith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,744
Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Curse this lack of lynching and lack of role reveal...it makes a person think in circles. I can't remember a game where I've suspected so many people and felt so paranoid.

I still can't keep from wondering, why did Nerwen die and not Kuru?
And why have Kuru and Legate supported each other so stalwartly throughout this game and no-one thought it odd?
Kuru, as I said before, you may be innocent in which case your bloodlust to raise a lynchmob against me is misguided - but if you are guilty you have played brilliantly.
__________________
Out went the candle, and we were left darkling

Last edited by Lalaith; 11-02-2016 at 04:33 PM. Reason: cross-post with everyone since Kuru at 10.15
Lalaith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:30 PM   #252
Loslote
The Werewolf's Companion
 
Loslote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enceladus
Posts: 2,581
Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Send a message via Yahoo to Loslote Send a message via Skype™ to Loslote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
So why you'd continue to push Lalaith over Boro when the facts clearly show that more people suspect Boro escapes me.
Yes, the idea that a thinking human being would have opinions that they would hold to under peer pressure astonishes me, too.

I still suspect Lalaith, but I would prefer Shasta if other people would be down for that.

And I'm terribly sorry that my chronic illness is depriving you of entertainment, Shasta, but don't worry - I'll be dead soon enough, and you'll have to come up with something else to do once I'm gone.

Edit: xed since my last
__________________
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night.
Double Fenris
Loslote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:31 PM   #253
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
I feel much worse about Shasta following his attacks on Kuru and Boro toDay, both because of the potential motivation behind the attacks and the manner of the attacks themselves. He seemed almost desperate to swing the momentum back against Kuru, and kept picking at little things like why Boro didn't vote yesterDay (which made sense to me, he didn't have enough time to read through properly and didn't think he had a good idea of who might be guilty yet) or why Kuru didn't want to lynch Boro toDay despite suspecting him (again, makes perfect sense, we have targets that deserve higher lynching priority). I would put Shasta at the top of my list toDay.
I was desperate, I woke up four hours before deadline!

Lottie, do me a favor here - really look at what I'm saying. We elected to no-lynch for two days in a row - is it really that far-fetched that the wolves would elect to do the same once? Especially given the position it's put Kuru in - you seem to trust him implicitly without really questioning it, based purely on "well, he claimed to have been demoralized".

And I say again, "higher lynching priority"? By my count, most of people who've expressed a preference have put Boro highest on their lists. That's highest lynching priority by default.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

Last edited by Shastanis Althreduin; 11-02-2016 at 04:31 PM. Reason: X'ed with Lal and Lottie
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:32 PM   #254
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
Yes, the idea that a thinking human being would have opinions that they would hold to under peer pressure astonishes me, too.
Not the point. Kuru deliberately misrepresented the number of people that suspect Lalaith and ignored Boro entirely.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:34 PM   #255
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loslote View Post
I still suspect Lalaith, but I would prefer Shasta if other people would be down for that.
I'd be down for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
And I say again, "higher lynching priority"? By my count, most of people who've expressed a preference have put Boro highest on their lists. That's highest lynching priority by default.
I don't want Boro lynched toDAY. I don't advocate that and don't support that.

So, I'm moving to another person that appears frequently on the suspicion lists.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:35 PM   #256
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
Not the point. Kuru deliberately misrepresented the number of people that suspect Lalaith and ignored Boro entirely.
You're getting so divorced from reality that it is almost to the point of not being worth responding to you.

Also, see my previous post.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:37 PM   #257
Lalaith
Blithe Spirit
 
Lalaith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,744
Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Quote:
f all three of Legate, Kuru, and I are out of the running for the lynch toDay, then that leaves only four people - Lommy, Lalaith, Boro, and Shasta. We have between three and two wolves in those four people, depending on Zil's alignment. The chances of us hitting a wolf are really very good so long as we stick to only these four people. If we suddenly expand that to include Legate and Kuru, then our chances go way down. So I'm very suspicious of the people trying to cast suspicion on either of those two - yesterDay it was mostly on Legate, toDay it seems to mostly be on Kuru, but both Days the suspicion was flaky and unsubstantiated.
But Lottie, what if your supposition was wrong? You are powerful as a known innocent, and you have got yourself into an alliance with two people that you assume are also innocent. If other people point out that they don't take these assumptions at face value and would like them examined and challenged, that doesn't mean that these people are by default guilty.
__________________
Out went the candle, and we were left darkling
Lalaith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:37 PM   #258
Loslote
The Werewolf's Companion
 
Loslote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enceladus
Posts: 2,581
Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Send a message via Yahoo to Loslote Send a message via Skype™ to Loslote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
I've already explained why that vote doesn't actually mean much other than looking good.
That's all well and good, but it does mean something. I wanted to lynch Lalaith, and it was your half vote against Zil that broke the tie and caused me to lynch Zil. Votes do matter, even if they are not built on a foundation of strong suspicion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lalaith View Post
I still can't keep from wondering, why did Nerwen die and not Kuru?
Actually, of all the confusing things about this game, this one doesn't surprise me. When Nerwen died, the loss of one innocent wasn't that big a blow - and there was some doubt that it was a genuine despair (my fault, admittedly). Maybe the Herbalist wouldn't have wanted to potentially waste a heal on someone who they weren't sure about, or maybe they wanted to save it for a time when it would help the village more. If Kuru had died, we would potentially have been in a 3-3 split between innocents and wolves - and the Herbalist didn't even know who I'd chosen to have lynched! I would have saved him, too. Saving Kuru helped the village much, much more than saving Nerwen would have, just because of the timing alone.

Edit: xed with everyone since my last
__________________
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night.
Double Fenris
Loslote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:38 PM   #259
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuruharan View Post
You're getting so divorced from reality that it is almost to the point of not being worth responding to you.

Also, see my previous post.
I was doing you the courtesy of assuming you had the ability of going back and reading what people have said today, but perhaps I was expecting too much. Here, let me collate that information for you - there were two people that suspected Lalaith the most and three that suspected Boro the most.

In any case, I'm about done with you myself.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:38 PM   #260
Legate of Amon Lanc
A Voice That Gainsayeth
 
Legate of Amon Lanc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,139
Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.
Ugh. What a mess. I must say I could probably spend several pages analysing how Kuru and Shasta are overreacting to each other, but for the moment, let me say one thing - I am currently starting to think much worse about Shasta again. It isn't that I can't see the response to an attack like Kuru's to be adequate, but the tone strikes me as overly defensive. Plus thinking about Shasta in the "big picture" again, what Lottie said about the WWs needing to misdirect things sort of makes sense.

Gotta think. I am still around for a short time.

EDIT: x-ed with about four last posts
__________________
"But it is not your own Shire," said Gildor. "Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out."
Legate of Amon Lanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:39 PM   #261
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Just as an aside, I'm beginning to think the reason for this tirade is that the wolves are all effectively caught by the tail, fear the handwriting is on the wall and are trying desperate measures.

Makes me feel better about Inzil's guilt actually. I'm not sure wolves would launch themselves like this if three of them were left.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:40 PM   #262
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
That's all well and good, but it does mean something. I wanted to lynch Lalaith, and it was your half vote against Zil that broke the tie and caused me to lynch Zil. Votes do matter, even if they are not built on a foundation of strong suspicion.
That's not my argument. My point is - Kuru may have voted Lalaith, but he did it at a time when he could have expected the votes to be tied (as, indeed, they were), and he set himself up with his comments on Inzil to look like he supported the lynch either way it went.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:41 PM   #263
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
I was doing you the courtesy of assuming you had the ability of going back and reading what people have said today, but perhaps I was expecting too much. Here, let me collate that information for you - there were two people that suspected Lalaith the most and three that suspected Boro the most.
And, again, I don't want to lynch Boro toDAY, I'm not convinced he is guilty, so I won't advocate for that so I offer up somebody else on the suspicion list for consideration.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:48 PM   #264
Loslote
The Werewolf's Companion
 
Loslote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enceladus
Posts: 2,581
Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Send a message via Yahoo to Loslote Send a message via Skype™ to Loslote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
Lottie, do me a favor here - really look at what I'm saying. We elected to no-lynch for two days in a row - is it really that far-fetched that the wolves would elect to do the same once? Especially given the position it's put Kuru in - you seem to trust him implicitly without really questioning it, based purely on "well, he claimed to have been demoralized".
Incorrect. When Kuru claimed to be demoralized, I seriously considered if he was lying, and then I decided that he didn't have enough motivation to merit that play. I trusted him before he claimed to be demoralized, as did, I think, most of the people around that Day (at least that's the impression I had the Day before he was targeted). He gained no trust from the village because of his claim, and in fact, threw himself further into the spotlight than he had been before. That wouldn't have been a good move for a wolf in the position he had been in when he would have had to make that decision.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shastanis Althreduin View Post
Not the point. Kuru deliberately misrepresented the number of people that suspect Lalaith and ignored Boro entirely.
...wow. Deliberately misrepresented? There are seven of us, the difference between 'many' and 'few' is exactly one person. I think you are too caught up in trying to see a Kuruwolf that you're seeing fur where there is none.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lalaith View Post
But Lottie, what if your supposition was wrong? You are powerful as a known innocent, and you have got yourself into an alliance with two people that you assume are also innocent. If other people point out that they don't take these assumptions at face value and would like them examined and challenged, that doesn't mean that these people are by default guilty.
I could always be wrong! You could be wrong about me! At a certain point, some things have to be believed, or else you have nothing to go on whatsoever! I trust Legate because he has been level-headed and suggested great ideas that kept the village as safe as possible all game. I trust Kuru because he has been level-headed and willing to engage in open discussion about the game and his suspicions the whole game. Legate and Kuru played smart and stayed active, and they went out of their way to come up with ideas that would seriously hurt the wolves' chances when there was no need to do that, and that is why I trust them.

Edit: xed with everyone since my last
__________________
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night.
Double Fenris
Loslote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:56 PM   #265
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Fine. I think two of our wolves are Kuru and Boro, but I'm not going to sit here and continue beating my head against a wall. I'll be back a bit before deadline.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 04:58 PM   #266
Lalaith
Blithe Spirit
 
Lalaith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,744
Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Anyway this is all feeling very claustrophobic, half the village aren't even here and it's nearly voting time and certainly v close to my RL bedtime.
++Loslote but please look outside the box...
__________________
Out went the candle, and we were left darkling
Lalaith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:08 PM   #267
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

I'm very interested to hear Lommy's perspective on things if she is around and reading.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:11 PM   #268
Loslote
The Werewolf's Companion
 
Loslote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enceladus
Posts: 2,581
Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Loslote is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Send a message via Yahoo to Loslote Send a message via Skype™ to Loslote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuruharan View Post
I'm very interested to hear Lommy's perspective on things if she is around and reading.
Agreed - and Boro's, preferably. I thought Lalaith's summary of the situation:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lalaith View Post
Anyway this is all feeling very claustrophobic, half the village aren't even here and it's nearly voting time and certainly v close to my RL bedtime.
++Loslote but please look outside the box...
felt very genuine and more like an innocent than a wolf, which makes me feel better about her (and, therefore, makes me question Boro and Lommy a little bit more).
__________________
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night.
Double Fenris
Loslote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:16 PM   #269
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loslote View Post
and Boro's, preferably.
Yes, I would like to see Boro weigh in.

Unfortunately, I think his post earlier today strongly implied that he wouldn't be back. I hope he comes back, though.

Kind of makes him a bit of a convenient target, no?
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:23 PM   #270
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots My thinking at the moment

I figure I may as well post this now since the DAY is wrapping up.

I think Lottie is right on the money when she says that the wolves decided that they had to make a big push and try to tear down the likely innocents. Legate's tactic of non-lynching, even though we had to leave it, definitely put them in a bind. And note (as Lottie did) that the target yesterDAY, seemed to be Legate. Quite possibly because they were operating off of Shasta's belief that the Herbalist only had one heal in total, had used it, and that I was doomed.

That didn't work for them. I was saved and here I am.

This, and the things that have happened today, make me feel more confident than I had felt before that Inzil was, in fact, guilty. The numbers tell me that the wolves wouldn't have felt the need to launch themselves at me so strongly toDAY if there were three of them.

I still feel quite strongly that Lalaith is guilty as she was one of the attempted underminers of Legate yesterDAY and is one of them of me toDAY. However, I will admit that she hasn't been so strong on it.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:26 PM   #271
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

And by "strong on it," since my words are being parsed to utter pieces, I mean she hasn't seemed to be attempting to undermine me toDAY as strong as she was trying to undermine Legate yesterDAY.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:27 PM   #272
Thinlómien
Shady She-Penguin
 
Thinlómien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In a far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,958
Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Send a message via Skype™ to Thinlómien
Well, I don't have a perspective really.

The whole Shasta-Kuru spat is leaving a bad taste in my mouth, like I'd rather focus on something else entirely toDay. I'm well aware I don't probably have that luxury. Besides, maybe it's exactly what one or both of them wanted - have such a prolonged fight that wears out the other villagers, I think we've all seen those before.

Anyway, I'm still 80-90% sure Kuru is innocent.

Shasta? Could be either way, but leaning guilty. Like Lottie said, he seems to be playing an entirely different game than the rest of us which either means 1) he is a wolf or 2) he isn't a wolf because no one else seems to be sharing his bizarre perspective and if it was just a wolvish perspective maybe there would be more support for it (unless his fellows were McCaber and Inzil, which ould explain the borderline desperation).

Others? I'm still worried and frustrated by Boro and I'm just saying that if he wins this game as a wolf it's plain unfair. It would make sense to wait for him to appear and contribute, but I'm not sure he's going to (be able to) do that.

Lalaith and Legate still look pretty innocent to me, but I'm aware there's a fairly high probability at least one of them is a wolf. If Lottie is a wolf, hats off for an insane bold strategy that I'm unable to decipher.

For lynch, I would support either Shasta or Boro.


edit: xed with the three Kurus
__________________
Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer
Blood is running deep, some things never sleep
Double Fenris
Thinlómien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:27 PM   #273
Boromir88
Laconic Loreman
 
Boromir88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 7,002
Boromir88 is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Boromir88 is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Boromir88 is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Boromir88 is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Boromir88 is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Send a message via AIM to Boromir88 Send a message via MSN to Boromir88
Remember when I said this back in #191 (everyone should be able to, not like I've done much of anything):

Quote:
I wouldn't be throwing any parties. I'm likely to be pretty useless for as long as I'm still around, just a tired soul who's going to be an body for the cold stone tomb whenever the conspirators get into a sticky spot. (I see it's kinda started to happen).

But rest assured I won't go out THAT way (mod-firing). The conspirators will have to stick their necks out if they want me gone...I just can't see (nor should anyone expect) myself doing anything to make them want to get rid of me this time. :/
I figured out early on, I wasn't going to be able to do much good in terms of contributing suspicions/ideas/strategy, but I was not going out via mod-fire. I could at least fulfill my civilian obligation and in that way make the conspirators work to convince the rep and innocents into getting rid of me.

I won't blame the rep (assuming it's going to be Lottie tonight), if the will of the people says I should go. My lack of activity isn't a choice. I never choose to be unhelpful (even as a baddie I try to at least appear helpful). I'm helping to the best of my abilities right now...by assuring I wasn't going out from a mod-fire, I would at least make the conspirators waste a day on me.
__________________
I used to be for flip-flopping. Now I'm against it.

Fenris Penguin
Boromir88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:27 PM   #274
Legate of Amon Lanc
A Voice That Gainsayeth
 
Legate of Amon Lanc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,139
Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loslote View Post
Agreed - and Boro's, preferably.
I am pretty much convinced he's not coming back.

Anyway. I am sorta looking forward to see Lommy post (I would expect her to do so in a few minutes), then also based on that, I think I will just vote and then go to sleep.

EDIT: look at that. I was wrong. (x-ed with Boro and Lommy)
__________________
"But it is not your own Shire," said Gildor. "Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out."

Last edited by Legate of Amon Lanc; 11-02-2016 at 05:31 PM.
Legate of Amon Lanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:32 PM   #275
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thinlómien View Post
edit: xed with the three Kurus
Sorry.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:37 PM   #276
Thinlómien
Shady She-Penguin
 
Thinlómien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In a far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,958
Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Thinlómien is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Send a message via Skype™ to Thinlómien
++Lottie for rep

I'm glad Boro's back, but his apologetic manner really rubs me the wrong way. I mean, missing most of the game is reason enough for an apology but the tone just felt off to me.

I'll be off for a sec and then back for a teeny bit before I go to sleep.


edit: xed with Kuru who shouldn't apologise for actually talking in a quieter than usual village
__________________
Like the stars chase the sun, over the glowing hill I will conquer
Blood is running deep, some things never sleep
Double Fenris
Thinlómien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:45 PM   #277
Kuruharan
Regal Dwarven Shade
 
Kuruharan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: A Remote Dwarven Hold
Posts: 3,531
Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.Kuruharan is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Boots Nailing my colors to the mast

++Lottie for Rep

My vote is ++Shasta.

Frankly, I'm convinced that either Shasta or Lalaith will work as I think they are both wolves. And no that is not waffling.

Please do not lynch Boro toNIGHT because the probabilities on him being a wolf are not as strong. I fear the tide will turn strongly against the Ward if we lynch incorrectly toNIGHT so we need to go with the highest probabilities.

EDIT: I keep on forgetting to put pluses on my votes for rep for some reason.
Kuruharan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:46 PM   #278
Lalaith
Blithe Spirit
 
Lalaith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,744
Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Lalaith is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Is it just me being tired or did Boro's post say some really quite strange things just now?
Well I'm going to sleep and don't really know who to defintively suggest for lynching.
__________________
Out went the candle, and we were left darkling
Lalaith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:46 PM   #279
Legate of Amon Lanc
A Voice That Gainsayeth
 
Legate of Amon Lanc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,139
Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.Legate of Amon Lanc has passed beneath the Argonath.
Okay okay, so after this... well. I guess super-meta-rethinking probably does not make sense at this point.

I think it does not make sense to lynch Boro in the light of what he just said, if we look at it from the general perspective.

I would, therefore, be probably okay with lynching Shasta toDay. What just worries me is that there seems to be such a nice consensus (meaning also Lommy now). In other words, yes, I would be much happier if the only people who agreed on it were the "known innocents", because everything else might mean a Wolf merrily contributing to lynching somebody else. But who knows.

EDIT: x-ed with Lommy, Kuru and Lalaith
__________________
"But it is not your own Shire," said Gildor. "Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out."
Legate of Amon Lanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2016, 05:48 PM   #280
Shastanis Althreduin
Werewolf Psychic
 
Shastanis Althreduin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In fire, water, earth, and air. But mostly water.
Posts: 2,590
Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Shastanis Althreduin is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
For what good it may do me at this point, I still think Inzil was innocent. My views on Kuru and Boro haven't changed, either - I'll point out that someone can be inactive as a wolf as much as they can be inactive as an innocent, whether or not that inactivity was a choice (sorry, Boro).

I think Lalaith and Legate are innocent. Lottie obviously so. Makes the last wolf Lommy by process of elimination. It'll be cool to see if I'm right at the end regardless of Lottie's choice today.

Good night.
__________________
Shasta– ... However, if he's innocent his famous clairvoyant powers must be taking the week off. Meanwhile, the Night-kills have been awfully effective– almost like we're dealing with a psychic wolf... - Nerwen, WW LXXV

Last edited by Shastanis Althreduin; 11-02-2016 at 05:49 PM. Reason: X'ed with Kuru, Lal, and Legate
Shastanis Althreduin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:47 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.