The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum


Visit The *EVEN NEWER* Barrow-Downs Photo Page

Go Back   The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum > Middle-Earth Discussions > The Movies
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-10-2009, 07:07 PM   #1
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420! Why was Merry at the last battle?

ok in the rotk movie why is Merry at the last battle? i mean he was at the house of healers because he had stabbed the witch king so he got that black death stuff or what you-may-call it ooh and i don't remember Aragorn killing the mouth of sauron whats with that?

Last edited by thewichtking; 01-10-2009 at 07:57 PM. Reason: misspell
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2009, 07:55 PM   #2
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420!

please post i want answers
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2009, 08:02 PM   #3
Inziladun
Gruesome Spectre
 
Inziladun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Heaven's doorstep
Posts: 8,058
Inziladun is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Inziladun is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Inziladun is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Inziladun is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Inziladun is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Personally, I've only viewed the movies once (one time too many), and that several years ago, so I really can't help you.
This thread does, however, seemingly belong in the forum curiously titled "The Movies".
__________________
Music alone proves the existence of God.
Inziladun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2009, 10:32 PM   #4
the phantom
Beloved Shadow
 
the phantom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: The Stadium
Posts: 6,121
the phantom is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.the phantom is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.the phantom is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Send a message via MSN to the phantom
Eye

Ha ha ha!
__________________
the phantom has posted.
This thread is now important.
the phantom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 05:57 AM   #5
Eomer of the Rohirrim
Auspicious Wraith
 
Eomer of the Rohirrim's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 4,992
Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Shield

The answer is: hobbits and villain-decapitation are cool.

__________________
Los Ingobernables de Harlond
Eomer of the Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 07:18 AM   #6
Estelyn Telcontar
Princess of Skwerlz
 
Estelyn Telcontar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: where the Sea is eastwards (WtR: 6060 miles)
Posts: 7,645
Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!Estelyn Telcontar has reached the Cracks of Doom and destroyed the Ring!
This is a movie topic, so I'm moving the thread to the appropriate forum. Please continue reading and discussing there - thanks!
__________________
'Mercy!' cried Gandalf. 'If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more do you want to know?' 'The whole history of Middle-earth...'
Estelyn Telcontar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 08:08 AM   #7
Vaine
Haunting Spirit
 
Vaine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Norway
Posts: 67
Vaine has just left Hobbiton.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thewichtking View Post
ok in the rotk movie why is Merry at the last battle? i mean he was at the house of healers because he had stabbed the witch king so he got that black death stuff or what you-may-call it ooh and i don't remember Aragorn killing the mouth of sauron whats with that?
Because it was in the manusscript.

Peter Jackson changed alot of things that was or wasn't in the book, and thats usually the way the story goes with movies based on books.
Vaine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 08:34 AM   #8
The Might
Guard of the Citadel
 
The Might's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxon
Posts: 2,287
The Might is a guest at the Prancing Pony.The Might is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Probably he did not want to split up the Merry-Pippin duo, just as Sam-Frodo. They had just found each other after the battle at Minas Tirith and PJ wasn't going to separate them again.
__________________
“The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike.”
Delos B. McKown
The Might is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 08:39 AM   #9
alatar
Doubting Dwimmerlaik
 
alatar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Heaven's basement
Posts: 2,499
alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
I'm surprised *anyone* was left of of the last battle. I think, however, the reason to include Merry was to use his tie to Pippin to evoke yet more emotion...oh my, these two are such friends and what if they were to die? sniff

And no one but Merry would give a pip if Pip were lost...
__________________
There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.
alatar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 10:41 AM   #10
Lariren Shadow
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Lariren Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Where the day meets the night
Posts: 607
Lariren Shadow is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Send a message via AIM to Lariren Shadow Send a message via MSN to Lariren Shadow
Part of the reason why Merry was there could also be to centralize the hobbit emotion. Keep Merry and Pippin together so that way there is no random panning to The Houses of Healing, which, actually, weren't in the original theatrical release. It's hard to have a main character in a place that doesn't really exist to movie goers.

As for Aragorn(which I now have to look at to make sure its spelled right, damn Tudor history) beheading the Mouth of Sauron, he needed to die. Who else better to kill him than Aragorn? Plus, as it has been said, it's the movie, it looks good.
__________________
Choose treachery, its more fun!
Lariren Shadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 10:59 AM   #11
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Estelyn Telcontar View Post
This is a movie topic, so I'm moving the thread to the appropriate forum. Please continue reading and discussing there - thanks!
thank you

Last edited by thewichtking; 01-11-2009 at 11:27 AM.
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 11:37 AM   #12
Gordis
Shade of Carn Dűm
 
Gordis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Minas Morgul
Posts: 431
Gordis is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lariren Shadow View Post
As for Aragorn(which I now have to look at to make sure its spelled right, damn Tudor history) beheading the Mouth of Sauron, he needed to die. Who else better to kill him than Aragorn? Plus, as it has been said, it's the movie, it looks good.
Sorry... but it looks AWFUL. It was during the PARLEY, for Christ's sake! If you kill an enemy ambassador during a parley, then you are no better then an Orc. In fact, you are worse. Even Orcs knew the rules, see what they cried to Aragorn when he stood above the gates in Helm's Deep:
Quote:
'Get down or we will shoot you from the wall,' they cried. 'This is no parley. You have nothing to say.'-LOTR, Helm's Deep
In the Books, the Mouth came forth, secure in his belief in Gondor's honor. And he was not mistaken:
Quote:
‘I am a herald and ambassador, and may not be assailed!’ he cried.
‘Where such laws hold,’ said Gandalf, ‘it is also the custom for ambassadors to use less insolence. But no one has threatened you. You have naught to fear from us, until your errand is done- LOTR, The Black Gate opens.
The Movie Mouth was a naive guy, trusting the wannabe King (who only won the crown by bringing the green jelley to the Plennor) and the ragtag wizard (who so dearly loved to beat mad Denethor on the head with his staff). No wonder the Mouth got his head chopped off in the most treacherous fashion.
Gordis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 11:54 AM   #13
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordis View Post
Sorry... but it looks AWFUL. It was during the PARLEY, for Christ's sake! If you kill an enemy ambassador during a parley, then you are no better then an Orc. In fact, you are worse. Even Orcs knew the rules, see what they cried to Aragorn when he stood above the gates in Helm's Deep:


In the Books, the Mouth came forth, secure in his belief in Gondor's honor. And he was not mistaken:


The Movie Mouth was a naive guy, trusting the wannabe King (who only won the crown by bringing the green jelley to the Plennor) and the ragtag wizard (who so dearly loved to beat mad Denethor on the head with his staff). No wonder the Mouth got his head chopped off in the most treacherous fashion.
thats true and kinda funny
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 02:45 PM   #14
Beregond
Playful Ghoul
 
Beregond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,257
Beregond is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordis View Post
Sorry... but it looks AWFUL. It was during the PARLEY, for Christ's sake! If you kill an enemy ambassador during a parley, then you are no better then an Orc. In fact, you are worse. Even Orcs knew the rules, see what they cried to Aragorn when he stood above the gates in Helm's Deep:
Oh no, don't get me started. That's one of those incomprehensible scenes that make no sense in any dimension or reality. Aragorn loses all credibility right there. Like you said, Gordis, he becomes no better than the enemy. Certainly the history of war is rife with trickery and deceit, but this is ARAGORN, not Ulfang the Accursed, and killing the Tooth Decay of Sauron accomplishes nothing! Was PJ hoping the rabble would appreciate the death of one such horrible being, regardless of method? Have we sunk so low as a society that honour is meaningless? Maybe.
__________________
"Hope and memory shall live still in some hidden valley where the grass is green."

Last edited by Beregond; 01-11-2009 at 02:49 PM.
Beregond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2009, 05:02 PM   #15
Eomer of the Rohirrim
Auspicious Wraith
 
Eomer of the Rohirrim's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 4,992
Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Shield

Did people whoop and holler when the head flew off? Then that's all there is to it. I don't want the film to be compromised for such people, but it's not about what I want - it's about how ridiculously successful the films were. Yes, many subtleties were lost in this version, but you had to expect that.
__________________
Los Ingobernables de Harlond
Eomer of the Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 05:14 AM   #16
Lush
Fair and Cold
 
Lush's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: the big onion
Posts: 1,803
Lush is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Send a message via ICQ to Lush Send a message via AIM to Lush Send a message via Yahoo to Lush
Pipe

Well, they really took the whole "we captured and tortured Frodo" thing and laid it out there, hence giving Aragorn a reason to lose his temper (and he is very different from the book Aragorn, of course). Not a very great or convincing reason, because even the movie Aragorn was more restrained and thoughtful than that, but it worked visually, Eomer is right. And the Mouth wasn't really a guy, was he? He seemed more like a reanimated corpse - a direct extension of Sauron.

I personally didn't how he spoke with a very obvious foreign accent - Middle Eastern, was it? Guess I'm just sick of the "dark, barbaric foreigner" meme. Coupled with the "men of the West line," complete with terrible delivery from Viggo (an excellent Strider, imho, and a pretty bad King), it was just so blatant, there was no nuance. And I'm as big of a fan of dark, Other-izing tales as... um, other people?
__________________
~The beginning is the word and the end is silence. And in between are all the stories. This is one of mine~
Lush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 08:46 AM   #17
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420!

i always thought the mouth of sauron was a sorcerer in the service of sauron who came over from the east many, many years ago and honesty i don't Viggo um um i don't remember his last name right now you know who i'm talking about. anyway i dont think he did a good aragorn
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 01:01 PM   #18
Morthoron
Curmudgeonly Wordwraith
 
Morthoron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ensconced in curmudgeonly pursuits
Posts: 2,528
Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lush View Post
And the Mouth wasn't really a guy, was he? He seemed more like a reanimated corpse - a direct extension of Sauron.

I personally didn't how he spoke with a very obvious foreign accent - Middle Eastern, was it? Guess I'm just sick of the "dark, barbaric foreigner" meme. Coupled with the "men of the West line," complete with terrible delivery from Viggo (an excellent Strider, imho, and a pretty bad King), it was just so blatant, there was no nuance. And I'm as big of a fan of dark, Other-izing tales as... um, other people?
Actually, the Mouth of Sauron was a man, and a Black Numenorean at that, so his accent should have been Aussie like Faramir and Denethor.
__________________
And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision.
Morthoron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 05:13 PM   #19
Lush
Fair and Cold
 
Lush's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: the big onion
Posts: 1,803
Lush is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Send a message via ICQ to Lush Send a message via AIM to Lush Send a message via Yahoo to Lush
Pipe

The way they presented him the movies - there was just no context. He was a monster. And a scary one at that.
__________________
~The beginning is the word and the end is silence. And in between are all the stories. This is one of mine~
Lush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 09:03 PM   #20
Lindale
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Lindale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: midway upon... in a forest dark
Posts: 981
Lindale has just left Hobbiton.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lush View Post
The way they presented him the movies - there was just no context. He was a monster. And a scary one at that.
Compare it with Orlando Bloom Legolas. When the first movie was shown I was in my sixth grade in an all-girl school. Everybody was just... crazy for that. And I found myself suddenly flocked by questions on what Legolas is supposed to be.

It's the movies, and... it's commercialized.
__________________
The heart does things for reasons Reason itself cannot comprehend. - Blaise Pascal

Legal Madness.
Lindale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2009, 09:40 PM   #21
Beregond
Playful Ghoul
 
Beregond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,257
Beregond is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Orlando Bloom may have done more (both good and bad) for the popularity of The Lord of the Rings movie, book, and franchise, than anyone else.
__________________
"Hope and memory shall live still in some hidden valley where the grass is green."
Beregond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2009, 02:45 AM   #22
Lush
Fair and Cold
 
Lush's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: the big onion
Posts: 1,803
Lush is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Send a message via ICQ to Lush Send a message via AIM to Lush Send a message via Yahoo to Lush
Eye

Orlando is my boy. I wasn't a book fan when I went to see the first film, I hadn't gotten around to reading Tolkien at that point, so I was going "whoooo's that?" along with the rest of them. Although, the guy who was explaining everything to me wasn't as traumatized as you with your classmates - I bet. We were in our last year of high school, and he and i did end up seeing each other for a while... Hmmm. Maybe that's where it all began, actually, at that fateful FotR viewing!

Of course, poor Bloom had the worst lines ("a diversion" - I'm still giggling over that years later), which, in a way, is just as bad as the way they set up the Mouth of Sauron.

Or maybe not. The Mouth of Sauron did not provide any visual gratification.
__________________
~The beginning is the word and the end is silence. And in between are all the stories. This is one of mine~
Lush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2009, 09:28 AM   #23
thewichtking
Animated Skeleton
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 44
thewichtking is still gossiping in the Green Dragon.
1420!

where getting of the subject this thread is on merry
thewichtking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2009, 10:05 AM   #24
alatar
Doubting Dwimmerlaik
 
alatar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Heaven's basement
Posts: 2,499
alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.alatar is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thewichtking View Post
where getting of the subject this thread is on merry
Slightly! Think that your thread, thewichtking, has been hijacked. Welcome to the Downs, by the way.

Anyway, in the Extended version of RotK, we get a brief moment in the Houses of Healing - far too little for me. Merry is no where to be seen, and so why he's not in the vanguard would be a mystery. For example, who would he speak with regarding 'those that have gone east to meet their Doom?' The healers? The Herbmaster? Ioreth?

Eowyn gets a moment with Faramir, and Merry would be a third wheel in that scene.

And so Merry is sent east.
__________________
There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.
alatar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2009, 10:06 AM   #25
Morthoron
Curmudgeonly Wordwraith
 
Morthoron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ensconced in curmudgeonly pursuits
Posts: 2,528
Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.Morthoron is a guest of Galadriel in Lothlórien.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thewichtking View Post
where getting of the subject this thread is on merry
This is one of the hallmarks of discussion threads on the 'Downs. A very standard occurrence, actually. When the original discussion has run its course (and what more can be said of Merry being plopped indecorously down at the Black Gates on the whim of an egoistic director?), the discussion digresses into tangents.

Don't worry, it'll come around again. It sometimes takes four or five years, but someone will post on the original topic again.
__________________
And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision.
Morthoron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2012, 10:15 AM   #26
Eomer of the Rohirrim
Auspicious Wraith
 
Eomer of the Rohirrim's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 4,992
Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.Eomer of the Rohirrim is a guest at the Prancing Pony.
Shield

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morthoron View Post
Don't worry, it'll come around again. It sometimes takes four or five years, but someone will post on the original topic again.
You called?

I think it would be funny if, in an ode to Merry's pointless appearance at the battle of the Black Gate, they got him to show up at the Battle of Five Armies. It would be quirky, you know? Fans would love it.
__________________
Los Ingobernables de Harlond
Eomer of the Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 03:49 PM   #27
Sarumian
Wight
 
Sarumian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 129
Sarumian is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eomer of the Rohirrim View Post
You called?

I think it would be funny if, in an ode to Merry's pointless appearance at the battle of the Black Gate, they got him to show up at the Battle of Five Armies. It would be quirky, you know? Fans would love it.
Why not, but only together with Pip
Sarumian is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:06 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.